Ohio Guns

[Pete123]

Guys,

 

I’ve had a bad experience with Ohio Guns and wanted to let you know what I found.  I became very excited about the un-issued SKS guns based on the excitement from TOG.

 

I went with Ohio Guns (their full name is Southern Ohio Guns) because the price was a little lower and they committed to provide the owners manual, oil can, sling and other things.

 

So, I placed my order.  I expected it to arrive and it didn’t, so I went and logged into their website and saw that it was on hold due to not having FFL info.  I hadn’t included that because the SKS is a C&R gun, which I thought, incorrectly, that they can ship to your home.

 

I wasn’t miffed about the hold, but rather the lack of notification.  I called them twice, though the guy who answered the phone transferred me into a black hole before I could get half of a sentence out of my mouth.

 

So, my FFL folks sent their info.  I log back in and see that the price had gone up.  Thinking it was an error, I made the second of the calls listed above, and called about five minutes before they closed and couldn’t get anyone on the phone.

 

So, I googled reviews and primarily found bad ones.  By now I was pissed and emailed them to cancel the order.

 

So, Lisa, their customer service person who really should be providing customer service for the cable company, calls me.  The gun had already shipped.  I decided to keep it based on TGO excitement, but told her that I would never purchase from them again.  She asked why and I explained the things I’ve shared so far.

 

Lisa, who should be providing customer service for the cable company, went on to explain how everything that upset me was my fault.  

 

It turned out that the price increase was for paying via credit card, though I was never informed about this.  Of course that was my fault because the order wouldn’t have gone through unless I checked that I agreed with the terms and conditions.  So, the reason their price was less is because they publish the cash price, yet don’t post  it where you will see it.

 

It turned out that they had sent an email that the order was on hold.  Of course, that was my fault because I’m responsible for checking the spam and trash folders to ensure I get their emails.  While the order confirmation emails came to my inbox, the other ones went to spam.  In looking at them, there was a note that they went to spam because Ohio Gun sends out so much spam.  

 

Most likely they don’t send spam.   However, companies that desire repeat customers look into it complaints, such as not getting emails, to find the problem and fix it.  In this case, it would involve them contacting Google to see why their valid business emails are being flagged as spam. 

 

Sadly, companies that blame their customers for not being happy with them would never think to take action to do anything to improve customer experience.

 

I’m fairly introverted and buy almost everything other than milk, eggs and frozen goods via the Internet. It is very, very rare that I have negative experiences with web commerce companies.  There is simply too much competition for them to thrive with poor customer service.  

 

I’ve been especially pleased with the service from firearms related providers.  

 

So, for whatever it’s worth, you now know my experience.

 

On the positive side, they shipped everything they said they would.  The gun is coated in cosmoline, so I haven’t done a thorough exam.   As best I can tell, it is a beautiful, unissued SKS.  

 

The gun had a note from their shipping person asking for feedback on anything I wasn't happy with.  They have a 30 day no questions asked returns policy.  

 

This leads me to believe that ownership wants happy customers, yet has delegated customer satisfaction to folks who should be providing customer service for the cable company.

 

 

Edited August 20, 2015 by Pete123

[Karnage]

I had a similar experience a few years ago. I immediately throw their sales flyers in the trash.

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/57325-southern-ohio-gun-rant/

[Hozzie]

While they should have been nicer, I don't really think any of it was their fault either though. I do agree that it never helps to blame the customer. At least you got what you ordered.

[EssOne]

Well Pete, now that you know their rules, it should be OK to go ahead and do business with them if you can save a buck. Just understand that their bedside manner sucks and let your experience work for you.  These big gun companies like SOG, Bud's, Century International, etc, can have some strange rules, so you need to look them over carefully before ordering. You just have to learn how to negotiate their individual mine fields to your own advantage.

 

P.S. In the gun community, Southern Ohio Guns is simply referred to as S.O.G.

Edited August 20, 2015 by EssOne

[Pete123]

Well Pete, now that you know their rules, it should be OK to go ahead and do business with them if you can save a buck. Just understand that their bedside manner sucks and let your experience work for you.  These big gun companies like SOG, Bud's, Century International, etc, can have some strange rules, so you need to look them over carefully before ordering. You just have to learn how to negotiate their individual mine fields to your own advantage.

 

P.S. In the gun community, Southern Ohio Guns is simply referred to as S.O.G.

 

 

This is good input - thanks.

Edited August 20, 2015 by Pete123

[LCPfraTN]

I have to agree with Hozzie...they can't do anything about how their emails are handled by your email service provider and their cash versus credit card pricing is stipulated in their terms. I will say that Bud's Guns got enough flack about this in the last that they changed their pricing presentation and show both prices now, but SOG is not as sophisticated as Bud's so I don't expect them to change any time soon. I've ordered several C&R guns from them with my license and have had no problems. I don't like that I can't easily buy non-C&R guns from them directly and have them sent to the FFL dealer of my choice...so I am a bigger fan of AIM Surplus and Classic Firearms for their ease of ordering anything, but I won't throw SOG under the bus because they do have some great deals from time to time.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Edited August 20, 2015 by LCPfraTN

[monkeylizard]

First, C&R does indeed mean they'll ship right to your door....IF you have an FFL 03 (aka a C&R license).

 

Second, I agree with you about their decpetive cash vs credit pricing. They aren't the only ones who do this and it's totally avoidable. It would be nice if they all had sites like Bud's or Kentucky Gun Co. which show both cash and credit prices at the same time, side by side, for easy comparison and very clear notice that you'll pay more for using a card. Or they can do like Prepper Gun Shop and most other e-commerce sites where there's no cash discount/card fee. But short of that, it isn't hard to have some text in bold red just below the price or the Buy button stating Cash Price Shown. Credit Card purchases will add a 3% charge. This isn't hard and prevents a TON of customer dissatisfaction. It's stupid to only show that under the terms and conditions. It's very likely that they don't keep any of the 3% bump. That's used to cover their costs from the card processing company. It doesn't benefit them in any way to hide the price difference. All it does is upset the customer.

Edited August 20, 2015 by monkeylizard

[Pete123]

Opinions on this thread are all over the board....and....they are all correct.  Companies generally provide service to the extent demanded by the market they serve.

 

There are folks on this thread who see no issue with S.O.G.'s business practices.  There are enough customers who think it is fine, or are willing to put up with it, that S.O.G. doesn't have to change.

 

There are other customers, like me, who won't accept it.  The only way I'll purchase from them again is if I can't find an item anywhere else.  

 

The longer I live, the more I see that we all have valuable skills to are a perfect fit for some jobs and the kiss of death for others.

 

I would not be a very good accountant as I'm not good with numbers and spreadsheets.  On the other hand, I've made a very good living by providing exceptional customer service and support.  

 

Clearly I have a passion for happy customers, thus I'm not willing to accept bad service myself.

 

A couple of points from the thread.  

 

*It is not a correct statement that S.O.G. can't control email after they hit the send button.  I have personally fixed this for my business.

*It is also correct that the 3% charge for using a credit card is what it costs them.  

*I certainly have no issue with the order being placed on hold due to my lack of understanding about the law.

 

It's kind of like, 'It's not what you say, it's how you say it"  I expect to know the good, the bad and the ugly up front.  I expect communication if there is a problem.    It is completely with S.O.G's power to deliver this if they want to.

 

I don't have the right to expect them to change - only to decide what I'll accept in dealing with them. 

[monkeylizard]

Yep. Too many other people with good service will take your money.

[TrickyNicky]

I'm 50/50 on SOG based on my experiences. I haven't had any interaction with a human so can't speak to their bedside table but I was heartily underwhelmed at the condition of my "very good-excellent" P1. I guess in their eyes condition is relative. Mine is in fantastic shape for a weapon used as a hammer. :rofl:

 

It's not that bad, but when AIM says VG-Excellent, you can generally rest easy knowing you're  getting a fairly clean gun. Not so IMO from SOG. Funny thing is I paid for a hand pick on that one which is something I rarely do. :rolleyes:

[DaveTN]

I’m confused. I have a C&R FFL and they will ship to my door; it’s the address on my FFL.

[btq96r]

...it isn't hard to have some text in bold red just below the price or the Buy button stating Cash Price Shown. Credit Card purchases will add a 3% charge. This isn't hard and prevents a TON of customer dissatisfaction.

 

Bingo.  All I ask is that businesses be up front with the costs and not give me a reason to do a double take when the bill is presented.  If they have reason to hide the true cost, it makes me wonder what else they're hiding.

[monkeylizard]

I’m confused. I have a C&R FFL and they will ship to my door; it’s the address on my FFL.

 

I think Pete123 thought that C&R eligible firearms could be shipped to anyone directly w/o passing through an FFL. Pete, is that correct?

 

Pete if you don't have a FFL 03 (C&R license) it's super easy to get and makes some purchases more convenient. The days of $100 milsurps by the train car load are gone, but it's still nice to have when you find a good C&R item you want, like these Yugos or the ubiquitous Mosins. C&R BONUS: Midway and Brownell's give C&R licensees dealer pricing. A few others do to. Saved me a few bucks on parts when I built my last AR.

Edited August 20, 2015 by monkeylizard

[Pete123]

Monkey,

 

Thanks for sharing about the C&R license - I think I'll get on if they are easy.

[monkeylizard]

Here's a good step-by-step guide for obtaining a C&R license.

http://www.garandgear.com/cnr_ffl_03

 

The only hassle is that you have to keep a "bound book" logging all C&R eligible purchases and sales (even if you didn't purchase it using your C&R license). That can be an actual book (available thorugh places like Brownell's) or sheets of paper in a 3-ring binder.

 

So if you buy a Mosin from a TGOer, it's an in-state face to face private sale that doesn't have to pass through an FFL. But it's still a C&R eligible item so you have to logg the purchase and any subsequent sale in your book. In theory, the BATFE can come by and check your books, but I don't know if they have ever actually done that outside of investigations where they're pretty sure someone's using the C&R license to run a firerms business.

[Pete123]

Awesome, thanks for the info.  I can keep up with a log book - that part is easy.

[monkeylizard]

For $30 for 3 years, it's still one of the best deals going. Use it once and it pays for itself by avoiding TICS and a transfer fee.

 

AIM Surplus usually has some C&R stuff in stock. Mosin revolvers, Tokarevs, Radoms, Mosin 1891/30s, Mosin M44s, various Swiss 7.5 rifles. Every now and then they get something super cool like the pre-63 FN HiPower 9mm or 1903 Springfields.

Edited August 21, 2015 by monkeylizard

[LCPfraTN]

...
BONUS: Midway and Brownell's give C&R licensees dealer pricing. A few others do to. Saved me a few bucks on parts when I built my last AR.

Unfortunately, Midway doesn't give C&R licensee's dealer pricing anymore. [emoji20]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[monkeylizard]

Ah, their shipping prices were always high anyway. No big loss to me. Brownell's seems to take all my parts money anyway.

Edited August 22, 2015 by monkeylizard

[A.J. Holst]

We acknowledge the low (er) levels of customer service at the low price big boxes in a face-to-face environment, yet expect better from the online discount retailer.

Providing excellent customer service requires a time - money investment and commitment by ownership / management through education, training and motivation.

It costs something, how much value does it add to your buying decision when comparing price.

[monkeylizard]

Actually, it doesn't cost anything to be honest and not try to hide an upcharge for using the most common method of payment.

[Pete123]

Here's my take:

• Failing to disclose costs likely to apply in a visible area is dishonest - which is far worse the bad customer service.
• Putting some effort into ensuring that business emails are delivered doesn't constitute a high level of customer service - it's very, very basic and takes little effort.  I buy almost everything online, including multiple purchases from about 20-25 firearms related vendors.  Business emails going into my spam almost never happens.  Not only is it service at the most basic level, it doesn't make good business sense as the irritate customers and lose sales.
• Arguing with customers that are making reasonable complaints is simply not acceptable.  Any big box retailer will reprimand, if not terminate, employees that argue with customers.
• I don't accept poor service from big box retailers.  I buy almost everything from Amazon, who has phenomenal service and good prices.  

Finally,  I'll deal with poor customer service if I want something badly enough.  Fortunately, that doesn't happen often.

 

Having said all of this, the poster talking about accepting less for better pricing makes good sense.  In my career, I have experience many times when customers are simply unwilling to pay for good or premium service.  He didn't say this, though it is certainly no secret that big box retailers with poor service put most of the mom and pops, who gave great service, out of business.

Edited August 22, 2015 by Pete123