Where's A2 love?

[peejman]

No love for them myself, I would rather have a flattop.  Just really dislike the looks of the front sight, don't know why but there it is.  

 

 

Heh, I'm just the opposite.  Anything without the standard FSB looks strange to me.  The only gun I've ever sold was an AR with a railed gas block. 

 

 

Caster, a few years ago they finally made the 16" A4 config legal for NRA high power matches.

[dcloudy777]

What is authentic about a 7 twist??

I mean, that's great if that's what you want, I'm all for it, but the old rifles were a slow twist.

 

The M16A2 (which is what I'm cloning), always had a 1x7" twist....

[mikegideon]

The M16A2 (which is what I'm cloning), always had a 1x7" twist....

 

Sho did. When I did mine, a barrel was real hard to find. BCM was the only place for a Gov profile (in stock), and theirs didn't have a front sight attached. So, I had to track one down and send the whole mess to Adco. Hope you have better luck.

Edited February 1, 2016 by mikegideon

[dcloudy777]

Got one on backorder from Brownells, complete with FSB.  Chrome lined, 1-7" twist, delta ring, handguard cap and everything .

 

And Caster, they have the same thing in stock with an A-1 type profile and 1-12" twist.... 

[mikegideon]

Got one on backorder from Brownells, complete with FSB.  Chrome lined, 1-7" twist, delta ring, handguard cap and everything .

 

And Caster, they have the same thing in stock with an A-1 type profile and 1-12" twist.... 

 

I just hit it during a dry spell, and way too impatient to wait for one. I got this one...

 

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-20-Rifle-Length-Barrel-Stripped-p/bcm-brl-s-20%20std.htm

[mike_f]

Sorry in advance for the length of this reply.

 

I had a pre-‘94 A2 for years, but sold it to someone in Connecticut for a pile of money after the federal AWB ended in 2004.  Here’s why I don’t currently prefer the A2 configuration.

 

New features of the A2 rifles according to Small Arms of the World (Ezell, 1983):

 

Single fire & 3-round burst – moot on civilian semi only rifles

 

Improved round & stronger front handguards – I’ve cracked a couple of teeth on the triangular handguards, so stronger is better.  It appears they went with the round handguards so they didn’t have to stock different left & right handguards. I prefer the shape of the triangular handguards.

 

New tapered slip (delta) ring – Less frustrating to remove handguards than the earlier flat one.  Good, functional change.

 

New 1 in 7” twist barrel with heavier diameter towards the muzzle – Twist change made over the earlier 1 in 12” twist to stabilize the new M855 62 gr “penetrator” and M856 tracer ammo. I don’t shoot either of those types of ammo. Historically, I've shot mostly 55 gr FMJ, which does well in a 1 in 7” twist barrel. I do also shoot the now-available 77gr BTHP which requires the faster twist, so that’s a useful change for me. 

 

The heavier diameter of the barrel at the muzzle is actually somewhat detrimental for me. The extra weight at the muzzle end is the opposite of what most barrel designers would do for enhanced accuracy.  Per user “coldblue” (who claims on arfcom ( http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=260598 ) “The M16A2 Product Improvement Program (1980-1983) was my program”):

 

We (Marines) were replacing a lot of "bent" barrels that were determined to be "bent" because the Armorer's Bore Drop Gauge would not freely pass through some barrels during Ordnance Inspections (LTI's). So the Logistics people had "Barrels Bending" on their list of "M16A1" things to "Improve" right after listing "Handguards Breaking."

 

We "experts" thought this bending was from rough handling like during bayonet drills, etc., as an absence of any mid-barrel handguard damage in these rifles made one assume the fulcrum of such bending was the bayonet lug. So we made that part of the barrel thicker because we did not want the excess weight of a full length heavy barrel. In testing using the bayonet lug as a fulcrum, and applying calibrated mechanical pressure to the muzzle, the new barrel was about 9 times more resistant to bend and take a set than an M16A1 profile. So we went with this "improvement."

 

However, soon after I started using a bore scope with a video recorder and monitor to inspect "bent" barrels. What I found was a mound of bullet jacket material at their gas ports. This build up was caused by a burr left from drilling/reaming the gas port. This was where the Armorer's Drop Gauge was getting stuck. When we removed this "mound", the barrels would all pass the Drop Gauge. We let Colt know what we had deduced, and that is one reason they kept models of "A2's" in their line-up with A1 profile barrels. However, the A2 profile was already down the road for the US Military. So about the only advantage of the A2 profile was to give the rifle a little more muzzle hang. This was noted by most all the Operational Test participants, especially when they fired the standing/off-hand leg of our rifle qualification course.

 

So it appears that we’ve been stuck with the heavy muzzle A2 contour (that was subsequently used on the military 14.5” and civilian 16” barrels) to fix a problem that didn’t really exist and for Marines to get better qualification scores.

 

New, stronger, longer buttstock: Stronger is good, but the utility of the longer length (outside classic marksmanship shooting positions) is debatable. With the proliferation of collapsible stock configurations, its easy for me to find one of those that work.  The adjustments also make it easier for smaller statured shooters to find a length of pull that works well for them.

 

New, fully adjustable rear sight: A lot nicer than the A1 rear sight. But I’ve got old man eyes now and tend to use optics, so this improvement is currently of little value for me.

 

So if you like the A2 configuration for nostalgic reasons – I think that’s great.  I have retro ARs and love them for what they are.  But for my use there are now configurations that work better – A1 barrel contours, collapsible stocks, and flat tops for easier optics mounting. 

[gjohnsoniv]

All this talk of A2 rifles makes me want to pull the railed gas block off mine and install the standard front sight.

[mikegideon]

All this talk of A2 rifles makes me want to pull the railed gas block off mine and install the standard front sight.

 

Nah, unless you shoot irons all the time. I have two legacy AR's with military front sights, but my go to guns all have optics. If I am shooting optics, I want the front (and rear) iron sight out of the way.

[dcloudy777]

Oh BTW, I do like retro-cool as well...

 

[gjohnsoniv]

Nah, unless you shoot irons all the time. I have two legacy AR's with military front sights, but my go to guns all have optics. If I am shooting optics, I want the front (and rear) iron sight out of the way.

Nah, this one is just a play around AR.

[Oh Shoot]

Oh BTW, I do like retro-cool as well...

 

 

Retro is hearkening back to something that actually existed, and that didn't.

 

More like wood punk in the sense of steam punk

 

- OS

[mikegideon]

Retro is hearkening back to something that actually existed, and that didn't.

 

More like wood punk in the sense of steam punk

 

- OS

 

A friend of mine had a woodie. They're pretty cute in person.

[Oh Shoot]

A friend of mine had a woodie. They're pretty cute in person.

 

Well, apparently the very first Colt AR did had a wood "look", even though it was fiberglass:

 

[dcloudy777]

The "retro" part is the XM-177-esque barrel/fake moderator/A1 upper (although a really strange combo of A1 sight plus forward assist... where the heck did I get this upper?).

 

The wood is just... well, cool wood.   :devil:

 

I'm actually thinking about putting an Armson OEG on it... I had no idea, but you can still buy them brand new.

[mikegideon]

The "retro" part is the XM-177-esque barrel/fake moderator/A1 upper (although a really strange combo of A1 sight plus forward assist... where the heck did I get this upper?).

 

The wood is just... well, cool wood.   :devil:

 

I'm actually thinking about putting an Armson OEG on it... I had no idea, but you can still buy them brand new.

 

AFIK, the forward assist was before the A2. That and the brass deflector. The original AR would beat a leftie in the face with brass... until it jammed :)

[mike_f]

AFIK, the forward assist was before the A2. That and the brass deflector. The original AR would beat a leftie in the face with brass... until it jammed :)

 

As a lefty I really like the A2 brass deflector.  Range time with my SP1 leaves nice circular burn marks on the right side of my face. :)

[xsubsailor]

Here's a couple of places that have the A2 uppers, both stripped or the assembly. 

 

http://www.del-ton.com/AR_15_Upper_Receivers_s/88.htm

 

 

https://www.rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=279

[Omega]

AFIK, the forward assist was before the A2. That and the brass deflector. The original AR would beat a leftie in the face with brass... until it jammed :)

 

 

As a lefty I really like the A2 brass deflector.  Range time with my SP1 leaves nice circular burn marks on the right side of my face. :)

No face hits here, but I still have scars on my right forearm where the hot brass stuck while qualifying in Basic Training.