For the IT guys - some questions

[CommsNBombs]

WGU sucked. I did them for a year. It's for people that like certification based learning; pass-fail based on one exam. I personally like the opportunity to submit dozens of assignments and the grade be buffered out if there is a bad day and not fail the entire class.

Yeah I didnt get a warm and fuzzy from those "competency units"

Ill probably go with a much cheaper in state online program. I want to save my GI Bill for Masters/Phd work so ill go for some FAFSA action

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[MacGyver]

Yeah I didnt get a warm and fuzzy from those "competency units"

Ill probably go with a much cheaper in state online program. I want to save my GI Bill for Masters/Phd work so ill go for some FAFSA action

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Lipscomb's Yellow Ribbon program is worth looking at. They put their money where their mouth is when it comes to supporting the troops.

[TripleDigitRide]

I know just about nothing related to IT, but I got a few chuckles from reading this thread. I know a guy who took online classes to become something in the IT field, and has managed to fake his way through it for the last few years. I was surprised to find out that he is still employed, considering his wife did quite a bit of the online work for him.

[Truckie]

I was 20 years ago A+, Net+ and it will get you in the door for entry level hardware break fix... I spent a bunch of years with
Hewlett Packard... I was working 24/7 with a pager.. it was killing me... I used my volunteer fire dept experience to get out of Corp America in NJ and moved the family to Tennessee for a career fire Job... best thing I ever did

[Sam1]

in addition to Lipscomb is Capellla, that's who I used for my Masters and now on the PhD.  One of the few online schools that have legit regional accreditation through multiple doctoral level programs.  I cannot speak to their undergrad though, but if it is similar, it's pretty decent.

 

They also give a 10% discount for vets the entire time you go, and have plenty of people to help you get the GI bill benefits sorted out.  They also give out scholarships to vets like crazy, so far I've received $15,000 in scholarships directly from the school for the sole reason of being a vet.  Not sure how much Lipscomb charges, but take into consideration the scholarships from Capella if you compare them. As long as you have good grades, you're pretty much guaranteed to get some at some point. 

[TNWNGR]

If your considering a B.S. in Computer Science and will be staying in Clarksville for the foreseeable future then go and scope out the program at APSU. Many of your courses can be done at the Ft. Campbell Center in and accelerated format. Some can be done online and for all of the bad mouthing you hear about APSU the B.S. degrees they offer in Computer Science and teaching are great. FWIW I recommend you consider the Computer Science path as well as being certified to teach. Going that route either gets you into a Middle School or High School teaching, then do the IT work on either a part time or contract basis. Additionaly theres the added benifit or having any and all student loans you've been paying on forgiven after ten continuous years of teaching. Depending on your present age its not a bad deal.

[MacGyver]

in addition to Lipscomb is Capellla, that's who I used for my Masters and now on the PhD.  One of the few online schools that have legit regional accreditation through multiple doctoral level programs.  I cannot speak to their undergrad though, but if it is similar, it's pretty decent.

 

They also give a 10% discount for vets the entire time you go, and have plenty of people to help you get the GI bill benefits sorted out.  They also give out scholarships to vets like crazy, so far I've received $15,000 in scholarships directly from the school for the sole reason of being a vet.  Not sure how much Lipscomb charges, but take into consideration the scholarships from Capella if you compare them. As long as you have good grades, you're pretty much guaranteed to get some at some point. 

 

Basically, Lipscomb's participation lets vets go to school for free at the undergraduate level and there's another scale at the graduate level.  I think the mechanics of the program basically work such that Lipscomb comps any difference between GI Bill benefits and their actual tuition.

[Sam1]

Basically, Lipscomb's participation lets vets go to school for free at the undergraduate level and there's another scale at the graduate level.  I think the mechanics of the program basically work such that Lipscomb comps any difference between GI Bill benefits and their actual tuition.

 

That's an awesome deal!

[CommsNBombs]

Basically, Lipscomb's participation lets vets go to school for free at the undergraduate level and there's another scale at the graduate level. I think the mechanics of the program basically work such that Lipscomb comps any difference between GI Bill benefits and their actual tuition.

Do they let you double dip like a lot of dudes on Active Duty do?

Most people 3+ years use their TA or Monty GI Bill then also request FAFSA and get the $2000+ for free almost. Not sure the ethics behind it but everyone in my unit to include my 1SG, CO, XO and OPSO do it that way.

I was going to do Computer Sci with an emphasis on Network Admin then branch more into Cloud Computing/NETSEC with graduate work

I want to know if my experience as a COMSEC custodian/IA will play a roll, not sure if the NSA lets IT companies play with classified encryption and keys at all.

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[Sam1]

To get into the PKI/encryption/certificates side of things in the private sector, you're going to need some serious schooling or experience to back that up.  That's a pretty specific field to get into.  High risk type of job, the ones that have specific positions that work with that are usually very careful on who they put in those positions. IS/IA jobs are more policy/procedure kind of things like what an ISO does or a consulting firm would do.

 

As someone else said earlier, virtualization is the way to go for a lot of sysadmin fields, whether it be networking or servers.

 

On the fafsa/gi bill thing, these are two different things altogether. fafsa is a system that registers you for financial aid, it is not money/payment.  What it does get you is a loan, so technically you could get a student loan to pay for school, then get your GI bill payout as well and blow that money.  That's what I did for undergrad and had a great time.... But now I owe $100g's in student loans, and it would have been nice to owe $30k less but of course I wasn't thinking about that 10 years ago.

[Ski]

To get into the PKI/encryption/certificates side of things in the private sector, you're going to need some serious schooling or experience to back that up.  That's a pretty specific field to get into.  High risk type of job, the ones that have specific positions that work with that are usually very careful on who they put in those positions. IS/IA jobs are more policy/procedure kind of things like what an ISO does or a consulting firm would do.

Corporate InfoSec positions can include policies/standards/awareness/compliance as well as more hands on areas like identity and access management, network security, endpoint security, perimeter security, and data protection (think encryption).

If you're interested in encryption algorithms, you might consider majoring in math.

I didn't see my old boss today, so I don't have any feedback from him to offer, yet.

[Sam1]

Corporate InfoSec positions can include policies/standards/awareness/compliance as well as more hands on areas like identity and access management, network security, endpoint security, perimeter security, and data protection (think encryption).

If you're interested in encryption algorithms, you might consider majoring in math.

I didn't see my old boss today, so I don't have any feedback from him to offer, yet.

 

Those technical positions normally involve a secondary area of expertise such as networking, platforms, dbadmin etc.  They're not for someone with just a straight IS/IA background.

[CommsNBombs]

Ah okay well PKI/COMSEC stuff will be something I will stay away from for the time being.

Problem with my MOS and my position at work is I got thrown at every problem - Im extremely well rounded but not great at any one thing so Im a slightly skilled clean slate I guess

As far as virtualization, whats the industry standard? Ive only had experience using VMWare and doing very limited remote stuff through TelNet and on Linux boxes.

Plus my mindset is from the militsary commo side, meaning a bunch of damn SF guys or Infantry guys touched it and broke/disabled/compromised it - I spent way more time fixing things than monitoring/initializing if that makes sense

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[TNMTBik3r]

As far as virtualization, whats the industry standard? Ive only had experience using VMWare and doing very limited remote stuff through TelNet and on Linux boxes.

VMware is still the top hypervisor but Hyper-V is making some serious inroads. They are fairly similar though, if you learn one you can work in both.

Citrix is still big but there are some serious concerns on how much longer they will exist as a company. Even if the company is bought out the technology will remain in use and be integrated into the product line of whomever buys them.

[Sam1]

yeah vmware is the top dog, hyper-v is good, but TCO over vmware solutions is much higher... That's why people are sticking with vmware.  I think vmware has a calculator on their website explaining the differences, used it during the summer for a class, it was surprising how much more expensive hyper-v was.

Edited January 13, 2016 by Sam1

[TNMTBik3r]

But Sam, Hyper-V is FREE!!!
I was in a class last year and even a MS rep said Hyper-V is more expensive. Not everyone gets that, or they conveniently ignore it to push their own agendas internally.

[Ski]

Those technical positions normally involve a secondary area of expertise such as networking, platforms, dbadmin etc. They're not for someone with just a straight IS/IA background.

That's true for some of those disciplines more than others. I wanted to make sure he had an idea of the breadth of opportunities within InfoSec.

You may find some very specialized shops that use Hyper-V or one of the Linux based hypervisors like KVM, but I recommend focusing on VMware if virtualization interests you. I've had a little experience with a couple of the VMware platforms and Oracle VirtualBox. I like VirtualBox for running VMs on my main workstation at home, and it's also fairly similar to the older VMware platforms with which I'm familiar. It runs VMware VMs with little to no effort. However, I don't know that there are many companies that use VirtualBox for large server farms.

EDIT: Added VM info and then clarified VM info Edited January 13, 2016 by Ski

[Sam1]

But Sam, Hyper-V is FREE!!!
I was in a class last year and even a MS rep said Hyper-V is more expensive. Not everyone gets that, or they conveniently ignore it to push their own agendas internally.

 

Sure hyper-v is free, but there's more to an virtual infrastructure than a server OS.  I do 'conveniently ignore' that fact because it is a minuscule artifact in VI.

 

I ran a very small 100 VM setup through there and it shows a $320,000 savings over a 2 year period between the two.  100 VMs is nothing.

 

http://www.vmware.com/go/tcocalculator/newIndex.html?numvirtualMacin=100&productEdition=vSphere+with+Operations+Management+Standard&nummacinDeploy=100&isliveMigration=1&healthMonitoring=1&isloadBalancing=1&isStorageloadbalancing=1&virtualizationHost=Server+C+%28HP+DL560+Gen8%2C+4+CPU%2C+256GB+RAM%29&networkedStorage=vSAN&networkedStorageComparison=FC+SAN&virtualizationManagement=Virtual+Machines&costofElectricity=Average&costofRealestate=Average&BaselinevmPerCpu=6&additionalvmPercpu=1&index_submit=See+Results

 

But it's free!  :bowrofl:

Edited January 13, 2016 by Sam1

[TNMTBik3r]

The "free" argument has been thrown around here for over the past year. A bunch of people listened and ignored all of the other factors, such as extra hardware costs.
I could care less, I have experience with both. But VMware is the top dog and Hyper-V has a ways to go still.

[MacGyver]

Do they let you double dip like a lot of dudes on Active Duty do?

Most people 3+ years use their TA or Monty GI Bill then also request FAFSA and get the $2000+ for free almost. Not sure the ethics behind it but everyone in my unit to include my 1SG, CO, XO and OPSO do it that way.

I was going to do Computer Sci with an emphasis on Network Admin then branch more into Cloud Computing/NETSEC with graduate work

I want to know if my experience as a COMSEC custodian/IA will play a roll, not sure if the NSA lets IT companies play with classified encryption and keys at all.

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I don't know about the particulars of the financial aspect - only that the program has received a lot of notice.

 

Some additional thoughts:

 

1.  It's pretty laudable that a school is doing this in a way that provides a traditional, in-classroom education as opposed to what so many are doing in trying to mine GI Bill money through online courses.  While there's an argument to be made for online courses if you've already got the knowledge and just need the degree as a means to an end.  That's not this program.  It's a traditional college experience.

 

2.  While Lipscomb is known for their traditional Liberal Arts programs, they've got rock solid programs in Engineering, Computer Science, Pharmacy and Nursing.  They've got a ridiculous pass rate on the Fundamentals of Engineering exam year after year.

 

3.  Lipscomb benefits from the program as well.  While it's certainly not the primary motivator, they benefit from having "real people" in the classroom alongside their millennial students.  I don't know how many millennials you're around, but they need all the help they can get :)

 

To get into the PKI/encryption/certificates side of things in the private sector, you're going to need some serious schooling or experience to back that up.  That's a pretty specific field to get into.  High risk type of job, the ones that have specific positions that work with that are usually very careful on who they put in those positions. IS/IA jobs are more policy/procedure kind of things like what an ISO does or a consulting firm would do.

 

As someone else said earlier, virtualization is the way to go for a lot of sysadmin fields, whether it be networking or servers.

 

On the fafsa/gi bill thing, these are two different things altogether. fafsa is a system that registers you for financial aid, it is not money/payment.  What it does get you is a loan, so technically you could get a student loan to pay for school, then get your GI bill payout as well and blow that money.  That's what I did for undergrad and had a great time.... But now I owe $100g's in student loans, and it would have been nice to owe $30k less but of course I wasn't thinking about that 10 years ago.

 

Sam's right.  In the private sector, we add availability and integrity concerns to encryption in addition to the traditional confidentiality side of things.  Yes, we want to keep private things private, but I also want to make sure that my database stays available with high integrity.  It only takes one encryption mistake to really screw that up.  If you're looking to go the infosec route, the CISSP may be a certification that you look into.  Otherwise, being a reliable virtualization guy is a marketable skill here in middle Tennessee.

[CommsNBombs]

Before I let this get ahead of me I want to sincerely thank everyone who has contributed thus far, and sent me PMs/Emails and other sets of advice, I knew we had a decent amount of IT folks - but not this many, so that is good.

 

Had the opportunity to talk to Pete123 in person today and networked with some other people, it has already been an awesome experience and makes me more and more glad that I reached out to all of you here on TGO for advice/help.

 

Will begin searching for an accelerated program in Computer Science for Network Admin stuff, trying to set my 25m goals accordingly and not try to jump into some directorate position (not like that'll happen anyway lol)

 

Enrolled for Feb w/ Syracuse to knock out my CCNA cert - I think they also offer CISSP, have to double check the program but I will try and go for that instead if they do have it - more for the fact that they pay for one exam, might as well make it the most expensive/relevant one

 

Hopefully the connections/advice I have gotten can translate into a job offer(s) God willing in the next few weeks so I can make a quick transition - as my family is my number one priority.

 

Also didn't realize how important LinkedIn was until today lol

[btq96r]

Also didn't realize how important LinkedIn was until today lol

 

Yeah, it's kind of a biggie.  And the constant emails are beyond an annoyance.

 

Still better than Facebook, however.

[CommsNBombs]

Yeah, it's kind of a biggie.  And the constant emails are beyond an annoyance.

 

Still better than Facebook, however.

Finally getting it figured out - definitely better than FB though

[CommsNBombs]

Already thought of another question

 

As far as telecommuting goes - are these positions solely for Tier 1 Remote Help Desk/CSS jobs?

 

Obviously I do not expect to get a really good paying job and getting entrusted to work while in Ranger Panties and a sombrero - but what is the general industry vibe/usage with telecommuting? Is it something that is job-to-job dependent/something that can be negotiated for?

 

I understand the liability of lack of motivation, or cyber threats from having someone with remote VPN access to a classified IS, just figured I get some background before running my mouth about something I do not fully grasp.

[Pete123]

You'll do very well.

 

A couple of things impressed me with CommsNBombs.

 

A battalion commander (Leads about 1000 folks) asked him if he new how a piece of communications equipment worked that was in a truck.  Comms was able to impress him to the point that the commander asked him to be his right hand man for all of the communications systems.

 

That tells me that he is sharp and gets things done. 

 

Also, he's much closer to the beginning of his career than many of us.  Leaders have been concerned about millennial's relative to work ethic and ability to accept criticism.  It's clear to me that neither of these would be an issue.

 

Next, there is significant disconnect between IT and the business units, which is due in large part to differences in the way most techies and business people think and make decisions.  

 

I think he can grow into a role where he bridges the gap and helps both the business units and IT get what they need.  Tech leaders that excel at this will be able to do anything they want to do.

 

I wanted to meet him in person before I start connecting him with my customers, who are tech leaders and have no concerns at all.

Edited January 14, 2016 by Pete123