My 10 Gun Show Observations & Questions

[Guest wordsworth]

I'm new to the gun show circuit, and find it very interesting. But I have a few questions:

1. Why in the world is the entrance fee so high, $10- $9 with a coupon? After spending that kind of money, any deal you might find no longer is a deal. Plus, I didn't find many deals as a person looking to buy a gun for self defense. I think most of the deals found are for the collector who buys guns that no longer shoot, or for guns which the ammo is no longer made.

2. Why do some vendors charge tax? Are taxes charged yard sales?

3. Do any of the vendors really BUY guns? I eavesdropped numerous gun toters attempting to sell their guns, and no vendor was having it. The only offer was a trade if even that. The advertisement says buy, sell, trade.

4. I like to eavesdrop on the various discussions going on and why is the most used word at these shows the word "Obama"?

5. Can they really sell oozies and automatic weapons at these things, aren't those illegal?

6. It seems like 80% of the gun show stuff is for gun collectors.

7. Isn't it dangerous buying a gun from a randon "out of town" guy traveling from city to city with the gun show? It seems better to buy from someone local who you can go to after you find you gun is faulty or even dangerous.

8. I think all of the guns and even the rifles were too expensive. Much better deals can be found elsewhere, ie internet.

9. These shows are awash in knives, and even the knives are too expensive for my taste and a spiraling economy.

10. What nerve a vendor has to NOT place a price on his items. That means he wants too much and is ashamed of his prices.

[TripleDigitRide]

Welcome to the world of gun shows in Tennessee. Maybe the whole country.

Stop now!

[strickj]

2. Why do some vendors charge tax? Are taxes charged yard sales?

Only the "private sellers" are exempt from charging tax,and not doing tics.Ergo the Gun Shop Loophole.However,dont know if you noticed or not,but most of the tables are from actual gun shops that must charge tax,and tics,thus voiding this dreaded "loophole"

3. Do any of the vendors really BUY guns? I eavesdropped numerous gun toters attempting to sell their guns, and no vendor was having it. The only offer was a trade if even that. The advertisement says buy, sell, trade.

vendors will buy,but will not give as much as most people are looking to get out of their guns

5. Can they really sell oozies and automatic weapons at these things, aren't those illegal?

No,they are not illegal.

Secondly,you are probably looking at the semi-auto versions of the weapons.All those M4's you see are not machine guns!

7. Isn't it dangerous buying a gun from a randon "out of town" guy traveling from city to city with the gun show? It seems better to buy from someone local who you can go to after you find you gun is faulty or even dangerous.

If said gun comes with a manufactures warranty,then it is up to the manufacture to cover its repairs,

8. I think all of the guns and even the rifles were too expensive. Much better deals can be found elsewhere, ie internet.

Well yes!

10. What nerve a vendor has to NOT place a price on his items. That means he wants too much and is ashamed of his prices.

I think I have always seen prices tagged of things

[Guest c.a.s.]

Words, welcome to TGO. From the tone of your questions, I take it you are a new gun owner?

As well, new to the gunshow scene, as well. I'll address your points, even though I haven't personally been to one myself.

1: That isn't really expensive, depending on what kind of deal you're looking for. That, and HOW tight you planned to ration for the trip.

2: Not all vendors are personal sales. In fact, FFLs also go to these shows to reach a larger populous than would be able to visit their shopfront. They still have to follow all the same laws they did in their shop. Including sales tax, 4473s, background checks, everything.

3:Some do, some don't, sometimes people just don't have something that would sell, so they don't have a reason to buy unless they want it personally. I'd be under the impression that personal sales generally end up largely between individuals more than to the vendors. It's a way ot get better deals, if you find someoen with what you are looking for.

4: Obama is vehemently an anti-rights bigot. Part of his plans, as he has stated plainly, is to place heavy, draconian controls on firearms. A permananent Assault Weapons Ban "with teeth", repeal of the Tiarht Amendment, the ban of personal sales or transfers of firearms, and forced "child-proofing", to boot. He is no friend to firearms owners, at all.

5: That's UZI. And yes, cetain dealers can. Most just show them off, though, because of either high price or that they are LEO only. Fully-automatic firearms registered before a certain date ARE civilian-transferrable, albeit VERY expensive, with lots more paperwork. I suggest asking a CLass III dealer on this board, such as Hero Gear, on the specifics of aquiring a Class III firearm or their properties.

6: Well, of course. Then again, you really need an eye for firearms to realy get their identity. What may look like a collector's firearm may just be a slightly negleted, but perfectly working firearm. But, you have ot expect an alright amount for firearms collectors, because they DO frequent these shows, and anyone can really be considered a collector.

7: Actually, most of the vendors at gunshows ARE local, though local can be a bit of a stretch. They don't travel with the gunshow, they rent a booth. Local vendors of various establishments or collectors can rent a booth to use at the show. As far as I know ,the gun shows don't actually MOVE, they just occur at certain times during the year.

8: That entirely depends. Have you compared prices, honestly? There are plenty of bad deals, but there are also plenty of good deals. You need to shop around to find the best deal. Oftentimes, the internet will prove to be cheaper. But, you don't usually get a chance to inspect the firearm, and can become a victim to fraud much more easily. Personally, I would much rather pay a little bit more to be able to inspect the firearm myself and use my favorite local shop.

9: Every gathering with rentable booths ends up awash in knife dealers who are either overly expensive, or completely cheap. There are a couple gold nuggets i nthe junk, though. Entirely based on your eye and tastes, though.

10: They are probably willing ot barter. Sometimes, the firearm might have been sold, or recently traded in. Don't be so quick to jump the gun, so to speak. Inquire about something if it interest you.

[towerclimber37]

Keep going to the shows wordsworth, you'll start seeing the deals. you have to use care though, and be meticulous in your searches.

I helped a guy get a nice, NIB, RIA 1911 for 450.00 this past weekend. it was a fair deal for a good pistol! matter of fact, I was going to buy it if he didnt.

some can argue that the price was a little high, but it wasn't that bad and they had what he was looking for.

[Mike.357]

I think you ought to not give up on gun shows. All too soon they may be out of existence as we now know them.

I like going to them to be with hundreds (if not more) like minded people. It's very easy to converse about guns and associated wares. It is fun to look at all the stuff, even high priced knives. Most dealers do not overly mind if you fondle their guns. So the hands on factor is very high.

8. I think all of the guns and even the rifles were too expensive. Much better deals can be found elsewhere, ie internet.

I dunno, generally I have always found a fair deal, fair is all I expect. I have also gotten great deals. It helps a lot to know what you want and what you are willing to pay before going in. It can also be helpful to be up on gun pricing so you know if something is a good deal. Remember prices you see on Gunbroker etc... do not include the inevitable shipping cost as well as transfer fee and background check fee from and FFL. So go ahead and add 50 to 100 bucks to the cost you find on the internet. (FTF deals being the exception to fees).

Best tip I can offer is that if you are buying ammo, get to the Ga. Arms booth early!

[Guest Hooker]

I'm new to the gun show circuit, and find it very interesting. But I have a few questions:

4. I like to eavesdrop on the various discussions going on and why is the most used word at these shows the word "Obama"?

Were you offended?

[Curiousgb]

I have only been to one gun show in TN. It was in Memphis and it was a big disappointment. I thought the shows in Charleston SC were poor but they looked wonderful compared to this one. I hope they aren't all this bad.

Having said all this there were deals but you had to look carefully. And I always assume that once I find something I am interested in buying, then I start haggling.

[Shug]

Been going to shows for 30yrs. Its always been like that. I like the part where your stuff aint worth crap but theirs is priceless. They like to use the "Blue Book" on their stuffs value. {so take one and use it for yours--they wont talk to you} But the name of the game is makeing money or getting the best trade you can. And we all LOVE it thats why we keep going, even though there is a lot of LUDICROUS prices now. I just wish the people would quit standing in the middle of the isles catching up on old times. GO TO THE BACK WALL! By the way anybody got a deal on a High Point carbine?

[Guest Major Pain]

Been going to gun shows many years. The best deals are usually found from the people in line at the door.--MP

[Smith]

5. Can they really sell oozies and automatic weapons at these things, aren't those illegal?

Aw crap, I need to hide my uzi if it's illegal!:D

Not anymore than any other gun. Automatics are completely legal if you are willing to jump through the paper work and cost to get one.

[Guest Spuds]

1. Why in the world is the entrance fee so high, $10- $9 with a coupon?

That price is good for both days, so it works out to $4.50/$5 per day. Your loss if you don't attend both days.

The promoter rents the venue, advertises on billboards, radio and tv, pays insurance, and has to pay the security folks, the ticket sales people and his show managers. Often with advertising, rent & insurance alone, he'll be into the show at $100 or more a table, a table he'll only get $50 or $60 for rent on for the weekend. The remainder has to be made up at the door. If 4,000 folks come through on a Saturday, he might even make a profit.

2. Why do some vendors charge tax? Are taxes charged yard sales?

Nobody charges sales tax. They collect it, the law requires them too. Even if you rent a table for the weekend, you obtain a temporary sales tax permit, $5 for the month, $15 for the quarter, $60 for the year (I think.) On it is a form for you to remit the sales tax you should have collected that exceeds the cost of the permit. 95% of the folks don't do it. The Department of Revenue has those books and sees who bought the permits. Maybe those folks might hear from the Revenuers. Maybe they won't.

3. Do any of the vendors really BUY guns? I eavesdropped numerous gun toters attempting to sell their guns, and no vendor was having it. The only offer was a trade if even that. The advertisement says buy, sell, trade.

Every vendor there has met some sucker giving away his guns cheap. Vendors are optimists--that's why they are there at the show, knowing that THIS time, not like the last show when they lost their arse, they'll make a killing. While most folks carrying guns for sale want crazy high prices for them, even a fair deal doesn't interest a dealer. He's looking for that deal he'll be telling his pals about for decades. "One time this goofy guy came in the show with Himmler's personal Luger, I gave him $30 for it."

4. I like to eavesdrop on the various discussions going on and why is the most used word at these shows the word "Obama"?

You a troll? Or just nosy?

5. Can they really sell oozies and automatic weapons at these things, aren't those illegal?

Uzi's aren't all full autos. Class 2/3 dealers will show their wares at shows, and start sales that take time to go through the system.

6. It seems like 80% of the gun show stuff is for gun collectors.

I collect, and I think about 99% of the gun show stuff is for casual shooters and hunters.

7. Isn't it dangerous buying a gun from a randon "out of town" guy traveling from city to city with the gun show? It seems better to buy from someone local who you can go to after you find you gun is faulty or even dangerous.

Then don't go. Most all of the dealers at shows are Tennessee dealers from towns around the state, who set up on the weekend at the gun show.

8. I think all of the guns and even the rifles were too expensive. Much better deals can be found elsewhere, ie internet.

You can't see and touch the guns on the internet. Harder to get questions answered on the net also. Primers and power have a haz mat fee if shipped, none at shows. Internet folks usually don't take your gun in trade. Buy a gun off the net, you got shipping to pay for and still have to get a local dealer to do TICS. You can't go to the next website and get some deer jerky to chaw on while you surf the net right then.

9. These shows are awash in knives, and even the knives are too expensive for my taste and a spiraling economy.

Does anything suit you?

10. What nerve a vendor has to NOT place a price on his items. That means he wants too much and is ashamed of his prices.

Keep on thinking that. In fact, you should also think that if a dealer has one item on his table that you know is overpriced, then ALL of his items are overpriced, aren't they? Keep at it! More deals for me.

[Guest coldblackwind]

Actually, there are a lot of deals to be found at gun shows, you just have to look, and most of them will be walking around, not laying at a vendors table. For instance, last time I went to a nashville show, I came home with an ak pistol, with 5 mags...for $400, beat that on the internet! Its all a matter of luck really, my father will constantly pull something out and say "see this, its worth about $1600, know how much I paid? $600". Its a matter of taking the time to look, being able to haggle, and most importantly, knowing what you are looking at!

[Guest wordsworth]

Thanks strickj for breaking it down. I'm starting to warm up to the idea of gun shows.

[DMark]

.... It seems like 80% of the gun show stuff is for gun collectors.

Oh I Hope So!!!!!

[Guest wordsworth]

Were you offended?

Not offended at all Hooker- I did not vote this year. I was just amazed at how fearful gunowners are of Obama. I don't see Obama as a threat to gunowners and gunsellers. Such fear is a great talking point for gunsellers, as fear has cause gun sales to skyrocket within the past 6 months. Gun carrying, God fearing, law abiding citizens will live their lives and tote their guns regardless of who is President. Who we need to fear is Congress, who we should have started fearing about a year ago, if we are to fear anyone. I actually think gun laws in TN will get better with the new Republican-led state legislature, but we'll see.

[Guest wordsworth]

I have only been to one gun show in TN. It was in Memphis and it was a big disappointment. I thought the shows in Charleston SC were poor but they looked wonderful compared to this one. I hope they aren't all this bad.

Having said all this there were deals but you had to look carefully. And I always assume that once I find something I am interested in buying, then I start haggling.

I would suspect going on the last day of the show at the last few hours might provide the best possibility of a good deal.

[Guest wordsworth]

Been going to gun shows many years. The best deals are usually found from the people in line at the door.--MP

They should have a place/ table set up for people wanting to trade or sell off the street can go. I think there were a lot of people carrying guns in gun cases that I might have been interested in buying. BUT they didn't know I might be interested and I might not know if they are serious about parting with their gun.

[Guest wordsworth]

That price is good for both days, so it works out to $4.50/$5 per day. Your loss if you don't attend both days.

The promoter rents the venue, advertises on billboards, radio and tv, pays insurance, and has to pay the security folks, the ticket sales people and his show managers. Often with advertising, rent & insurance alone, he'll be into the show at $100 or more a table, a table he'll only get $50 or $60 for rent on for the weekend. The remainder has to be made up at the door. If 4,000 folks come through on a Saturday, he might even make a profit.

Nobody charges sales tax. They collect it, the law requires them too. Even if you rent a table for the weekend, you obtain a temporary sales tax permit, $5 for the month, $15 for the quarter, $60 for the year (I think.) On it is a form for you to remit the sales tax you should have collected that exceeds the cost of the permit. 95% of the folks don't do it. The Department of Revenue has those books and sees who bought the permits. Maybe those folks might hear from the Revenuers. Maybe they won't.

Every vendor there has met some sucker giving away his guns cheap. Vendors are optimists--that's why they are there at the show, knowing that THIS time, not like the last show when they lost their arse, they'll make a killing. While most folks carrying guns for sale want crazy high prices for them, even a fair deal doesn't interest a dealer. He's looking for that deal he'll be telling his pals about for decades. "One time this goofy guy came in the show with Himmler's personal Luger, I gave him $30 for it."

You a troll? Or just nosy?

Uzi's aren't all full autos. Class 2/3 dealers will show their wares at shows, and start sales that take time to go through the system.

I collect, and I think about 99% of the gun show stuff is for casual shooters and hunters.

Then don't go. Most all of the dealers at shows are Tennessee dealers from towns around the state, who set up on the weekend at the gun show.

You can't see and touch the guns on the internet. Harder to get questions answered on the net also. Primers and power have a haz mat fee if shipped, none at shows. Internet folks usually don't take your gun in trade. Buy a gun off the net, you got shipping to pay for and still have to get a local dealer to do TICS. You can't go to the next website and get some deer jerky to chaw on while you surf the net right then.

Does anything suit you?

Keep on thinking that. In fact, you should also think that if a dealer has one item on his table that you know is overpriced, then ALL of his items are overpriced, aren't they? Keep at it! More deals for me.

You LOVE gunshows! You must be a vendor. Thanks for the info. All the dynamics of the shows makes sense and can be an exciting environment where good things might happen in your favor. Too bad for that goofy guy. I like to listen to the gun elders talk-- always seeking to learn something. I walked the entire show listening and filing 2nd visit items in my mind. After the first circle, I went back to touch and discuss the items with the vendor. I don't know, it's kinda like a party where you meander from table to table getting a feel for things.

[Guest c.a.s.]

Not offended at all Hooker- I did not vote this year. I was just amazed at how fearful gunowners are of Obama. I don't see Obama as a threat to gunowners and gunsellers. Such fear is a great talking point for gunsellers, as fear has cause gun sales to skyrocket within the past 6 months. Gun carrying, God fearing, law abiding citizens will live their lives and tote their guns regardless of who is President. Who we need to fear is Congress, who we should have started fearing about a year ago, if we are to fear anyone. I actually think gun laws in TN will get better with the new Republican-led state legislature, but we'll see.

This is a sentiment I see, and I do not believe. The Republics are only TWO SEATS away from losing the Filibuster. The lead Democrats all have the same plans, and once those seats are gone, he won't have any problem cramming through any legislation he wants.

He is no friend to firearms owners.

He is a threat.

People said the same of Bill, and see what happened there?

[Guest Rugerman]

Gun shows are awesome. You have to understand, to a lot of people, gun shows are entertainment....the haggling, the chatting, the browsing. Promoters don't put a table out front before the door for people in line to use for selling because....that is competition with the door. No sense in doing that. Be patient and look around. You wouldn't believe some of the deals I have walked away with!!!!!

[Guest Spuds]

I do love gun shows. I'm there to buy, but at shows close to home I get a table and lure unsuspecting folks to my table to look at my culls. While they look at them, and maybe--but not too frequently--buy one, I plant seeds in their minds that I buy similar items. They then bring them to me at the next show if the seed grows. The show after that one if not.

I get a chuckle out of folks who go to a show for a hour, hour and a half and then come here and complain how there weren't any deals and it was a waste. If you plant your carcass at a show from open to close and watch what is walking around and talk to folks, the deals fall in your lap. I realize it's hard to do for folks with young families, etc., but for those who can, it is the way to do a show.

Look first pass buy second pass works sometimes. Sometimes the item is gone before you get around the 2nd time. You'll learn soon, if it's that good a deal, best to act immediately. If not something you have to have, sometimes it will get cheaper the 2nd or 3rd pass. Nothing beats experience to know when to buy, but even with years of attending gun shows, items still get away from you.

When I first started I thought it was a crime to haggle, wouldn't be caught dead trying to get a cheaper price. Now, it's automatic--"1911 Colt .45 for $300?? Wouldya take $250?"

Another thing--first show I attended I didn't know a soul. Now I know at least half the folks there, the other half have seen me around and recognize me. Making friends and acquaintances can help too, folks bring you deals once they know what interests you. Hardly a show goes by that someone doesn't bring me an old military rifle or handgun and say that "so and so sent me over, he said you might know something about this."

Like Rugerman said -- Gun shows are awesome.

[Mike.357]

wordsworth says

I don't see Obama as a threat to gunowners and gunsellers.

What fantasy world do you live in? Try a web search of Obama+gun shows.

He is a self professed gun grabber of the first class. He has openly talked about ending the gun show loop hole. That loop hole is simply me having the ability to sell my personal property. There are already laws on the books addressing the legality of who I can sell to. Right there is his threat to gun owners and gun sellers.

Enjoy gun shows as they exist now before it is too late.

Spuds, how does one go about knowing they have found your table at the show?

Edited November 26, 2008 by Mike.357

[Guest abailey362]

Spuds, how does one go about knowing they have found your table at the show?

look for the potato???

I think we should justa ll wear t shirts with our avatars and screen names on them so we can know when we see people we know on the forum

[Guest Spuds]

One would know they have found my table when, for the first time in their lives, they feel proud of their gun show.

Or when they find Dan, who used to own Volunteer Ordnance Works (big gorilla) or "Hairy Dave", a 6'5" or thereabouts creature with a head of dark frizzy hair that appears it belongs on a neanderthal. There's no mistaking who "Hairy Dave" is, and if you could make a mistake, you could always ID him by his knives and jewelry that he sells. He usually has a Randall knife or two for sale.

My two buddies and I will be sharing a table next to Dan & Dave, near the front entrance, a few rows on the right as you go in, if Dan is in the same spot he was at the last show. Also, GA Arms was behind him at the last Jacob Building show, not sure if they will be again, as they used to always be situated at the far left end.