Why some people shouldn't be police officers

[Guest sermon8r]

Thank You for your Service!!!!

God Bless You and Protect You in all you do!!!!

[EMTRN]

Friends

meadowmb has not made any friends yet

From his profile, not surprising.

[Guest JLowe]

This is the most ignorant post I have ever read. Quit using "The Shield" as your insight into law enforcement.

+1

[Punisher84]

Break the Code of Silence!

Corruption runs very deep when it comes to Law Enforcement.

As we all know it very similar to gang or mob

activity when it comes to the

"Code of Silence"

If you are an Honest Police Officer and you know

of corruption going on and are not reporting it,

you may as well be committing the offense your self!

Break the Code of Silence!

Help Restore the Peoples faith

in Law Enforcement!

One of the latest poles taken shows that 43%

of the American public have Lost Trust in our

Police officers.

That's almost half the population.

More people trust a used car sales man.

I'm with EMTRN, I have read some stupid crap on this site, but that takes the top prize. You are either ignorant or just trying to start an argument. Sure there is police corruption, but there are tons of hard working honorable police officers who put up with the problems of the world every damn day just to be lumped in with the corrupt by ignorant civilians like you.

I'm done listening to this stupid crap from people who have never walked a beat. Add something useful or shut up.

[Reservoir Dog]

Let the cop-haters talk out of their asses. It only proves how ignorant they are.

Thank You for your Service!!!!

God Bless You and Protect You in all you do!!!!

Big +1 to all the LEOs on TGO.

[TripleDigitRide]

Having LEO's in my family, I try to do my very best to be open-minded about subjects like these.

As a family member of, what I'd consider "decnt" LEO's, I think I have a fair grasp on what they have to go through. On the other hand, as a "normal" citizen, I know exactly what we have to go through.

For anyone to act as if the "Blue Code of Silence" isn't a huge issues, they are not being realistic with themselves.

If what little--or a lot, depending on how you look at it--I hear about the BCoS is any indication as to how bad it has become, it's a much more serious issue than most would like to admit.

Personally, I'm stuck in the middle. As a citizen, I do expect LEO's to be held to a higher standard. If they're going to punish me for something, I sure as heck don't want them turing around only to do the same thing, or something even worse.

On the other hand, I know how desperately I don't want to and can't afford to lose my job. I can only assume that, like my LEO family members, most LEO's are in the same boat. Afterall, like most of us, their job is their livelihood. Not only do they have to worry about being fired for turing in one of their "brothers" or "sisters", but sometimes being fired could be the best thing that could happen.

Often time, the fear of being ostracized or blackballed can be far worse that being fired. I know I wouldn't want to go into work only to ridiculed, berated and shunned, all for doing the right thing. Yes, doing the "right" thing is always the "right" thing to do, but sometimes the decision isn't so black and white. It's sad, but oh so very true. There is not one of us who can honestly say that we haven't turned a blind eye to wrongdoings, when we knew it wasn't the "right" thing to do.

As far as the comments made by meadowmb, I'm not sure why everyone is getting all bent out of shape. Don't kill the messenger. Like the source(meadowmb or The Shield) or not, they are not far off.

The National Institute of Ethics--the nation's largest provider of law enforcement and corrections ethics training--have done countless similar studies, and have come up with similar conclusions. The BCoS exists, and exists in a big way.

It's a lot to read, but here is some of what they came up with.

The National Institute of Ethics has concluded the most extensive research ever conducted on the police Code of Silence. Between February, 1999 and June, 2000, 3,714 officers and academy recruits from forty-two different states were asked to participate in the study by the Institute. One aspect of the research determined the views of academy recruits, while the other identified officers who had taken part in the code, then asked why and how it occurred. These findings mark the first time law enforcement has ever been able to learn the truth about this crucial problem. The significance of this knowledge is that if we can learn how to effectively control the Code of Silence, serious corruption cannot exist because many people become aware of a scandal as it expands.

Facts About Academy Recruits

Twenty-five basic law enforcement academies from 16 states took part in the research by administering and collecting 1,016 confidential questionnaires completed by academy recruits. The findings included that:

· 79% said that a law enforcement Code of Silence exists and is fairly common throughout the nation.

· 52% said that the fact a Code of Silence exists doesn’t really bother them.

· 24% said the Code of Silence is more justified when excessive force involves a citizen who’s abusive.

· 46% said they would not tell on another officer for having sex on duty.

· 23% said they wouldn’t tell on another cop for regularly smoking marijuana off duty.

Facts About Current Officers

The sampling of current officers was comprised of 2,698 fulltime officers from twenty-one different states. A total 1,116 of the 2,657 officers asked to complete a confidential questionnaire, did so. This equates to a response rate of 42 percent. An additional forty-one officers provided confidential interviews. The following facts were revealed.

· In response to “Please describe the first time you witnessed misconduct by another employee but took no action,†46 percent (532) advised they had witnessed misconduct by another employee, but concealed what they knew.

· In response to the question “At the time of the incident occurred, what did you think would happen if you revealed what had taken place?†the five reasons listed most often were: I would be ostracized (177 times); the officer who committed the misconduct would be disciplined or fired (88 times); I would be fired from my job (73 times); I would be “blackballed†(59 times); the administration would not do anything even if I reported it. (54 times)

· 73 percent of the individuals pressuring officers to keep quiet about the misconduct were leaders.

· Eight percent (40) of the 509 officers who admitted to intentionally withholding the information about officer misconduct were upper administrators. The upper administrators of the average American police department comprises only five percent of the agency.

· The average age of an officer who covered up an incident for the first time was 31.4 years of age.

· The average years of experience when they first took part in the Code of Silence was 8.2 years.

· 449 of the 532 officers were male, while 74 were female.

· Of the 532 who confessed they had participated in the Code of Silence, 252 were pressured to keep quiet by the officer(s) who committed the misconduct and 118 felt pressure from uninvolved officers. The remaining 162 officers advised they covered up the incident even though they were not pressured.

· Excessive use of force was the most frequent situation over which the Code of Silence occurs, with 217 were excessive use of force circumstances.

· The five most frequently offered solutions for controlling the Code of Silence from the 532 officers who confessed to taking part in it were: Conduct good ethics training (listed 46 times); More consistent accountability (listed 20 times); Ensure open communication between officers and leaders (listed 16 times); Provide an anonymous reporting system (listed 14 times) and Protect whistleblowers (listed 10 times).

Conclusions

1. The police Code of Silence exists.

2. Some form of a Code of Silence will develop among officers in virtually any agency.

3. The American criminal justice system and in particular law enforcement, has been negligent by not attempting to resolve the negative impact the code.

4. The Code of Silence breeds, supports and nourishes other forms of unethical actions.

5. Because the code is an essentially natural occurrence, attempts to stop it all together will be futile.

6. The Code of Silence in law enforcement is more dominant and influential than most other vocations or professions.

7. It is virtually impossible for a law enforcement agency to effectively determine how extensively the Code of Silence exists within its own organization.

8. It is now possible to identify the specific assignments and units that are most at risk to the harmful aspects of the Code of Silence.

9. Whistle-blowers are generally not supported by the administration of law enforcement agencies.

10. The use of state-of-the-art ethical dilemma simulation training can be an effective way to prevent the code’s injurious ramifications.

11. The Code of Silence among administrators, although better camouflaged and less well known, is more destructive than when non-ranking personnel do the same thing.

12. If administrators do not role model the moral courage to openly acknowledge and address misconduct when it occurs, it is much less likely that others will.

13. It should not be a priority of law enforcement or any other profession to mold a culture of whistle-blowers.

14. Establishing and perpetuating a culture that constantly analyzes to whom or where loyalties of workers are committed must become a widespread, high priority for administrators.

15. The Code of Silence typically conceals serious law enforcement misconduct for years before the corruption is revealed.

16. Some officers who participate in the Code of Silence rationalize their behavior by convincing themselves that what they are doing is not actually hurting anyone, while others intentionally replace the facts with a self-serving version because it is emotionally painful to admit the truth.

17. The majority of officers who have been in law enforcement for several years have directly participated in the Code of Silence.

18. The Code of Silence is prompted by excessive use of force incidents more than for any other specific circumstance.

19. People outside police organizations reveal the misconduct within an agency more often than it is divulged from employees.

20. The Code of Silence usually occurs within cultures created by the role-modeling of leaders.

21. The “Us versus them†mentality is usually present within the minds of those who participate in the Code of Silence.

22. The Code of Silence and the “Us versus them†phenomenon often bond together.

23. The belief that rookie officers across the nation are routinely told that one of the most basic rules they must abide by is that they can never “rat out†another officer, especially by testifying against them, is untrue.

24. When desired values are not sincerely embraced and role modeled by the leaders within an organization, the Code of Silence is more likely to occur.

25. Although structured role modeling will probably become the most effective corrective tool for preventing the Code of Silence, it will be necessary to begin the process of making change, through training.

26. A culture which acts as fertile ground for the destructive features of the Code of Silence to grow is one that promotes loyalty to people over integrity.

27. Field training officers have the ability to alter the Code of Silence in a positive fashion, if their commitment to do so is obtained.

28. Many police officers feel a great sense of alienation. This often acts as a catalyst for officers to rationalize that taking part in the Code of Silence is not particularly wrong.

29. One of the most powerful “root causes†of officers throughout the nation participating in a Code of Silence is that they deeply believe they have been victimized by their own workplace.

30. Scandals can be prevented. They result from an evolution of predictable and preventable circumstances.

31. Leaders themselves lie at the core of both the cause and solution to corruption and the Code of Silence.

32. The “rotten apple†theory that some administrators propose as the cause of their downfall has frequently been nothing more than a self-serving, superficial façade, intended to draw attention away from their own failures.

33. Historically, administrators have not had the courage to acknowledge they have integrity needs.

34. An administrative indifference toward the Code of Silence exists.

35. The widespread indifference toward integrity issues by administrators serves as the initial breeding ground for more serious consequences such as the negative aspects of the code.

36. The intentional ignoring of the Code of Silence by leaders is primarily caused by two problems: a lack of knowledge and self-centeredness.

37. Some leaders do not do more to improve ethical problems such as the Code of Silence because they believe bringing attention to their integrity needs could hurt them personally.

38. Hypocrisy and fear often dominate the culture of a law enforcement agency that has a substantial negative Code of Silence.

39. There are several overt indicators that a severe level of the Code of Silence exists with an organization.

40. At its worse, a destructive Code of Silence is both condoned and privately encouraged by supervisors and administrators.

41. All law enforcement officers would benefit from effective training that focuses on the Code of Silence.

42. Conducting quality background investigations of individuals applying to become officers can be an effective Code of Silence countermeasure.

43. The continual lack of accountability is very destructive to the culture of a police organization.

44. Some police agencies have shown they are incapable of policing themselves.

45. Supervisors should be held accountable for role modeling behavior that could encourage officers to take part in the Code of Silence.

46. Every effort should be taken to prevent employees from feeling victimized.

47. A culture must be established in which an allegiance to principles is a higher priority than loyalty to people.

48. The groups of people who have the most ability to create an organizational culture that could prevent a harmful Code of Silence are field training officers and line supervisors.

49. To be successful at preventing the Code of Silence, we must be able to develop cultures in which the bad officers are the ones who are alienated.

50. The fact that most officers feel more stress from their own supervision, than they do from simply doing their job must be resolved.

51. Every law enforcement agency throughout the nation should have a written policy that provides protections for whistle-blowers.

52. All law enforcement agencies should have written policies that mandate all employees immediately inform on any other employee who has committed any criminal offense.

53. Confidentiality must be ensured for any officer who supplies information about the serious misconduct and desires confidentiality.

54. Officers should be fired for not reporting officers who commit criminal acts.

55. Research on the Code of Silence must continue.

Controlling the Code of Silence

(how to make loyalty to principles a higher priority than loyalty to fellow officers)

Administrative Commitment If an organization intends to make a genuine effort to prevent the Code of Silence from placing loyalty to people ahead of loyalty toward principle, its leaders must have and communicate a sincere commitment to integrity.

Recruitment Recommendations Even though the areas of recruitment and hiring are not immediately associated with sustaining a non-destructive Code of Silence, they should be. If an organization hires employees who already place loyalty to principle above loyalty toward people, both serious misconduct and the Code of Silence are much less likely to occur than in departments that ignore these important issues.

Hiring Recommendations The background investigation should be viewed as the highest priority of the hiring process for most departments, for it is usually the best predictor of future employee behavior. Background investigation training must be provided to individuals who will be conducting background investigations. Hold background investigators accountable for performing a quality investigation.

Academy Training Recommendations There are many options for ethics training at a law enforcement academy that will help to control the Code of Silence. Contact the Institute to receive academy suggestions.

Field Training Officers Recommendations There are several ways that a field training officer program can help to improve the possibility that officers will be loyal to principles over fellow officers. They include establishing an effective FTO selection process; FTOs receiving training on the Code of Silence and then instructing new officers about the need for them to reject the us versus them mentality; teaching the ethical perspective for every training topic; and using ethical dilemma simulation training.

Internal Training Recommendations If a department is typical of most agencies, it has never conducted ethics training. Executive development ethics training should be developed and presented first. A fundamental portion of the training ought to be about why a Code of Silence exists and what can be done to manipulate it so it is not a destructive force. Stressing both the negative and positive repercussions is crucial.

Internal ethics training can be used as a tool to help orchestrate a peer pressure that makes unethical acts undesirable. All internal training about the Code of Silence should be presented as a form of survival training.

Additional Leadership Recommendations

· Open, honest communication must be established and maintained.

· It is imperative that all supervisors role model mission statement values.

· Employees must receive fair and consistent discipline when deserved, along with recognition and positive reinforcement for behavior consistent with sustaining a positive culture.

· Administrators must hold everyone accountable for having the courage to do what is honorable.

· A “whistleblower†policy that adequately supports and protects employees must be established.

Employee Assistance The more that officers feel as though their agency cares about them, the less they will experience the sense of victimization. The less officers believe they have been victimized, the more unlikely it is that they will rationalize unethical behavior. As the frequency of unethical acts decreases, so will the damaging component of the Code of Silence.

Organizational Culture The most powerful means for transforming the organizational culture of a law enforcement agency into an atmosphere that is consistent with employees embracing loyalty to principle above all else is a combination of leadership, role modeling and training. Role modeling by the chief administrator must come first, for what a chief or sheriff actually does is what informal and formal leaders use to decide whether they will support any attempts to improve the culture. Other actions that help to create a positive culture includes providing in-service training on developing and maintaining an internal culture of integrity, asking for the help of “informal leaders†in developing an integrity driven internal culture, harshly disciplining any supervisor who promotes the “Us vs. them†attitude and rewarding supervisors who strive to eliminate it. The fact that controlling the code will save careers and lives must be discussed and believed.

[Reservoir Dog]

Like the source(meadowmb or The Shield) or not, they are not far off.

That's completely laughable. Meadowmb's comments and The Shield are absolutely nothing like real law enforcement. Neither of you have any idea what you are talking about.

[Punisher84]

Just because a "code of silence" exists in some departments does not mean that it is ALL cops or ALL departments. I do not excuse or condone misconduct, period. Like the military, policing is not a black and white job and it is not easy. The things people don't see or deal with is what cops sweep up every day.

Putting children in body bags, being shot at, shooting at someone, constantly having to be suspicious of everyone and everything so you can (hopefully) go home to your wife/ husband and kids, and then being blamed for everything by people who have no friggin' clue what you go through every shift makes you a little different and it makes you a little cynical. So yea maybe you trade a piece of your soul for your badge, but if you're a cop that is trying to be part of the solution and not the problem then sometimes that piece is worth it.

[Guest Abominable_Hillbilly]

TripleDigitRide:

Your post was informative and mature. Thank you.

[Guest JLowe]

Did ya'll know that 87% of all statistics are made up?

I do not condone corruption, nor will I stand idly by while it occurs. What I would like to know is what states the National Institute of Ethics, who BTW has never conducted any training classes the I have been to in the past 10.5 years or provided information to be taught either, conducted their survey in. I would tend to think that it was states with larger populations and/or those who have a history of police corruption. I know that some officers, a small percent, do unlawful **** all the time. But did you know that the percentage of officers who do illegal acts is smaller than any other profession? It makes the news when a officer gets a BJ to let a girl out of a ticket. It does not make the news when a Pharmacist is putting over 100,000 prescription pills on the street a month that are narcotic based and are not given to those with a legal prescription. He was selling them out the back door so to speak.

I accept that I am held to a higher standard, any officer with any experience does too. But DO NOT put us all in the same group. DO NOT accuse us of all being corrupt. I know that it is easy for you too, but to do so, tends to make officers want to treat all citizens the same. That means he/she lumps the dopers, thieves, drug dealers, murders, rapist, child molesters, and other criminals in with honest hard working law abiding citizens like you; and none of us want that.

[Guest canynracer]

First, I would like to remind everyone that personal attacks will not be tolerated. People have differing opinions, thats what makes this forum, and America great, but please lets not get personal.

JLowe, thank you for your response - Im with ya!

I believe the original intent of this thread was for brian to simply vent some frustration. We do not have the facts about whether or not the moron that flashed the badge is actually a cop.

if he wasnt, he is a moron

if he is, he is a moron

I know brian was not trying to start a bash the LEO thread.

There are some folks on the board that make it their mission to bash cops at the mere mention of officers. Those folks need a reality check, and maybe a private island with a bunch of real hardend prisioners. Maybe then they will see the importance of Officers. OR, they will simply suit up and do the job, or shut up and stop criticizing every step the officers make to do their job safley and fairly.

To the officers on the board, thank you for your service and dedication to duty.

someone please put this thread out of its misery

Edited November 24, 2008 by canynracer

[Fallguy]

There are some folks on the board that make it their mission to bash cops at the mere mention of officers.

I agree, however there are those that seem to defend LEOs at all cost as well. Thankfully I think most of us fall somewhere in the middle, maybe slightly predisposed to one way or the other.

It seems it is almost like the Pro and Anti Glock stuff. There are staunch opinions on both sides and several in the middle.

There is nothing wrong with difference of opinions. I am good friends with a few people that they and I have very different views on things. I hope most of us are like that here and can debate the issue and not attack each other...and also realize the difference.

[deerslayer]

Well, if I am one of the ones labeled "copbasher," then so be it. This is similar to Obama supporters yelling "racist" every chance they get, though. I never generalized all cops; I just made an honest, undeniable observation about the local PD. The law simply does not apply to an alarming percentage of them here. To all the good, honest cops (and I know several), I thank you for what you do on a daily basis. Others, however, do not get my sympathy when they gripe about low pay, crappy hours, scummy work enviroment, or diry work they have to do. None were drafted into their field; all made choices to become cops knowing the pay, risks, and thankless nature of the job.

[TripleDigitRide]

TripleDigitRide:

Your post was informative and mature. Thank you.

You're very welcome.

Have a wonderful Thanksgiving.

[Guest JLowe]

Well, if I am one of the ones labeled "copbasher," then so be it. This is similar to Obama supporters yelling "racist" every chance they get, though. I never generalized all cops; I just made an honest, undeniable observation about the local PD. The law simply does not apply to an alarming percentage of them here. To all the good, honest cops (and I know several), I thank you for what you do on a daily basis. Others, however, do not get my sympathy when they gripe about low pay, crappy hours, scummy work enviroment, or diry work they have to do. None were drafted into their field; all made choices to become cops knowing the pay, risks, and thankless nature of the job.

If you don't want to be labeled something, then don't behave in a way that gets you labeled. It is not similar to Nobama supporters calling people racist who do not support Nobama. You do seem to want to put all officers into the same basket, without knowing them and what they stand for. Like I stated earlier, the percentage of officers who break the law is fewer than any other profession. And yes, that is proven and not some randomly made up statistic. When officers make poor decisions it always makes the news and stays there for a while. The funny thing about us humans is that we like to see others fail. It makes us feel better about ourselves.

I don't know where you live and what the issues with the officers and being above the law in your area. There are ways to report it if you have specific things that have occurred and evidence to prove so. Just saying they act like they are above the law and cover things up with out proof is wrong. And remember the law applies to us all, whether it is mans law or Gods law, it applies and it will catch up to them.

Most officers I know truly enjoy their jobs and like to help others. There are alot of us that feel jaded towards non-LEO's because of all the crap we deal with. If you see enough bad things from people, you start to feel like they all are that way. We all know that its not true and should not let a small percent affect how we feel and act towards the rest of the population, LEO's and Non-LEO's alike.

I hope that I will be able to change your point of view towards LEO's, we're just human too. Have a good day sir, and Happy Thanksgiving.

[deerslayer]

If you don't want to be labeled something, then don't behave in a way that gets you labeled. It is not similar to Nobama supporters calling people racist who do not support Nobama. You do seem to want to put all officers into the same basket, without knowing them and what they stand for. Like I stated earlier, the percentage of officers who break the law is fewer than any other profession. And yes, that is proven and not some randomly made up statistic. When officers make poor decisions it always makes the news and stays there for a while. The funny thing about us humans is that we like to see others fail. It makes us feel better about ourselves.

I don't know where you live and what the issues with the officers and being above the law in your area. There are ways to report it if you have specific things that have occurred and evidence to prove so. Just saying they act like they are above the law and cover things up with out proof is wrong. And remember the law applies to us all, whether it is mans law or Gods law, it applies and it will catch up to them.

Most officers I know truly enjoy their jobs and like to help others. There are alot of us that feel jaded towards non-LEO's because of all the crap we deal with. If you see enough bad things from people, you start to feel like they all are that way. We all know that its not true and should not let a small percent affect how we feel and act towards the rest of the population, LEO's and Non-LEO's alike.

I hope that I will be able to change your point of view towards LEO's, we're just human too. Have a good day sir, and Happy Thanksgiving.

Again, I never generalized all cops, only MPD. Get out of the LEO field, move to Memphis, and stay for five years. Then you may know where I'm coming from. Happy T-giving and be safe out there.

[Guest walkingdeadman]

I am going to agree that alot of cops should not be cops. It seems like I run into more cops that are a-hole jerkoffs than I do a decent cop. That is the main reason I carry...Cause I can't trust a cop.

[Guest David865]

I am going to agree that alot of cops should not be cops. It seems like I run into more cops that are a-hole jerkoffs than I do a decent cop. That is the main reason I carry...Cause I can't trust a cop.

wow thats weird, I've never ran into a bad one. Maybe its where you live, every leo I have met has been really nice.

[TMMT]

I am going to agree that alot of cops should not be cops. It seems like I run into more cops that are a-hole jerkoffs than I do a decent cop. That is the main reason I carry...Cause I can't trust a cop.

Well, your profile says you live in Memphis and I'll be the first to admit that's not a good localized example for folks to point to on either side of the LEO equation. Because they have a really bad problem with their police. And it grossly over exaggerates the actual problems that do exist in this state.

Infact Memphis's rate of misconduct per 100 officers is just a bit over 3 times as high as the state average. But then again so is their criminal rates as a whole. So maybe what we are seeing is a reflection of the local society and culture in the people hired on as cops, I can't really say.

But regardless of the rates in Memphis they do happen and must be counted towards the state as a whole.

What we also know is that Tennessee has a population of just over 6 million and ranks 16th in the US for rates of misconduct. While Ohio which has a population of just over 11 million ranks 17th. So Tennessee with half the population has a rate of misconduct that is higher than a state with twice the population.

Thats where the questions lay

[TNFF319]

Well, your profile says you live in Memphis and I'll be the first to admit that's not a good localized example for folks to point to on either side of the LEO equation. Because they have a really bad problem with their police. And it grossly over exaggerates the actual problems that do exist in this state.

Infact Memphis's rate of misconduct per 100 officers is just a bit over 3 times as high as the state average. But then again so is their criminal rates as a whole. So maybe what we are seeing is a reflection of the local society and culture in the people hired on as cops, I can't really say.

Maybe MPD forcing officers to live in the city has something to do with it, or maybe its the lowered standards.

[TGO David]

I am going to agree that alot of cops should not be cops. It seems like I run into more cops that are a-hole jerkoffs than I do a decent cop. That is the main reason I carry...Cause I can't trust a cop.

Do you realize how old this thread is?

[daddyo]

Giving someone the finger only escalates the situation. Had it turned into a physical altercation, I'm betting that you would have been held partially responsible.

It just simply isn't worth it. Far too many people don't check their side and rear view mirrors and have no clue what's going on around them. When I see one of these morons bearing down on me, I simply get over and let him go around. I'd much rather have him in front of me than behind me.

[EMTRN]

Wow, I posted in this thread 2 years ago.

[Guest Glock23ForMe]

Wow, I posted in this thread 2 years ago.

Haha.. and the wheels start rolling back...

[Il Duce]

i had something like this happen in atlanta one night after a braves game. a guy gets out of a car full of people and runs in the middle of the road and dances around with a badge of some sort. everyone stops and the car he got out of pulls out and he jumps in and they drive off.