Carry Permit while on Probation

[GlockSpock]

[ma690701]

Yes. ^^ there it is!

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[Oh Shoot]

Yes. ^^ there it is!

 

Down, tiger. He made the pics, it's not found "online" as you claimed.

 

And thanks a bunch, CZ!

 

Okay, here's the pertinent part, and why I wanted to see exactly how that section was worded:

 

 

According to 39-17-1351, it takes a combination of factors to be denied for the rehab part.

 

(A) would deny you period (refers to federal law) but takes (A) plus ( B )  or ( C ) to deny. (You could even make the argument that A alone is not a disqualification, as that simply forbids you from possessing firearms under federal law, which is actually a different matter than having a permit to do so, but whatever).

 

Similarly, as is well documented, neither (D) or (E) alone disqualifies you, it takes both (D) and (E) to do it.

 

Now, I can't say whether TNDOS is following the statute as written in regard to the rehab part, but we know they do as for the DUI part, so seems they should, as the sections are written exactly alike, with an "and" as part of the condition, not "or".

 

----------

 

reference from the statute:

 

(10) That the applicant is not an unlawful user of or addicted to alcohol, any controlled substance or controlled substance analogue, AND the applicant has not been either:

      (A) A patient in a rehabilitation program pursuant to a court order or hospitalized for alcohol, controlled substance or controlled substance analogue abuse or addiction pursuant to a court order within ten (10) years from the date of application; or

      ( B ) A voluntary patient in a rehabilitation program or voluntarily hospitalized for alcohol, controlled substance or controlled substance analogue abuse or addiction within three (3) years from the date of application;

 

 

(11) That the applicant has not been convicted of the offense of driving under the influence of an intoxicant in this or any other state two (2) or more times within ten (10) years from the date of the application AND that none of the convictions has occurred within five (5) years from the date of application or renewal;

 

 

 

- OS

Edited November 25, 2015 by Oh Shoot

[diamondback]

I have a friend who is on probation for a misdemeanor marijuana charge.  He's asking if he can get a handgun carry permit.

 

I told him that I don't know, but that someone on TGO probably would.

 

Does anyone know the answer?

 

I am gonna guess no, but  not 100%

[ma690701]

Down, tiger. He made the pics, it's not found "online" as you claimed.

And thanks a bunch, CZ!

Okay, here's the pertinent part, and why I wanted to see exactly how that section was worded:



According to 39-17-1351, it takes a combination of factors to be denied for the rehab part.

(A) would deny you period (refers to federal law) but takes (A) plus ( B ) or ( C ) to deny. (You could even make the argument that A alone is not a disqualification, as that simply forbids you from possessing firearms under federal law, which is actually a different matter than having a permit to do so, but whatever).

Similarly, as is well documented, neither (D) or (E) alone disqualifies you, it takes both (D) and (E) to do it.

Now, I can't say whether TNDOS is following the statute as written in regard to the rehab part, but we know they do as for the DUI part, so seems they should, as the sections are written exactly alike, with an "and" as part of the condition, not "or".

----------

reference from the statute:

(10) That the applicant is not an unlawful user of or addicted to alcohol, any controlled substance or controlled substance analogue, AND the applicant has not been either:
(A) A patient in a rehabilitation program pursuant to a court order or hospitalized for alcohol, controlled substance or controlled substance analogue abuse or addiction pursuant to a court order within ten (10) years from the date of application; or
( B ) A voluntary patient in a rehabilitation program or voluntarily hospitalized for alcohol, controlled substance or controlled substance analogue abuse or addiction within three (3) years from the date of application;


(11) That the applicant has not been convicted of the offense of driving under the influence of an intoxicant in this or any other state two (2) or more times within ten (10) years from the date of the application AND that none of the convictions has occurred within five (5) years from the date of application or renewal;



- OS

Dude--I am NOT trying to argue with you. You posted some slightly incorrect information about a subject, that for very personal reasons I happen to know A LOT about. This law was changed last year. I ASSURE you that ifvyou check the "yes" box next to the "3 year" rehab question, you WILL be denied. I have consulted with 3 seperate firearms attorneys, and several officials (all very PRO gun). No onethat I have spoken with AGREES with the law, but all feel 3 is better than 10. If an individual can (with luck) have their permit renewal fall such that they can claim they have NOT been an inpatient within 3 years, then they are under no legal obligation to report their inpatient status to the government and no one will EVER know. If the applicant lies on the renewal form, that is a felony. The best course of action (in my opinion) if one has been to rehab, is to wait out the 3 year window and reapply. I have it from VERY good sources that checking the "yes" box WILL result in an instant denial and appeals have (so far) not been successful. It HAS been tried.

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[Oh Shoot]

Dude--I am NOT trying to argue with you. You posted some slightly incorrect information about a subject, that for very personal reasons I happen to know A LOT about. This law was changed last year. I ASSURE you that ifvyou check the "yes" box next to the "3 year" rehab question, you WILL be denied. I have consulted with 3 seperate firearms attorneys, and several officials (all very PRO gun). No onethat I have spoken with AGREES with the law, but all feel 3 is better than 10. If an individual can (with luck) have their permit renewal fall such that they can claim they have NOT been an inpatient within 3 years, then they are under no legal obligation to report their inpatient status to the government and no one will EVER know. If the applicant lies on the renewal form, that is a felony. The best course of action (in my opinion) if one has been to rehab, is to wait out the 3 year window and reapply. I have it from VERY good sources that checking the "yes" box WILL result in an instant denial and appeals have (so far) not been successful. It HAS been tried.

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As I said, I don't know what TNDOS has "decided" is proper enforcement of the statute -- only that it is worded exactly the same as the DUI one as to the "and" condition, and for sure both the DUI conditions must be met, neither one alone is prohibitive, that has been proven any number of times right here on TGO.

 

So if they are treating it the way you say, seems to me it's ripe for a suit to anyone denied unless they also say they are currently an illegal user or addict, since otherwise it does not seem to be in accordance with the actual law (which I quoted above). That's all I'm really contending.

 

- OS

Edited November 26, 2015 by Oh Shoot

[ma690701]

As I said, I don't know what TNDOS has "decided" is proper enforcement of the statute -- only that it is worded exactly the same as the DUI one as to the "and" condition, and for sure both the DUI conditions must be met, neither one alone is prohibitive, that has been proven any number of times right here on TGO.

So if they are treating it the way you say, seems to me it's ripe for a suit to anyone denied unless they also say they are currently an illegal user or addict, since otherwise it does not seem to be in accordance with the actual law (which I quoted above). That's all I'm really contending.

- OS

I was told it is (by far) the single biggest reason for denial on renewal, and that many HAD appealed (thereby challenged it) and that no one had ever won on appeal. There is an attorney general opinion on the and/or issue (issued back when it was 10 years) that clearly states it is OR, not "and". I have a copy of it but I cant post a PDF. Maybe I can take a screenshot?

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[ma690701]

I was told it is (by far) the single biggest reason for denial on renewal, and that many HAD appealed (thereby challenged it) and that no one had ever won on appeal. There is an attorney general opinion on the and/or issue (issued back when it was 10 years) that clearly states it is OR, not "and". I have a copy of it but I cant post a PDF. Maybe I can take a screenshot?

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[ma690701]

Hey--it worked!

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[ma690701]

Attorney General opinions are NOT law, they are opinions, but can be the basis for denials. A challenge to this law, I was advised, could take MORE than 3 years. Would probably be easier to get the law changed--which is exactly what happemed last year when it went from 10 to 3.

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