Parking lot law problems where I work

[Oh Shoot]

4 hours ago, analog_kidd said:

TN now allows you to carry a loaded pistol in the car without a permit.

TN also says you have to have a permit to keep that loaded pistol in your car in posted lots, school property, or places previously banned by employer policy.

Quote

My question is why is your company requiring you to have a permit, if the state doesn't care?

Because it wants as few people with guns on its property as possible I guess. And like the state, perceives folks with permits to be more responsible than the general gun packer.

- OS

Edited November 13, 2016 by Oh Shoot

[DaveTN]

5 hours ago, analog_kidd said:

TN now allows you to carry a loaded pistol in the car without a permit. My question is why is your company requiring you to have a permit, if the state doesn't care?

Because most of them don’t care about legality; they care about liability. They are the “dep pockets”. If someone gets shot they could spend a fortune defending the company; right or wrong. I wouldn’t think it was a big deal if the state had given them absolute immunity from a lawsuit. But I don’t know that they could even do that. They do what their attorney’s tell them to do.

[JayC]

The simple fact is employees are not a good target for laws like this...  the parking lots bill is meant to allow customers to park and leave their firearm in their vehicle...  

TFA has completely over stepped trying to get HCP holders to be some type of protected class of employee, and has really slowed down the ability of the TFA to push more common sense 2nd amendment reforms here in TN.

If your employer doesn't allow you to carry at your job, let alone leave one in your vehicle without a hassle, they don't care about your safety and IMHO you should look for a better employer...  You make a choice to go to work there everyday and make them money, exercise your freedom to find another job with an employer that trust you to protect yourself.  If you choose not to, then it's your own fault IMHO.

We really need to focus on areas we can't carry where there is no other choice.  School's, Colleges, Government buildings, Courthouses etc.  These places should never prevent a law abiding citizen from being able to carry on the property because we're unable to exercise our freedom of association when dealing with the government.

Again, we have a republican controlled legislature, a single signature on a letter could open up the State Capital to carry, why won't Speaker Haswell sign that document?!?!?

[LagerHead]

On 11/2/2016 at 10:07 PM, up2snuff said:

50-1-312.
((1)(A) No employer shall discharge or take any adverse employment action against an employee solely for transporting or storing a firearm or firearm ammunition in an employer parking area in a manner consistent with 39-17-1313(a).


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I've been out of the loop for a while largely due to the election. When did this change?

[up2snuff]

I've been out of the loop for a while largely due to the election. When did this change?

I believed it went into effect last summer.


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[Oh Shoot]

2 hours ago, up2snuff said:

I believed it went into effect last summer.

2015 legislative session. Whole new statute added to the Employer/Employee section of TCA:

 

50-1-312.  Adverse employment action for transporting or storing firearm or ammunition in employer parking area prohibited -- Cause of action.

  (a) For the purposes of this section:

   (1) "Employee" means a natural person who performs services for an employer for valuable consideration and who possesses a valid handgun carry permit recognized in this state; and

   (2) "Employer" means a person, association, or legal or commercial entity receiving services from an employee and, in return, giving compensation of any kind to the employee.

(b)  (1)  (A) No employer shall discharge or take any adverse employment action against an employee solely for transporting or storing a firearm or firearm ammunition in an employer parking area in a manner consistent with § 39-17-1313(a).

      (B) An employee discharged, or subject to an adverse employment action, in violation of subdivision (b)(1)(A) shall have a cause of action against the employer to enjoin future acts in violation of this section and to recover economic damages plus reasonable attorney fees and costs.

      (C) Any action brought under this section shall be filed in the chancery or circuit court having jurisdiction in the county where the alleged violation of subdivision (b)(1)(A) occurred.

   (2) In any action brought pursuant to this section, the employee shall have the burden of establishing a prima facie case of discharge, or adverse employment action, based solely on the employee's transporting or storing a firearm or firearm ammunition in the employer's parking area in a manner consistent with § 39-17-1313(a). If the employee satisfies this burden, the burden shall then be on the employer to produce evidence that one (1) or more legitimate reasons existed for the employee's discharge or adverse employment action. The burden on the employer is one of production and not persuasion. If the employer produces such evidence, the presumption of discharge, or adverse employment action, raised by the employee's prima facie case is rebutted, and the burden shifts to the employee to demonstrate that the reason given by the employer was not the true reason for the employee's discharge, or adverse employment action, and that the stated reason was a pretext for discharge or adverse employment action. The allocations of burdens of proof set out in this subdivision (b)(2) shall apply at all stages of the proceedings, including motions for summary judgment. The employee at all times retains the burden of persuading the trier of fact that the employee has been the victim of discharge, or adverse employment action, based solely on the employee's adherence with § 39-17-1313(a).

   (3) The employee has one (1) year from the date of termination of employment, or the date of adverse employment action, to file an action pursuant to this section.

(c) The presence of a firearm or ammunition within an employer's parking area in accordance with § 39-17-1313 does not by itself constitute a failure by the employer to provide a safe workplace.

(d) Except as otherwise provided in § 39-17-1313 for parking areas, nothing in this section shall be construed as prohibiting an employer from prohibiting firearms or firearm ammunition on the premises of the employer.
 

[up2snuff]

2015 legislative session. Whole new statute added to the Employer/Employee section of TCA:
 
50-1-312.  Adverse employment action for transporting or storing firearm or ammunition in employer parking area prohibited -- Cause of action.

  (a) For the purposes of this section:

   (1) "Employee" means a natural person who performs services for an employer for valuable consideration and who possesses a valid handgun carry permit recognized in this state; and

   (2) "Employer" means a person, association, or legal or commercial entity receiving services from an employee and, in return, giving compensation of any kind to the employee.

(  (1)  (A) No employer shall discharge or take any adverse employment action against an employee solely for transporting or storing a firearm or firearm ammunition in an employer parking area in a manner consistent with § 39-17-1313(a).

      ( An employee discharged, or subject to an adverse employment action, in violation of subdivision ((1)(A) shall have a cause of action against the employer to enjoin future acts in violation of this section and to recover economic damages plus reasonable attorney fees and costs.

      © Any action brought under this section shall be filed in the chancery or circuit court having jurisdiction in the county where the alleged violation of subdivision ((1)(A) occurred.

   (2) In any action brought pursuant to this section, the employee shall have the burden of establishing a prima facie case of discharge, or adverse employment action, based solely on the employee's transporting or storing a firearm or firearm ammunition in the employer's parking area in a manner consistent with § 39-17-1313(a). If the employee satisfies this burden, the burden shall then be on the employer to produce evidence that one (1) or more legitimate reasons existed for the employee's discharge or adverse employment action. The burden on the employer is one of production and not persuasion. If the employer produces such evidence, the presumption of discharge, or adverse employment action, raised by the employee's prima facie case is rebutted, and the burden shifts to the employee to demonstrate that the reason given by the employer was not the true reason for the employee's discharge, or adverse employment action, and that the stated reason was a pretext for discharge or adverse employment action. The allocations of burdens of proof set out in this subdivision ((2) shall apply at all stages of the proceedings, including motions for summary judgment. The employee at all times retains the burden of persuading the trier of fact that the employee has been the victim of discharge, or adverse employment action, based solely on the employee's adherence with § 39-17-1313(a).

   (3) The employee has one (1) year from the date of termination of employment, or the date of adverse employment action, to file an action pursuant to this section.

© The presence of a firearm or ammunition within an employer's parking area in accordance with § 39-17-1313 does not by itself constitute a failure by the employer to provide a safe workplace.

(d) Except as otherwise provided in § 39-17-1313 for parking areas, nothing in this section shall be construed as prohibiting an employer from prohibiting firearms or firearm ammunition on the premises of the employer.
 

That is great info. Thanks for the update.


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[300winmag]

JayC,

I agree with you that too much time has been spent on getting into the employer-employee relationship (a civil issue when it comes to weapons) VS improving the criminal weapons statutes to favor those with handgun carry permits.

There is no reason that people in Mississippi can get what they call an enhanced license that is basically the same as ours and be legal just about anywhere including K-12 schools while we risk felony charges for carrying on K-12 and university property.  Someone should not risk a misdemeanor weapons charge over a 'no gun' sign either when they visit someone at a hospital, do business at a local government building, or help someone get luggage out of the airport terminal.

With a republican super majority and republican governor, these guys need to earn their NRA A ratings and have no excuse for not fixing these problems than can snag good folks.

[JayC]

23 hours ago, 300winmag said:

JayC,

I agree with you that too much time has been spent on getting into the employer-employee relationship (a civil issue when it comes to weapons) VS improving the criminal weapons statutes to favor those with handgun carry permits.

There is no reason that people in Mississippi can get what they call an enhanced license that is basically the same as ours and be legal just about anywhere including K-12 schools while we risk felony charges for carrying on K-12 and university property.  Someone should not risk a misdemeanor weapons charge over a 'no gun' sign either when they visit someone at a hospital, do business at a local government building, or help someone get luggage out of the airport terminal.

With a republican super majority and republican governor, these guys need to earn their NRA A ratings and have no excuse for not fixing these problems than can snag good folks.

Primary Beth Harwell, and the problem goes away.  We don't need the seat to stay Republican either.  She is the primary reason for the logjam...  that and TFA pissing off all the legislators demanding laws that the Chamber is going nuts over.

Remember it's Beth Harwell who refuses to allow firearms inside the State Capital, she on her own with the stroke of a pen (or the next speaker of the house) could allow us to carry within the Capital tomorrow.

[2000silverz28]

Thanks for all the advice   I think I'll just keep my head down and take my chances.  

[mikegideon]

On 11/4/2016 at 10:32 AM, raildog said:

As I read your post I know how you feel the company i work for shows a video about security every year and they talk about the guy who is obsessed with firearms and everyone in the room turns and looks at me funny thing is i have had several tell me if it ever gets real they are all coming find me i tell them I'll be in the parking lot driving to my safe space  ( Waffle House )

Yep. Big bore AR owners are pretty whacked