University of Texas officer shot when gun goes off while holstered

[ou812]

hmmmm

[Pete123]

Hmmmmm is a great way to describe it.  He was almost certainly doing something he shouldn't have.

[Jamie Jackson]

The investigation will look into finding out what circumstances surrounded the weapon discharge. It is unknown if he was touching the weapon at the time it went off.

What you wanna bet he was touching the weapon when it went off.

 

I wish the officer a speedy recovery, but this type of statement simply feeds into the anti-gun narrative that "guns just go off killing people"...ie it's the evil tool that's dangerous, not the tool fiddling with the gun...

 

14 years as an officer...Sometimes it's a matter of familiarity breeding complacency...

[Dolomite_supafly]

I bet he was holstering and something made its way into the trigger guard, perhaps even his finger.

[DaveTN]

Well besides him there were two other witnesses there watching. Maybe we will find out the results; maybe not. A mechanical device can fail, and so can a human. So it’s mere speculation at this point. I wish the Officer a speedy recovery.

[JayC]

1 hour ago, DaveTN said:

Well besides him there were two other witnesses there watching. Maybe we will find out the results; maybe not. A mechanical device can fail, and so can a human. So it’s mere speculation at this point. I wish the Officer a speedy recovery.

 

When was the last time you saw a firearm fail in such a way as to allow the firearm to fire without the trigger being pulled?  Only cases I've seen in the last 20+ years were related to modified triggers in some bolt action rifles.

[BigK]

Playing devil's advocate: Let's completely suspend disbelief say something mechanical actually did fail and there was absolutely NO human error on the part of the guy with the gun. What happens next?

Do they throw the department's armorer under the bus for letting the gun get in a state of disrepair?

Do they ban SAO/striker-fired weapons due to the inherent danger of having the hammer/striker already cocked?

[DaveTN]

2 hours ago, BigK said:

Playing devil's advocate: Let's completely suspend disbelief say something mechanical actually did fail and there was absolutely NO human error on the part of the guy with the gun. What happens next?

Do they throw the department's armorer under the bus for letting the gun get in a state of disrepair?

Do they ban SAO/striker-fired weapons due to the inherent danger of having the hammer/striker already cocked?

The manufacturer issues an “upgrade notice” (or whatever they called them in the past), the lawsuits are paid, and the belief that a gun can’t fire without pulling the trigger is still safe.

Three people stood there and watched this happen. I have no doubt they know what happened. But I have serious doubts we will ever hear the story from them.

[BigK]

18 minutes ago, DaveTN said:

The manufacturer issues an “upgrade notice” (or whatever they called them in the past), the lawsuits are paid, and the belief that a gun can’t fire without pulling the trigger is still safe.

Three people stood there and watched this happen. I have no doubt they know what happened. But I have serious doubts we will ever hear the story from them.

 

I'm sure the other 2 witnesses know he caused the AD, but with no other victims involved and a fellow's career being at stake, I wouldn't rat out one of my co-workers over this either.

[DaveTN]

4 hours ago, BigK said:

I'm sure the other 2 witnesses know he caused the AD, but with no other victims involved and a fellow's career being at stake, I wouldn't rat out one of my co-workers over this either.

Unless he was doing something reckless; his career wouldn’t be at stake. I doubt all three would lie; they have no reason to. I’m not saying he didn’t pull the trigger; I’m just saying it’s absolutely possible he didn’t.

[Pete123]

I'm not aware of any modern pistols / revolvers that fire without the trigger being touched. 

Having grown up in a college town, I can tell you that there is a definite difference between the college police and the police we are all familiar with.

[DaveTN]

6 minutes ago, Pete123 said:

I'm not aware of any modern pistols / revolvers that fire without the trigger being touched. 

Having grown up in a college town, I can tell you that there is a definite difference between the college police and the police we are all familiar with.

So it’s never happened? A striker fired pistol has never fired without pulling the trigger?

[bud]

.

Edited June 18, 2016 by bud

[Pete123]

Dave, not that I know of.

[ou812]

1 hour ago, bud said:

 Suddenly rethinking daily pocket carry.

On the other hand, my default assumption has to be that the trigger was pulled or I won't rest easy. 

I understand that.  I am just starting to feel comfortable carrying with one chambered and then come across this!

[Pete123]

Guys, IMHO you needn't worry about carrying.  Regarding pocket carry, a gun should always be in a holster that covers the trigger guard and trigger and that includes pocket carry.

Of course anything man made can fail.  Having said that, I'm not aware of any police or true gun pro that worries about quality modern gun going off if the trigger isn't pressed.  

[Obiwan]

Well, you do have to worry about your holster. Make sure your holster is in good condition, especially leather ones.

A worn leather holster can cause a discharge.

Or this one. (Caution: A bit graphic)

And it happens to police chiefs too.

Edited May 19, 2016 by Obiwan

[Pete123]

I went and did some Internet research.  Here is an article that I thought were good:

http://www.tactical-life.com/combat-handguns/dropped-gun-inertia-discharge/

I interpret the article to say that it can happen, though is unlikely with a modern quality firearm.

There are things to be aware of, such as the example above with older holsters.

[JayC]

21 hours ago, DaveTN said:

So it’s never happened? A striker fired pistol has never fired without pulling the trigger?

I can't find ANY documented case of a modern pistol AD unless the trigger was pulled, or the firearm had been modified.  The chances of this happening with a police department issued firearm should be virtually zero.  Glocks, Sig's H&K's, Beretta's, etc just don't have the ability to AD without something pulling the trigger or modifying the firearm in a non-standard way.

Edited May 19, 2016 by JayC

[chances R]

Having just finished a course with Tom Givens, I'm pretty sure he would call BS on the gun firing by itself. He has investigated hundreds of shootings and simply states guns don't go off sitting in a drawer,shelf, table or holster without some outside interference.  Dropping a modern firearm would also be very improbable for an AD unless someone grabbed for it.  Not saying 'never' as it is a mechancical device, but given the tremendous number of firearms handled every day......unlikely.

[Cruel Hand Luke]

This whole thing is highly suspect. 

If it is a Glock then they are not "cocked" while at rest. The trigger being pressed is what pulls the striker rearward and the cruciform dropping out of the way then releases it allowing it to move forward. Something would have had to pull the striker (firing pin) to the rear ,disengaging the internal safeties , and compressing the striker spring, disengaging the firing pin safety (which keeps it from moving forward unless the trigger is pressed) and dropping the cruciform off the ledge,  releasing the striker to make it fire. The cruciform cannot get out of the way to allow it go forward until it is pushed all the way to the rear and the firing pin safety is disengaged by rearward trigger movement. That is how they work. The trigger has to be pulled to fire it....

Edited June 3, 2016 by Cruel Hand Luke

[Patton]

It was in fact a Glock 23.