Pay pal

[Guest Verbal Kint]

You're Nigerian?! That explains everything!

[Guest Spuds]

And, likewise, don't show up acting like you are the know-all, end-all, regarding PayPal. You can step down off your soap box now.

Ignorance isn't an excuse. I'm pretty sure you clicked that checkbox, stating you agreed to their TOS, way back when you registered with them. Whether you chose to read it and obey it is on your shoulders. You violated their rules, you got your penis smacked, you're crying about it. It's business.

Who's really at fault here? You. Not PayPal.

End of story.

More like step away from the baseball bat.

Getting sick of people stating their opinion as gospel and then telling me what to do or not to do. Had he stated his opinion and experience, and left it at that. Cool... all is kosher. Him adding his last comment of "Just don't ever tell folks how safe it is". Yeah... well... Houston, we have a problem. Especially when the root of his problem is/was his own ignorance of their TOS.

Lost track of this thread, been out of the loop with illness.

What I stated was my experience, backed up by cut & pasted emails from payscum. It isn't gospel, it's facts -- my experience with these vermin scum. (Vermin scum is my opinion, while I believe it to be fact, I can't prove it other than to relate my experience.) Your not liking it doesn't change things. You can have your own opinion, but not your own facts.

I signed up for payscum way back when they had no such restrictions if I recall correctly. They change their terms from time to time and acceptable use policy too, obviously. You ever get those notices from the bank that issued your Visa that tell you they've amended your terms? I guess you read every word of those and don't just hit the summary or skim it, right? So yeah, in a Philadelphia lawyer sort of way, I violated their TOS. Can you explain why that entitled them to attempt to hornswaggle my 400 Somoans for half a year? How are the two related?

I attempted to add to this discussion by recounting my own experience with payscum. I presented facts (that you don't like) along with my opinion. If all you got in return is to attack me personally, thank you for conceding the argument. YOU LOSE.

Edited December 27, 2008 by Spuds

[Punisher84]

My wife had her information stolen through paypal. That's my reason, but I just hate paying through the internet period.

That's my only addition. Carry on gentlemen.

[Oh Shoot]

My wife had her information stolen through paypal. ...

Almost certainly, she had her information stolen when she responded to a phishing email with a bogus login to the scammer's ip OR her computer could have been compromised via various malware, along with various login information?

- OS

[Guest c.a.s.]

Postal Money Order and Verified Mail < Paypal.

I am no fan of their terms and dissuade using them where possible.

[Guest clownsdd]

Not want to bash or cause a stink and not knowing paypal's policies, just my opinion, but is it not a bit hypocritical to bash carry banned businesses, support 2A, and then support something knowing that, from what I understand from the posts here, is at the least partial anti-gun?

Where is the line drawn?

[Oh Shoot]

Not want to bash or cause a stink and not knowing paypal's policies, just my opinion, but is it not a bit hypocritical to bash carry banned businesses, support 2A, and then support something knowing that, from what I understand from the posts here, is at the least partial anti-gun?

Where is the line drawn?

PP is not anti-gun, anymore than say, Wal-Mart, which doesn't sell firearms in most of their stores anymore.

But I'll bet you still buy ammo from them.

Not to mention that there is no real affordable alternative to using PayPal for many folks. And I can buy/sell lots of firearm related items through PP. Any number of gun-related merchants accept PayPal, notably, a good many holster makers. If there were a viable alternative to PayPal that allowed sale of guns/ammo, I'd use it and probably so would they. But there isn't. Price your own merchant account for credit card processing sometime.

Incidentally, I bought some stuff from CheaperThanDirt not long ago. Sure, they are gouging SOB's. So I didn't buy any of their overpriced items, but did buy some that they were selling cheaper than anyone else.

So, the line for me is drawn somewhere between practicality and tinfoil idealism.

- OS

[Guest c.a.s.]

There is a major difference between Paypal and Walmart. Walmat stopped selling firearms in their shops because they weren't PROFITABLE enough. They simply weren't being purchased enough, but they are still being sold in the stores where they ARE being purchased. Paypal has no such type of rule, an all-across-the-board LOCKDOWN on accounts who purcahse firearms, firearm accessories, KNIVES, and other things that they have arbitrarily designated as prohibited items.

Even if ammo is cheaper at Walmart, I'm still buying at Mike's whenever I can. I do that for a REASON.

[Guest clownsdd]

Thanks for the info on paypal OhShoot..

FYI I haven't been in a wallyworld in years, much less buy anything from them.

[DRM]

PP is not anti-gun, anymore than say, Wal-Mart, which doesn't sell firearms in most of their stores anymore.

How on earth can you say that when their policy is CLEARLY anti-gun?

I know several people who have had their accounts locked and closed for selling gun RELATED items. How on earth you people can claim that is anything but "anti-gun" is beyond me.

Anyway - to keep on topic...

https://www.revolutionmoneyexchange.com/

I've used it a few times - and several of us from another gun related forum have not found anything in their TOS that is even remotely anti-gun, nor have we found anything that comments on restrictions for gun related purchases or transfers.

Just tossing out another option.

Edited December 29, 2008 by DRM

[Oh Shoot]

How on earth can you say that when their policy is CLEARLY anti-gun?

I know several people who have had their accounts locked and closed for selling gun RELATED items. How on earth you people can claim that is anything but "anti-gun" is beyond me....

I see a big difference in policy on what is allowable for money transfer and being "anti-gun". One is a corporate/legal decision and one is a political stand.

They ban a lot of sex related stuff too, but I don't think they are "anti-screwing".

As far as those whose accounts have been locked/closed, PayPal (and eBay's) policy on gun-related items is relatively clearly defined to me. Sell a holster, ok. Sell set of grips, ok. Sell a magazine, SLAP. Sell a receiver, SLAP. Etc. Obviously, if you are a merchant, you need to communicate with them BEFORE the transaction and certainly before putting PayPal Buy It Now buttons on your merchandise.. If individual, simply be careful what you describe the transaction as being.

I'm really NOT defending PayPal. It's just that everyone accuses them of being some leftish 2nd Amendment hating outfit. And it's just not the case. I've said it before, PayPal and eBay are quite amoral and apolitical. If they could get away with it, I'm sure they would be happy to launder drug money from Colombia and AK's for Somolia for the profit.

- OS

[The Average Joe]

I keep half my gun money in PP (the other half in cash).

I get emails from "PayPal" all the time but ignore them for fear they are phishing emails trying to scam me. Which I'm most certain they are...

If PP has a message for me, it'll show up on my PP account when I sign in.

No doubt, PP is the way to go, just be sceptical anytime you get emails about something concerning your money.....same as in everyday life..."trust no one".

I too, take pride in also knowing that when I buy gun related accessories on eBay or with PP, that they are helping to support 2nd Amdmnt rights.

As mentioned...eBay has become outrageous on their insertion and consignment fees.

They've directed themselves from the local "yard saler" to benefitting off the online stores and power sellers. It's just not as much fun to sell on there as it was back in 2000-2002 when I was selling off all my old toys and collectibles.

However shopping is still good (as long as the shipping is reasonable).

I can still find what I can't find at Wally World at Christmas time.

[Fallguy]

As far as getting a suspicious e-mail that you are not sure is from PayPal, you can forward it to spoof@paypal.com They will tell you if it was from them or not. Also if it is not, they say it helps them to track down who sent it by forwarding it to them. So I forward those e-mails even when I know they aren't from PayPal.

[TGO David]

Not want to bash or cause a stink and not knowing paypal's policies, just my opinion, but is it not a bit hypocritical to bash carry banned businesses, support 2A, and then support something knowing that, from what I understand from the posts here, is at the least partial anti-gun?

Where is the line drawn?

Let me be clear about this...

TGO does not "support" PayPal. We use them as a service that makes it convenient for our members to contribute to the site. If a more "gun friendly" alternative were available that provided the same convenience and the same level of service that PayPal does, we would certainly investigate using it.

This whole argument is silly. Those of you who don't wish to use PayPal are more than free to do so. If your dissent is based on a fear of them losing your money or compromising your financial security somehow... that's a matter that is personal to you and involves a decision that only you can make. But if your dissent is based on the notion that they are staunchly anti-gun, you should look closer at what their regulations really are before making a knee jerk decision.

As others have pointed out, they are not anti-gun. They do, however, have restrictions on what may be sold based on the fact that their service crosses countless jurisdictions with conflicting laws. I don't blame them one bit for following the advice of their attorneys and setting the restrictions to the tightest level that provides them maximum legal protection.

My rights as a gun owner end where their rights as a business begin. They are well within their rights to impose whatever restrictions they want. I either accept those terms and use their service in accordance to their bylaws or I sit around and moan about how I won't use Paypal because they aren't as gun friendly as I am. Which of those two is more productive? Which of those two teaches someone a lesson?

That said, this thread is done. The few voices of reason in it have once again been overshadowed by the specter of FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt).