Code of Conduct

[Jcoop]

IDPA addresses incidents at competitions

The headquarters staff and leadership of the International Defensive Pistol Association was made aware of two incidents that took place at two separate IDPA sanctioned competitions a few weeks ago, both of which raise concerns. The first involves questionable behavior viewed by witnesses as a violation of the Code of Conduct. The second involves a reshoot and the accompanying appeals process.

Regarding the first, IDPA implemented the Code of Conduct to insure appropriate sportsmanlike behavior at our competitions. This Code of Conduct is meant for the benefit of all members and violations of the Code are to be taken seriously. IDPA received complaints of belligerent and vulgar behavior by an individual during, and in relation to, a match, which cannot be tolerated, especially when such behavior takes place in front of junior shooters and women attending the match as guests.

The Code of Conduct is in place to maintain an appropriate competitive environment for match staff, competitors and our guests. If the reports received are indeed accurate, this matter is of growing concern to IDPA Headquarters and the incident remains under review.

The second incident involves the issuing of a reshoot and the official appeals process that preceded the awarding of that reshoot. Headquarters has reviewed the matter and interviewed many participants with direct and indirect involvement. While no member of the IDPA Headquarters Staff was in attendance to witness the event, and therefore in no position to overrule the final decision, it is clear from the numerous accounts received that there were several contributing factors that compounded to undermine competitor and staff confidence in the officiating process.

Whether you agree or disagree with the final decision, it was the handling of the process that put both competitors and staff in a position that should have been avoided, and it exposed a clear weakness in the processing of an appeal that IDPA needs to address.

Though the appeals process is fairly new to IDPA, it is not one foreign to experienced shooting sports competitors. However, the slow execution of the appeal review process and the subsequent disposition of the final judgment demonstrated a systemic weakness in our overall ability to judiciously carry out an appeal.

To insure that at future matches the appeal process is handled from start to finish with the efficiency and fairness that both match staff and competitors expect and rely on, IDPA will address the proper handling of an appeal through education of our Area Coordinators and their Delegates so that they may properly support the staff and competitors at upcoming matches in their regions.

While these two events are unrelated, having taken place at separate events in separate states, both, if left unaddressed, threaten to erode the confidence our members should have in their sport. IDPA will work to prevent these types of events from happening in the future and to maintain the integrity of our sport.

[dlmeadows]

Too many titty babies in shooting sports lately...

[Monkeyman2500]

I hope they continue to strain the importance of sportsmanship at these events. The lack of sportsmanship in professional athletes is a terrible example to kids these days. Also the involvement of firearms should require some extra maturity.

[Cruel Hand Luke]

Also the involvement of firearms should require some extra maturity.

Good luck with that......

[Wiljo05]

Most of the "scenes" I've witnessed are due to one of two things. They either think they are better than others (ego problem) or its to attempt to make up for shooting poorly. Either way it's a lose-lose situation and all that comes from it is damage to the sport and fellow competitors. Nothing makes a person new to competitive shooting want to come back and play again like witnessing someone acting stupid because they think they are entitled to...

Let your shooting speak for you, and if you have a bad day (which we all tank stages/matches at some point) take it as a learning and training opportunity to get better.

[Jcoop]

Most of the "scenes" I've witnessed are due to one of two things. They either think they are better than others (ego problem) or its to attempt to make up for shooting poorly. Either way it's a lose-lose situation and all that comes from it is damage to the sport and fellow competitors. Nothing makes a person new to competitive shooting want to come back and play again like witnessing someone acting stupid because they think they are entitled to...

Let your shooting speak for you, and if you have a bad day (which we all tank stages/matches at some point) take it as a learning and training opportunity to get better.

Truer words have never been spoken.

[dlmeadows]

I only cuss while I'm shooting. After the match or stage is over I'm happy. But it's that 20ish seconds of gun fire that causes me to lose my temper

[monkeylizard]

IDPA received complaints of belligerent and vulgar behavior by an individual during, and in relation to, a match, which cannot be tolerated, especially when such behavior takes place in front of junior shooters and women attending the match as guests.

 

I'd say that was poorly worded. What about women attending as competitors? And why single out women? Does IDPA think their sensitive widdle ears can't handle the man talk?

[Jcoop]

I'm thinking it was much more than just man talk, the "woman" I've come in contact with at matches kinda expect the language with all the testosterone in the air. That's not to say it's ok, cause I let them fly out all over the place, it's a bad habit of mine but I do try and show some respect to others and tone it down.

[Jonnin]

reshoots should be very limited ... to things like stage failure... you know, the wind blows all the targets over for you sort of things. 

 

Unsporting behavior should earn you a trip home.  The occasional impolite word should be treated same as daytime radio ... a few get through and its no big deal, when it goes past that, the director should take matters in hand and restore a positive atmosphere, and constant repeat offending should earn a go-home.

 

I was also a bit shocked at the wording....   its kind of discouraging toward female shooters.   

 

the sports have drifted from their roots into a hard core competitive environment.   It was inevitable I suppose, but the fun factor goes away when people start getting all bent out over scores and rules. 

[Monkeyman2500]

Good luck with that......

I bet disqualifying even the top competitors for unsportsmanlike conduct would quickly set the standard.

[DMark]

Wonder why IDPA sent out the email with so little detail.  I for one would like to know the background on the re-shoot problem.

 

So what happened? 

[173rdABN]

Sand in a lot of vaginas happened.

[dlmeadows]

It's the shooters that act like entitled little spoiled babies that have me questioning if I'll ever volunteer to work another major match. I guess if everyone quits nobody will have anything to bitch about. Safety officers aren't perfect, they miss calls and sometimes make the wrong call if you don't agree with their call discuss it with them like a civilized person not a Jackass

[BrasilNuts]

...if you don't agree with their call discuss it with them like a civilized person not a Jackass

Sounds like I missed a fun match.

[peejman]

Forgive my ignorance...   is there money on the line at these matches?  If so, how much?  I can't find any reference to prize money even at the national championship, but perhaps my google-fu is broken. 

[dlmeadows]

No just a $10 trophy and bragging rights. It's an ego game

[Cruel Hand Luke]

I bet disqualifying even the top competitors for unsportsmanlike conduct would quickly set the standard.

It would....but they'll never do it.....

[LagerHead]

Forgive my ignorance...   is there money on the line at these matches?  If so, how much?  I can't find any reference to prize money even at the national championship, but perhaps my google-fu is broken. 

 

Like DL said above me, no money. And any prizes that are awarded are by random drawing, not by ranking in the match.

[DMark]

the sports have drifted from their roots into a hard core competitive environment.  

 

Agree!  In the beginning of IDPA the focus was strong local clubs and their matches.  It was an environment to practice your conceal carry skills.  Today I feel its now driven by outside money looking to sponsor larger events in order to have an advertisement venue for their products. 

 

It's the shooters that act like entitled little spoiled babies that have me questioning if I'll ever volunteer to work another major match. I guess if everyone quits nobody will have anything to bitch about.

 

This is the reason I no longer will SO a sanctioned match.  Somebody trying to get a match-bump to Sharpshooter, bitching you out over a cover call that you made (which the 75 - 100+ other shooters didn't have a problem with) is not my idea of good sportsmanship.

 

 

Forgive my ignorance...   is there money on the line at these matches?  If so, how much?  I can't find any reference to prize money even at the national championship, but perhaps my google-fu is broken. 

 

Yes.

 

For the Pro Shooters.

 

Once IDPA allowed sponsored shooters in its matches with their colorful NASCAR Shirts (It was once forbidden in IDPA to even wear a T-Shirt with a firearm industry logo) the focus shifted to these folks - - - just look at the IDPA website.  These Pros make money (cash bonus) from their sponsorships when they win or place in a sanctioned match.  The higher Tier the match is, the bigger the payout. 

 

 

[Cruel Hand Luke]

Wonder why IDPA sent out the email with so little detail.  I for one would like to know the background on the re-shoot problem.

 

So what happened? 

At the Carolina Cup a shooter (who was in the running to win his class and division) failed to engage a target and took the resultant penalties (5 seconds for failure to neutralize and probably 5 seconds for the "misses").

 

He argued that since the SO did not specifically point out that specific target during the walk through that the walk through was "faulty" even though no one else in his squad who went before him failed to engage the target.  They tell you how many targets there are and how many minimum rounds must be fired during the walk through. The SO said that was not grounds for a reshoot. The shooter took it to the Match Director who said that not seeing a target is not a reason for a reshoot. He then appealed that to the Area Coordinator who over ruled the Match director (in clear conflict with IDPA rules) and the shooter got a reshoot and ended up winning the class and division since he was no longer saddled with 10 seconds worth of penalties for his dumb mistake earlier.... a lot of people thought this was pretty dirty and felt like the 2nd place shooter (who should have been 1st) got hosed. 

 

So essentially "if you argue long and hard enough to enough people you will eventually get your way...especially if you are a sponsored shooter" is the message being sent. But per IDPA rules you do not get a reshoot for making mental mistakes on a stage....if you did, then IDPA owes me about 50 reshoots.... :D

Edited July 1, 2015 by Cruel Hand Luke

[DMark]

per IDPA rules you do not get a reshoot for making mental mistakes on a stage....if you did, then IDPA owes me about 50 reshoots.... :D

 

I would have gotten at least two re-shoots at Manchester this past Sunday if mental mistakes allowable!  :rofl:

[chances R]

.........and a simple match would take 30 days to complete    :wall:

[Spiffy]

I'm only an ass-hat on Facebook..........hush up Jcoop and DMeadows!

 

The people who have shot with me know I'm a nice person despite my "internet persona".  Like I said on facebook IDPA is a game and some people cheat. 99 times outta 100 they get caught or it bites them in the butt on their run. 

[Spiffy]

At the Carolina Cup a shooter (who was in the running to win his class and division) failed to engage a target and took the resultant penalties (5 seconds for failure to neutralize and probably 5 seconds for the "misses").

 

He argued that since the SO did not specifically point out that specific target during the walk through that the walk through was "faulty" even though no one else in his squad who went before him failed to engage the target.  They tell you how many targets there are and how many minimum rounds must be fired during the walk through. The SO said that was not grounds for a reshoot. The shooter took it to the Match Director who said that not seeing a target is not a reason for a reshoot. He then appealed that to the Area Coordinator who over ruled the Match director (in clear conflict with IDPA rules) and the shooter got a reshoot and ended up winning the class and division since he was no longer saddled with 10 seconds worth of penalties for his dumb mistake earlier.... a lot of people thought this was pretty dirty and felt like the 2nd place shooter (who should have been 1st) got hosed. 

 

So essentially "if you argue long and hard enough to enough people you will eventually get your way...especially if you are a sponsored shooter" is the message being sent. But per IDPA rules you do not get a reshoot for making mental mistakes on a stage....if you did, then IDPA owes me about 50 reshoots.... :D

 

The shooter posted his side of it and said the reshoot was given because the SO who gave him bad instruction defaced his score sheet by marking out his score and he challenged that after all the other stuff.  What I took away from his side and the Chief of Chief of SOs at the match is if the Chief of Chief SO had let the Stage SOs gone over the stage like they for all the other squads then brought up whatever it was he was on the stage to talk about (cover issue or something that the Stage SO said they hadn't had any issues with before he showed up) that none of this would have happened.