King of excuses

[Caster]

Not sure a rant rally belongs here but since it's a rant about tactics and training......

Ever get frustrated and even ashamed of the people in our culture? I've tried half a dozen times to get some guys together in this area for some kind of exercise and train together. Every single time it's the same thing. Excuses. I'm supposed to be the king of excuses and the weakest in a group. It's how I maintain some semblance of confidence.
I'm tired, I'm sore, the wife, work.
I guess no one in the Williamson county area expects to be faced with a fight someday.

The past few 'buddys' just wanna hump a bench, WHEN they show up.

It's sad. Lone wolf don't work. No one will ever survive on their own.

[Jamie Jackson]

Caster. I appreciate your frustration.

 

I am blessed in that there are several of us that do get together frequently. We mostly work on armed skills. I wish we could do more...and will keep trying to nudge in that direction.

And believe me I understand that life certainly will place demands on all of us. I totally believe that the priorities for most of us, at least for me, are: God-Family-Work...

 

But being able and capable of defending yourself and those entrusted to your care are a priority as well. Those skills are perishable, and more often than not an integration of various skills are required.

A fella can't just shoot someone that's being a PIA...but you gotta be able to recognize pre-assault cues, act on them, and have some other tricks in your bag besides a bang-stick.

 

But honestly, so many people "don't know,what they don't know"...

 

As I said, I know it's frustrating Caster...but there are folks out there that are like minded and share your priorities and willingness to learn. Keep looking my friend.

[ehull20000]

Even if you do find people that want to train, making sure all the personalities mesh can be tough. 

[Westwindmike]

And finding a place that will allow you to "train".

[CommsNBombs]

Even if you do find people that want to train, making sure all the personalities mesh can be tough.

I second the hell out of that.

Just because they are willing - does not mean they are able. Motivation does not always equal comprehension.

Attitude is everything - if they cannot train because their "dog got its dong stuck in the electrical socket" what the hell are they going to do when some commies are kicking in their doors?

Move to Clarksville!

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

[Jamie Jackson]

And finding a place that will allow you to "train".

 

And this^^^

 

You pretty much need private property...

[10-Ring]

Ever get frustrated and even ashamed of the people in our culture?

 

Every day of my life!

[Spots]

Self defense training is one of those things that takes time and dedication beyond what most people will afford it. My dad has been in Judo, Hapkido and Taekwondo since the very early 1980's. He has taught for several years now. I grew up in the school, earning my black belts and eventually teaching along side him. Most people will not go more than 6 months. We had many who couldn't mantain even a 2 day a week commitment for 6 months. Some will stay long enough to get their first black belt, which is about 4 years. But I can count on both hands the number who have stayed long enough and tried hard enough and trained with the intensity to actually learn it, mold it and be able to use it with the same insintict as breathing. For most modern Americans they are already running on overload as far as events classes and hobbies, so no matter how useful they can't make time for another one. It takes dedication. I've been working 7 -12's for weeks, and been extremely busy for a long time, but twice a week or more I find time to practice. You just need to find those who are as dedicated as you are.

Sent from behind the anvil

[Cruel Hand Luke]

Whether they admit it or not the majority of gun owners are just not really "gun people"....just like most hammer owners are not master builders. Most are gun owners....and that is it...gun owners....just like you might be a lawnmower owner. In fact you will actually use your lawnmower more every year than the typical gun owner uses their gun to practice. Unfortunately the majority of them view their defensive guns as magic talismans that will ward off evil with no effort required on the part of the owner. So why would they need to practice?

 

And that is largely the "American way" ..."You can have it faster and cheaper and requires no effort , attention or discipline and you will be just as good or better than people who have spent a lifetime learning to properly use the tools". We hear that all the time with appliances and new technology involving tools and sporting equipment. And technology is great (to a point) but you still have to know how to use it, and if it involves operating in concert with others THAT is a skill unto itself. Being able to point a gun muzzle and pull a trigger is the last 5% of the solution.....yet most people spend 95% of their training time (if they train at all...and MOST don't train at all) on that last 5%. The problem is that 95% DO NOT TRAIN AT ALL.....So it does get frustrating when all your homies talk big game but can't make an open spot in their schedule once in 6 months to get out and work on some skills that if you ever HAVE to use could save their life or the life of a loved one. It is easier to just stay home and watch the game than to get out and expose your weaknesses.....

 

And THAT is a big part of it. Why is it that cops don't show up on range days where the police dept supplies the ammo for FREE. Good grief....if someone gave me FREE AMMO and all I had to do was show up I'd be there early and they'd have to run me off so they could close at the end of the day. But the overwhelming majority of cops - who carry a gun for work every day and confront possible offenders everyday- are largely just not interested in getting better at operating their equipment. They look at it as an imposition on their personal time to improve their skills with a tool that if they have to use will be under life and death circumstances..... 

 

A big part is that they don't want to have to go do something they are not good at...well how the hell do you get better if you don't practice? And the same is true for the typical gun owner.....they don't want to risk embarrassment in front of their peers so they never go do any realistic training . Besides they read stuff in gun rags all the time about "all you have to do is point and pull" or "simply racking your shotgun's action will scare off the bad guys, vampires , the IRS , and other undead ghouls." So why WOULD they go expend money, time, sweat, and hard work on learning to defend themself when the NRA magazine is full of grandmas with J frames who successfully defended themselves?  

 

Because the NRA Armed Citizen section does not report losses...only wins. You never read about the people who get killed , crippled, or seriously injured...or about folks who shot someone who didn't need to be shot , or who shot a bystander because they missed their intended target.....and those things DO HAPPEN.The NRA magazine only prints the positive outcomes. And that is why we train. So that IF we are faced with a life threatening event we will already have a page in our mental rolodex that we can access where we have experienced something similar before and we have a course of action to follow...not try to make up something on the fly for a situation we have never seen before. We will also have a modicum of skill to operate the mechanical device (gun) without having to get the owners manual out and read it while we are being attacked. That is where practice comes in. And in the big picture it also makes us confident in our abilities and in ourselves and that carries over into all aspects of our lives.....but what do I know?

Edited October 22, 2015 by Cruel Hand Luke

[Spots]

Whether they admit it or not the majority of gun owners are just not really "gun people"....just like most hammer owners are not master builders. Most are gun owners....and that is it...gun owners....just like you might be a lawnmower owner. In fact you will actually use your lawnmower more every year than the typical gun owner uses their gun to practice. Unfortunately the majority of them view their defensive guns as magic talismans that will ward off evil with no effort required on the part of the owner. So why would they need to practice?

And that is largely the "American way" ..."You can have it faster and cheaper and requires no effort , attention or discipline and you will be just as good or better than people who have spent a lifetime learning to properly use the tools". We hear that all the time with appliances and new technology involving tools and sporting equipment. And technology is great (to a point) but you still have to know how to use it, and if it involves operating in concert with others THAT is a skill unto itself. Being able to point a gun muzzle and pull a trigger is the last 5% of the solution.....yet most people spend 95% of their training time (if they train at all...and MOST don't train at all) on that last 5%. The problem is that 95% DO NOT TRAIN AT ALL.....So it does get frustrating when all your homies talk big game but can't make an open spot in their schedule once in 6 months to get out and work on some skills that if you ever HAVE to use could save their life or the life of a loved one. It is easier to just stay home and watch the game than to get out and expose your weaknesses.....

And THAT is a big part of it. Why is it that cops don't show up on range days where the police dept supplies the ammo for FREE. Good grief....if someone gave me FREE AMMO and all I had to do was show up I'd be there early and they'd have to run me off so they could close at the end of the day. But the overwhelming majority of cops - who carry a gun for work every day and confront possible offenders everyday- are largely just not interested in getting better at operating their equipment. They look at it as an imposition on their personal time to improve their skills with a tool that if they have to use will be under life and death circumstances.....

A big part is that they don't want to have to go do something they are not good at...well how the hell do you get better if you don't practice? And the same is true for the typical gun owner.....they don't want to risk embarrassment in front of their peers so they never go do any realistic training . Besides they read stuff in gun rags all the time about "all you have to do is point and pull" or "simply racking your shotgun's action will scare off the bad guys, vampires , the IRS , and other undead ghouls." So why WOULD they go expend money, time, sweat, and hard work on learning to defend themself when the NRA magazine is full of grandmas with J frames who successfully defended themselves?

Because the NRA Armed Citizen section does not report losses...only wins. You never read about the people who get killed , crippled, or seriously injured...or about folks who shot someone who didn't need to be shot , or who shot a bystander because they missed their intended target.....and those things DO HAPPEN.The NRA magazine only prints the positive outcomes. And that is why we train. So that IF we are faced with a life threatening event we will already have a page in our mental rolodex that we can access where we have experienced something similar before and we have a course of action to follow...not try to make up something on the fly for a situation we have never seen before. We will also have a modicum of skill to operate the mechanical device (gun) without having to get the owners manual out and read it while we are being attacked. That is where practice comes in. And in the big picture it also makes us confident in our abilities and in ourselves and that carries over into all aspects of our lives.....but what do I know?

That describes 90% of the gun owners in my circle, even the military ones. Very few people practice regularly, and of those that do, it's a tiny number that do much more than stand and shoot statically at paper, with the occasional reload or draw practice thrown in. If I'm gonna carry something for protection, be it a firearm, a knife or my bare fist, I'm going to make my best effort at being as proficient as possible, but for some people they think waving it around is all they need to dissuade criminals

Sent from behind the anvil

[bersaguy]

Well, what I have read does cover a number of different scenario's for sure but then there are guys like me. Yea, I have old Military training which for the most part I do remember how to do it. And when I got out I did spend a fair amount of time practicing because I had a place I could do it. My grandfathers Ranch. But as the years went by and I got almost killed by a run away truck  that broke or fractured about 60% of the bones in my body and did major internal damage it is not my heart or my mine that prevents me from training now but my body.

  Doctors have told me I will be suffering from that truck for the rest of my life. They were right to a point. I was young when I got hurt and after I healed up I did go back to my training along with my mechanics work and over the years I did undergo several more surgeries to repair things that showed up in later years. In 1990 they had to implant 26 square inches of Mylex Mesh into my body just to hold my abdomen together and told me no more work and no extra strenuous activities requiring any lifting of more than a gallon of milk. 

  I did up until my eye sight began going from cataracts spend at least 3 days a week at the range with a few of my buddies and I will again soon as my eye surgeries are complete. Like I said my heart and my mine are still in a training mode but body won't allow it. 

  As far as my protecting myself and loved ones, I can still recall on my training to do that because the Adrenalin will take over and body pain will be ignored at that point.

 

 Now with that said I do understand the frustration you have Caster. This day in time most people are focusing on taking care of family by putting food on the table and a roof over their head plus many companies work people longer hours with less employees. I think the reason for having issues with finding a place to train, that comes from all the lawsuits people open themselves up to should something happen on their land. Back when we owned the Ranch/Farm there towards we sold it if we allowed anyone other than family to hunt  they had to sign a waiver agreeing not to sue if injury or death while on the property and also were responsible for any and all livestock that my be killed. You would be surprised how many people refused to sign it and didn't get to hunt.

 

I do wish you the best in your goals to get a few friends to train with you and you do find a location in which to train.......... :up: :up:

Edited October 22, 2015 by bersaguy

[peejman]

.... For most modern Americans they are already running on overload as far as events classes and hobbies, so no matter how useful they can't make time for another one......

Sent from behind the anvil

 

Truth.  Painful, but true.

[Cruel Hand Luke]

Dry fire is free....yet almost no one does it. 

[Dolomite_supafly]

We have plenty of trainers on this board who support this board, its members and have the experience needed to get any one of us, from novice to the most experienced, better equipped to handle the dangerous world we live in today.

 

And there is one right above my previous post.

Edited October 22, 2015 by Dolomite_supafly

[felinesNfreedom]

I will admit that up until late last year i never really trained. I would go shoot at a piece of paper and make sure I could hit it. Now I actually work on what I guess you could say is fighting with my weapons. Transitioning between multiple targets, Moving and shooting, engaging at close distance with one had while drawing and firing while backing away. Working on transitioning from my Rifle to pistol and back to rifle. I don't get to do it but maybe once a month or two but it's nice to know I can handle a weapon more effectively now. I have one friend that trains with me like this and I am slowly getting one of my paper punchers to transition into our training too. 

[chances R]

I hope most people who take the HCP course are told by their instructors that it is NOT a shooting class.  The primary goal is to inform the student of the current Laws of the State of TN.  There should also be a significant emphasis on gun safety.  I do give some very basic gun handling/shooting instruction, but nothing that I would consider adequate to a basic shooting course.  There simply is not enough time in an 8 hour course.  I do strongly encourage all shooters to seek out training; preferably at least once a year and shoot at least once a month.  Unfortunately most are not 'gun' people and never do so.  It really boils down to the responsibility of the gun owner, but as noted, most simply just don't know what they don't know.

[none]

Funny training is not all that expensive. Its actually a lot cheaper than using ammo. It doesn't cost anything to practice your draw aim at multiple targets and dry fire. In my opinion far to many people focus too much on hitting a ring on paper. It more beneficial than many realize to simply practice with snap caps or a confirmed unloaded weapon.

[Superman]

I would like to put together a small group to train together to. If nothing else it would make me train more like I should

[CommsNBombs]

Hell I hit MCSC in Southside every Saturday I can. Helps I got 2 Dillons online so pushing out a few hundreds rounds over a few evenings is a lot cheaper than buying in bulk.

Anyone who would like to join me Ill probably be on the steel range if the weather is nice (dry)

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[maroonandwhite]

Dry fire is free....yet almost no one does it. 

I'll admit even though I know how much dry fire helps I hate doing it. With all the comfortable chairs in my house it's hard for me to not sit in them when I get home.

[Cruel Hand Luke]

Dry fire still works while seated......I'm just sayin'.... :cool:

[maroonandwhite]

Dry fire still works while seated......I'm just sayin'.... :cool:

Haha I do practice mag changes while sitting. I just always felt weird aiming at the TV.

[Cruel Hand Luke]

There you go. That is a good start. In fact mag changes while watching TV is a good way to get your mag changes to where they are second nature and get you well on your way to not having to think about it. Instead you simply eject and insert the new one while focusing on the tv. As time goes on you get faster and smoother and not have to watch your hands to make it happen. 

 

OBVIOUSLY DO NOT HAVE AMMO PRESENT.

 

Now, just set aside some time to work on drawing and driving the gun to the target and pressing off the shot. Which shot is the most important? The FIRST one. So we should probably work on our draw and 1 shot quite a bit.

 

All you need is a single target and a place where people will not be distracting you. I set up targets in my office/ man room at home and at the end of the hall way. I remove all ammo and make sure that people are not walking into the hallway while I'm doing my dry work. As little as 15 minutes a couple of nights a week will yield results. EVERYONE can spare 30 minutes a week if they choose to. 

Edited November 3, 2015 by Cruel Hand Luke

[felinesNfreedom]

Is it time to start running group training days for us guys around Nashville? 

[bud]

. Edited January 6, 2016 by bud