Armed citizens guarding recruitment centers - legal?

[glowdotGlock]

Aren't these backwards?

Edited July 23, 2015 by glowdotGlock

[gjohnsoniv]

Aren't these backwards?

No, just cheap.

[glowdotGlock]

No, just cheap.

Ahh ok. It was hard for me to tell.

[gjohnsoniv]

Ahh ok. It was hard for me to tell.

I think the company is Sightmark or something to that effect.

[felinesNfreedom]

No, just cheap.

The guy in the yellow was the one that started my search. Thought it was on backwards. He has to lay down to shoot that thing with all the weight up front. I'm still looking for the Croc guy.

Edited July 23, 2015 by XxthejuicexX

[Dolomite_supafly]

What is truly sad about all of this is it takes something like this for things to change, if it even does. Had this not happened all those armed guards would be in handcuffs which is awful.

Anyone should be able to use whatever tools they feel they need without anyone else telling them they cannot. It is like telling a surgeon he can't use a scalpel even though it is the best tool for the job.

I wish they could have been armed with anything and everything they need to be safe here. No service member should die at the hands of the enemy at home especially when misguided policies prevent them from defending themselves.

[monkeylizard]

39-17-1308. Defenses to unlawful possession or carrying of a weapon.

 

(a)  It is a defense to the application of § 39-17-1307 if the possession or carrying was:

 

(4)  Incident to lawful hunting, trapping, fishing, camping, sport shooting or other lawful activity;

 

Other lawful activity is a pretty broad term and can cover a lot of activities.  Of course the guys are legal taking a loaded long gun from home in their vehicle because of the vehicle exemption too.

 

"Incident to" is the more important part, IMO. Carrying a loaded firearm is not "incident to" the lawful activity of standing outside a recruiting station.

 

Then again, I don't see how it's "incident to" fishing or camping either.

Edited July 23, 2015 by monkeylizard

[.357SIG]

What is the point of the bipod in the second pic? If it had a scope I would understand but it just seems like unnecessary weight to me, given his setup.

[monkeylizard]

He had an open slot on his rail, so something had to go there. Two VFGs just looked silly.

Edited July 23, 2015 by monkeylizard

[Omega]

"Incident to" is the more important part, IMO. Carrying a loaded firearm is not "incident to" the lawful activity of standing outside a recruiting station.

 

Then again, I don't see how it's "incident to" fishing or camping either.

I don't know, it can be said that being armed is incidental to standing guard at the recruiting station.  Either way, there is no way any LEO is going to interfere with them; the backlash would be swift and brutal.  It sucks that it takes and incident such as this to bring some of these lame policies to light though. 

 

Edit: I meant to add, I don't think its good for us to criticize them for their choice of weapons and their add-ons, they at least took it upon themselves to get up there and do something.  Maybe we need to contact them and bring them into the fold, then maybe they will either equip their weapons more proficiently or let us know why that's the way the like them.  I have two bipods, I used them on and off for a bit early on, not because they were cool, but because every place I shot at had nothing to support my rifle for those long shots.  I have since purchased bags, slings and even a lead sled so they go unused.

 

I did notice one of them actually had a 300Blk, he showed the mag and he had some of what looked like Hornady 125gr SST in it.

Edited July 23, 2015 by Omega

[Titansfan]

I've been in contact with the team/group leaders whom are providing security at the recruiting office in Paris.  They are of the oathkeepers group, but not all those pulling security are members of the oathkeepers.  They have invited me to pull guard duty tomorrow and I plan to be there.

 

The team leader asked if I have a rifle to keep out of view (keep in my vehicle) have a permit to carry and it's my decision to carry concealed or openly.  He also advised against wearing tactical items such as body armor and etc.  

[monkeylizard]

And so it begins:

 

http://www.stripes.com/news/us/army-to-recruiters-treat-armed-citizens-as-security-threat-1.359134

[EssOne]

And so it begins:

 

http://www.stripes.com/news/us/army-to-recruiters-treat-armed-citizens-as-security-threat-1.359134

  I'm not surprised one bit. After all, the Obama regime can't have federal agencies going around saying that citizens armed with high capacity semiautomatic rifles are a good thing, especially when they demonstrate some organization and commitment. So they're going to plant a seed of doubt as to their motives in compliance with their Anti-gun Liberals' Handbook. 

Edited July 24, 2015 by EssOne

[Ugly]

It appears the brass that the organizer instilled are starting to pee themselves.

On July 20, a policy letter from the U.S. Army Recruiting Command (USAREC) instructed recruiters to avoid contact and/or conversation with armed “law-abiding” civilians who volunteer to guard recruitment centers and to report said volunteers to law enforcement “if the recruiter feels threatened.”

Stars and Stripes responded to the letter with a July 22 headline that read, “Army To Recruiters: Treat Armed Citizens As Security Threat.”

According to Stars and Stripes, the letter came at the beginning of a week in which citizens were organizing to stand guard at recruitment stations throughout the country: “Armed citizens — some associated with activist groups and militias — were standing vigil outside recruiting centers in Wisconsin, Georgia, Tennessee, Idaho and elsewhere this week, saying they want to provide protection to service members barred from carrying firearms on duty.”

The volunteerism follows last week’s heinous attack on military offices in Chattanooga, Tennessee, whereby Mohammad Youssuf Abdulazeez allegedly drove up to one office and opened fire from inside his car before going to a second military center, where he was able to fatally shoot four Marines and one sailor. News quickly spread that the military personnel were unable to defend themselves via policies mandating gun free zones on U.S. military bases, recruitment offices, etc., so citizens stepped in to fill the gap.

The military blog This Ain’t Hell published the USAREC letter in full; here is a pertinent excerpt:

Recruiters will not acknowledge the presence or interact with these civilians. If questioned by these alleged concerned citizens; be polite, professional, and terminate the conversation immediately and report the incident to local law enforcement and complete USAREC Form 958 IAW USAREC 190-4 (SIR)

A similar posture has been struck by Marine recruitment offices in some parts of the country.

For example, the United States Marine Corps Recruiting Station in San Diego issued a statement Monday “asking local citizens not to stand guard by the recruiting offices.”

According to CBS 8 San Diego, the statement said in part:

It has come to our attention that many patriotic citizens have been standing armed guard outside recruiting stations across the country. While we greatly appreciate the support of the American public during this tragedy, we ask that citizens do not stand guard at our recruiting offices. Our continued public trust lies among our trained first responders for the safety of the communities where we live and work.

In related news, on July 22 the Times Free Press reported the Pentagon announcement that it will not be changing the policy that currently prevents “most servicemembers from being armed while on U.S. soil.”

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/07/23/army-to-recruiters-avoid-civilians-who-volunteer-to-guard-report-them/

[Glenn]

The more soldiers killed, the stronger case that can be made for gun control

[kieefer]

My question would be why?

 

I agree with all the support but why stand armed? What are the chances that they will be hit again? I think it would be pretty slim. 

 

Some nutcase muslim or anyone with a notion to could pick a theater, shopping mall, church or even play sniper out of the back of a car. 

 

The most logical defense would have any and all military service men and women, off duty personnel or not armed if they so choose to, any place anywhere. Same for police officers and civilians for that fact.

 

But we can't have that can we.  :waiting: 

[.357SIG]

I really hope this isn't true! Idiot standing guard thought it was show and tell time. http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2015/07/23/recruiting-center-shot-fired.html Edited July 24, 2015 by .357SIG

[Mike.357]

I have not seen every picture or every placement of an armed guard,  but from the limited pics I have seen these guys are the first ones shot.  Standing right out in front. Sitting ducks.

 

Good intent that would end with bad consequences.

Edited July 24, 2015 by Mike.357

[monkeylizard]

Christopher A. Reed, 28, of Lancaster, was charged with discharging a firearm in the city limits, and was issued a summons to appear in Fairfield County Municipal Court on Tuesday, according to the police incident report. Reed told police that he was holding his rifle outside the recruitment center when someone asked if he could take a look at it. Reed agreed, and while he was trying to clear the ammunition from the weapon, he accidentally fired one shot into the asphalt pavement. The only damage was a hole in the pavement. The rifle was taken from Reed pending his appearance in court, the incident report says. Conviction on the fourth-degree misdemeanor is punishable by a maximum of 30 days in jail. Reed was convicted of the same offense in 2013, and was fined $50, court records show.

 

Brilliant!

[monkeylizard]

Some nutcase muslim or anyone with a notion to could pick a theater,

 

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/89502-gunman-opens-fire-in-lafayette-la-movie-theater/

 

You sir, are psychic.

[kieefer]

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/89502-gunman-opens-fire-in-lafayette-la-movie-theater/

 

You sir, are psychic.

 

No sooner than I posted this I saw the headline.  :shrug: 

 

What can I say, should have had armed guards at the theater huh?

Edited July 24, 2015 by kieefer

[DaveTN]

Murfreesboro police spokeswoman Amy Norville said “we have not, to my knowledge, been asked to approve or ban (the armed civilians’) presence.

“That is private property and as long as the shopkeepers or customers of that building do not have a problem with them they are OK to be there and we have not received any calls to dispatch regarding them,” Norville said in an email to The Daily News Journal. “As long as they are not threatening anyone they are within their rights to be there.

http://www.dnj.com/story/news/2015/07/20/armed-civilians-stand-guard-boro-recruiting-offices/30428097/

Several people stopped by the recruiting center to thank the volunteers, and Woodard said they have been in contact with Murfreesboro Police.

Woodard added that he hopes Haslam looks into changing security policies that would allow servicemen to arm themselves at recruiting centers.

Haslam can't do much (if anything); its the military not the state saying they can't be armed.

[Titansfan]

This morning I stood guard at the recruiting center in Paris, TN.  Made contact with the leaders of the guard duty, whom are in a group called the Oathkeepers (for which, I am not a member), I told them I'd do the duty Friday morning (today).  Duty was simple was sitting out front of the center.  The guard leaders requested that long guns not be seen, but whatever I had in my truck was fine.  I had my AR-15 with three 30-round magazines available.  I do have my permit to carry and carry concealed with my shirt over my Glock 17.

 

As the office opened, I met with the Army recruiters, a SGT and SSG both with combat patches, one with a CIB.  The SGT has the CIB but hasn't put it on, he also has a Purple Heart.  They expressed their appreciation for me and told me to make myself at home.  While at my station, a man in a truck drove up and got out with a bottle of cold water and thanked me for what I was doing.

 

When the recruiters departed, I left since I was not going to be there to guard an empty building, I am there to protect the recruiters.  

 

I did not have any negative feedback or comments while I stood guard.

[bersaguy]

http://www.dnj.com/story/news/2015/07/20/armed-civilians-stand-guard-boro-recruiting-offices/30428097/
Haslam can't do much (if anything); its the military not the state saying they can't be armed.

He cannot arm the recruiters but he can arm the National Guard but refuses to do it because the state has to pay the bill to have National Guard activated and money means more than lives to the piece of Slim. Besides that why pay for something when your getting it in most areas for free???????....................jmho

[DaveTN]

He cannot arm the recruiters but he can arm the National Guard but refuses to do it because the state has to pay the bill to have National Guard activated and money means more than lives to the piece of Slim. Besides that why pay for something when your getting it in most areas for free???????....................jmho

I don’t understand? Why would the National Guard have to activated for recruiters to carry?
And is the Tennessee Army National Guard not a component of the United Sates Army?