Parking lot law problems where I work

[2000silverz28]

My company just sent out a revised weapons policy.  Part of it is about the parking lot bill.  It clarifies that we are in fact able to keep a firearm in our car as long as we have a carry permit.  Here's the part I don't like and I need advice on.  They have in the policy that if we want to keep a firearm in our car we must inform the HR department and they will make a copy of our permit.   

Can they legally require us to inform them we have a permit and intend to have a firearm in our car?  Personally I don't think it's any of their business but can I be fired for not complying?

[dralarms]

You can be fired in Tennessee for breathing  wrong.  they don't need an excuse to terminate anyone. that said I'd tell them to pound sand. it's non of their business if you have a hcp or if you have a firearm in you car.

[up2snuff]

50-1-312.
((1)(A) No employer shall discharge or take any adverse employment action against an employee solely for transporting or storing a firearm or firearm ammunition in an employer parking area in a manner consistent with 39-17-1313(a).


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[Oh Shoot]

5 minutes ago, up2snuff said:

50-1-312.
((1)(A) No employer shall discharge or take any adverse employment action against an employee solely for transporting or storing a firearm or firearm ammunition in an employer parking area in a manner consistent with 39-17-1313(a).

Was about to post that.

So, it's really splitting legal hairs one way or the other. Meaning, if you don't register, and they find out and fire you or whatever, did they take action against you for having the gun in the car or simply for breaking company policy.

- OS

[DaveTN]

Could they fire you? Well I would say that would depend on the circumstances surrounding how the firearm became an issue. Firing you for violating their policy of notifying would have to go to court for a ruling.

But I can see why at some companies people would be hesitant to notify; especially since Tennessee is employment at will.

I am fully against the state government’s heavy hand in this as they want to force your employer to recognize a privilege as a right; that they do not recognize. Having said that, maybe you should write to your state politicians to maybe get it addressed.

[TGO David]

Don't ask, don't tell.  They have no legal right to demand a copy of your HCP.  If someone willingly complies, it's because honest people want to be honest.  Which in this case would be dumb.

Do they keep a copy of your driver's license in the event that you want to park a car on their property?

 

 

[nightrunner]

Depends on how straight laced you are.

One of my previous employers was exactly the same as your case. I didn't notify as the general consensus on the shop floor was that if they went to search vehicles, they would simply go get a list from HR of who had guns. Or just one more thing to use against you if they wanted to fire you. 

In actual practice, it was very rare for them to search vehicles, it was a risk to take.

My current employer simply says it has to be secured (in a glovebox or console vs slid under the seat). No notification on file.

 

Remember, the HCP database is public record. They can get the info if they really want it.

They can fire you for no reason at all and breaking company policy would be why. 

 

Its simply a case case of the employer doesn't like it but they have to follow the law so they will make it as hard on you as they can. They are probably making the assumption that since you obeyed the rules and got a permit to carry vs just doing it, you will likely follow the rules and notify the office.

[2.ooohhh]

54 minutes ago, nightrunner said:

Remember, the HCP database is public record. They can get the info if they really want it.

TN HCP records were sealed a few years back. Employers other than law enforcement won't readily have access to it.

http://www.wrcbtv.com/story/21581879/house-passes-bill-to-close-handgun-carry-records

 

[Murgatroy]

Sure, they can't fire you for having a gun in your car. They can fire you for violating company policy by not notifying.

I know this very clearly. I was not fired for having a gun in my car. I was fired for "impeding an instigation."

This was in Kentucky, which has even clearer laws than Tennessee regarding guns in cars. So while not an exact scenario, it is still relevant.

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[jgradyc]

Many years ago, a previous employer had a policy of no guns in the building or parking lot. I just parked in the next building's parking lot and walked an extra hundred feet. 

[Sunfish]

State regulations and statues are useless on property owned by the federal government. TVA will likely arrest and prosecute you and of coarse terminate your employment. So two words to the wise Federal Supercedes

[runco]

I suspect this bolsters the profiling of at risk individuals by Human Resources.

At my work recently, we had to participate and train our own employees on what to do in case of a active shooter.  Run, Hide & Fight.  I think the training was good, long over due, except in the power point training the portion of what to look for in a proactive stance and let management know.   I am still struggling with the profiling, one example of which could include me.  Example, if a work colleague is obsessed with guns, especially military weapons, this person may be at high risk. 

I assume I am on this list.  White, Middle Age, Overweight, Obsessed with guns, and I have a HCP.   I guess I need to cover-up or tear off my TGO sticker on my truck.

 

[raildog]

5 hours ago, runco said:

I suspect this bolsters the profiling of at risk individuals by Human Resources.

At my work recently, we had to participate and train our own employees on what to do in case of a active shooter.  Run, Hide & Fight.  I think the training was good, long over due, except in the power point training the portion of what to look for in a proactive stance and let management know.   I am still struggling with the profiling, one example of which could include me.  Example, if a work colleague is obsessed with guns, especially military weapons, this person may be at high risk. 

I assume I am on this list.  White, Middle Age, Overweight, Obsessed with guns, and I have a HCP.   I guess I need to cover-up or tear off my TGO sticker on my truck.

 

As I read your post I know how you feel the company i work for shows a video about security every year and they talk about the guy who is obsessed with firearms and everyone in the room turns and looks at me funny thing is i have had several tell me if it ever gets real they are all coming find me i tell them I'll be in the parking lot driving to my safe space  ( Waffle House )

Edited November 4, 2016 by raildog

[JohnC]

I'd not show them anything.

 

 

[R_Bert]

Keep your mouth shut.  Keep your head low, and be productive in your job. It is the best that you can do, and even then may not be enough.  As others have indicated, TN employers need *no* reason whatsoever to terminate you.  And... certain select cases exempted... you have *no* recourse. If you go out the door, it is very likely that you are just simply screwed, no matter how right you are...

 

(sound like the voice of experience??)

[JayC]

Play dumb if caught...  'I forgot that was in there'...  'My wife borrowed my car and must have left it'...  No violation of stupid HR policy.  

[Pete123]

I would be surprised if they can do this legally in the state of TN.  My best guess is that if something happen and they fired your for failing to notify them that one of the 2A groups would happily sue them.

[JayC]

13 hours ago, Pete123 said:

I would be surprised if they can do this legally in the state of TN.  My best guess is that if something happen and they fired your for failing to notify them that one of the 2A groups would happily sue them.

I wish that was so, but the TFA has only brought a single legal action involving the parks law, and it's still working it's way through court.  And the NRA doesn't do local stuff normally.

The truth is if they fire you, no matter what state law says, they'll likely get away with it.

[R_Bert]

7 hours ago, JayC said:

I wish that was so, but the TFA has only brought a single legal action involving the parks law, and it's still working it's way through court.  And the NRA doesn't do local stuff normally.

The truth is if they fire you, no matter what state law says, they'll likely get away with it.

TN State employment law is what allows them to do what they do.  The TN gun laws are irrelevant in employment termination issues.

[Oh Shoot]

1 hour ago, R_Bert said:

TN State employment law is what allows them to do what they do.  The TN gun laws are irrelevant in employment termination issues.

Well, a TN gun law does allow you to sue for reparations for the gun in parking lot thing. If you can prove it to court's satisfaction.

- OS

[R_Bert]

3 minutes ago, Oh Shoot said:

Well, a TN gun law does allow you to sue for reparations for the gun in parking lot thing. If you can prove it to court's satisfaction.

- OS

Perhaps, but that will not save your job, nor deter employers.  I do admit my experience with the local circuit court, does bias me.  I effectively got - "you did the right thing, but it doesn't matter" (non-firearms related)

Seriously...TN law is greatly biased in favor of employer.   

[tnhawk]

19 hours ago, JayC said:

I wish that was so, but the TFA has only brought a single legal action involving the parks law, and it's still working it's way through court.  And the NRA doesn't do local stuff normally.

The truth is if they fire you, no matter what state law says, they'll likely get away with it.

I was fired from a contract job for wearing shirt with a picture of a 1911 on it.

[dralarms]

I was fired once because another employee asked me where I stood on the union vote. I was a temp employee and had no horses in that race and told him so and was told I was no longer needed  

[tacops]

I remember when we had "Personnel Departments".  Then corporate minds began to consider the employees as simply "resources" much like another box of legal pads or paper clips, thus the "person and personal considerations" was removed and Voila! we now have "Human Resource" departments.  To me that is very telling as to the mindset of management in regard to employee concerns and well being.

[analog_kidd]

TN now allows you to carry a loaded pistol in the car without a permit. My question is why is your company requiring you to have a permit, if the state doesn't care?