EMP has the Government Worried

[broox]

Everybody seems to be missing the worst part of this scenario:NO TGO.

[Jonnin]

I do not think even an old car would survive.  It might.   Various electrical pieces might be taken out, though, it could pop the spark plugs or fry the starter motor or whatever, its unpredictable and hard to say.   It can melt wires and such.   And might get sparks in the gas tank etc too on a really bad day.

[seax]

One of the many things I don't have to worry about. Pacemaker.

[Hammer285]

Our 4 year old daughter has Type I Diabetes and is insulin dependent. She was diagnosed back in November and it has totally changed my plans for SHTF.

 

The thing that worries me the most about the grid going down is no electricity for the refrigerator to keep her backup vials of insulin between 36-46 degrees F. I've been looking around for smaller solar powered coolers and such, but haven't had much luck finding them. 

 

Should the unthinkable happen, it looks like I'll be digging a very deep hole to get cooler ground temps and keep it stored there.

[Wingshooter]

Our 4 year old daughter has Type I Diabetes and is insulin dependent. She was diagnosed back in November and it has totally changed my plans for SHTF.
 
The thing that worries me the most about the grid going down is no electricity for the refrigerator to keep her backup vials of insulin between 36-46 degrees F. I've been looking around for smaller solar powered coolers and such, but haven't had much luck finding them. 
 
Should the unthinkable happen, it looks like I'll be digging a very deep hole to get cooler ground temps and keep it stored there.

What temp does a good root cellar maintain? Maybe dig one of those proactively. I've been thinking about building one

[Moped]

Our 4 year old daughter has Type I Diabetes and is insulin dependent. She was diagnosed back in November and it has totally changed my plans for SHTF.

 

The thing that worries me the most about the grid going down is no electricity for the refrigerator to keep her backup vials of insulin between 36-46 degrees F. I've been looking around for smaller solar powered coolers and such, but haven't had much luck finding them. 

 

Should the unthinkable happen, it looks like I'll be digging a very deep hole to get cooler ground temps and keep it stored there.

 

Hammer, sorry to hear about your daughter.  Diabetes is a horrible thing to have.  My wife is now also dependent on insulin.  I'm not sure digging a hole would get you where you need to be.  Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but a cave temperature will usually be at a steady temperature of 58 degrees F or so.  I doubt a hole in the ground would be any colder, unless it were winter time.

Edited May 8, 2015 by Moped

[Caster]

Thank God my Aimpoints won't need batteries till the grid is back .....

 

 

Wouldn't the emp fry those?

 

 

Iron sights are EMP proof.  

[Moped]

I really don't like a firearm without iron sights.  That being said, I am presently looking to trade one of my ARs for a .308 tactical bolt of semi auto rifle.  I know that any bolt gun like that won't have iron sights.

[dawgdoc]

With any form of transportation, be it a working vehicle, bicycle or horse, you might as well put a huge target on your back. Everyone is going to want it and they'll be more than willing to kill you to get it.

Like being the one guy with a pickup that everyone needs to help move stuff. X100.

[Mark A]

Our 4 year old daughter has Type I Diabetes and is insulin dependent. She was diagnosed back in November and it has totally changed my plans for SHTF.
 
The thing that worries me the most about the grid going down is no electricity for the refrigerator to keep her backup vials of insulin between 36-46 degrees F. I've been looking around for smaller solar powered coolers and such, but haven't had much luck finding them. 
 
Should the unthinkable happen, it looks like I'll be digging a very deep hole to get cooler ground temps and keep it stored there.

A zeer pot might buy you some time in all but the hottest months. At that point a mountain stream would be nice to have. I'm guessing your best option is going to be continuing advances in medical technology

I'm sure other options can be found in a pinch. Having a jug or 2 of compressed anything but especially refrigerant would be helpful

[dawgdoc]

Hammer285,

 

Have you read "Lucifer's Hammer?"  It's about a comet that hits the Earth and the resulting TEOTWAWKI scenario.  There is one character, an overweight scientist, who sees what is coming and shows up at one of the surviving communities with knowledge on how to make insulin, as well as other knowledge learned from Foxfire books.  He says something to the effect of, "All I need is one sheep a month."  From what I know, making insulin is doable, but I'm sure it is complicated (extracting it from animal pancreases) and something that one might learn before they needed it.

[Moped]

Lucifer's Hammer was the first post apocalyptic book I read. Excellent read!!!

[Hammer285]

Thanks for the ideas.

 

I looked into the Root Cellar - but we have a small yard with too many large trees. I saw something about zeer pots the other day - that might work in the cooler months like you said. I've seen some other products that can keep things around 50 degrees using evaporation, but that is too warm and requires constant breeze, etc.

 

Still looking at other solutions. We're close to Old Hickory Lake so having a cold water source wouldn't be too hard to come by, would just need a way to keep it deep and be retrievable. 

 

In the meantime I'll probably get a generator and smaller fridge for a short term (non-emp) power outage. We have stocked up one years' supply of her long term insulin and 10 months of the fast acting. A lot of things to consider. But I think Mark is right - advances in medical technology are probably the best long term solution. 

[fourteentwo]

Thanks for the ideas.

I looked into the Root Cellar - but we have a small yard with too many large trees. I saw something about zeer pots the other day - that might work in the cooler months like you said. I've seen some other products that can keep things around 50 degrees using evaporation, but that is too warm and requires constant breeze, etc.

Still looking at other solutions. We're close to Old Hickory Lake so having a cold water source wouldn't be too hard to come by, would just need a way to keep it deep and be retrievable.

In the meantime I'll probably get a generator and smaller fridge for a short term (non-emp) power outage. We have stocked up one years' supply of her long term insulin and 10 months of the fast acting. A lot of things to consider. But I think Mark is right - advances in medical technology are probably the best long term solution.

What about one of those gas refrigerators? Lehmans is one brand I think they use them for RVs

[Trekbike]

Thanks for the ideas.

 

I looked into the Root Cellar - but we have a small yard with too many large trees. I saw something about zeer pots the other day - that might work in the cooler months like you said. I've seen some other products that can keep things around 50 degrees using evaporation, but that is too warm and requires constant breeze, etc.

 

Still looking at other solutions. We're close to Old Hickory Lake so having a cold water source wouldn't be too hard to come by, would just need a way to keep it deep and be retrievable. 

 

 

 

Have you looked at the Frio coolers?   I've link directly to the "how it works page".   It claims if you can submerge in cool water for 5-15 mins it will keep the insulin at the safe range for at least 45 hours even in 100 F environment.   Looks affordable too.  

 

http://www.frioinsulincoolingcase.com/how-the-frio-insulin-cooling-case-works.html 

[mikegideon]

I noticed that they didn't mention what bad shape our power grid is in. Our current grid is overloaded, seriously out dated and poorly maintained. There is real concern that something as simple as a large storm could cause a cascade failure which could take out large parts of the country. 

 

In all the possible disaster scenarios, This one scares me the most. In a physical disaster, tornado, earthquake or even an attack of some sort, people tend to pull together to dig out, help each other and put things back together. 

But if the power were to suddenly go out, no TV, radio or internet. No information.  Confusion would turn to fear. Fear would turn to panic as supplies started to dwindle. And then we would start turning on each other. Scares the hell outta me.

 

There will be radio and TV, whether there is a grid or not, at least until we run out of diesel. Not a lot of battery TV receivers, so mostly all radio. 

[Hammer285]

I feel like I have hijacked the EMP thread with the insulin topic. I should probably just start a new one devoted to that alone  :hijack:  haha. I thank you all for the information. I believe I have what I need to get an action plan together. 

Have you looked at the Frio coolers?   I've link directly to the "how it works page".   It claims if you can submerge in cool water for 5-15 mins it will keep the insulin at the safe range for at least 45 hours even in 100 F environment.   Looks affordable too.  

 

http://www.frioinsulincoolingcase.com/how-the-frio-insulin-cooling-case-works.html 

I checked those out, but they only work at keeping current vials cool enough - but unused need to be cooler.

 

What about one of those gas refrigerators? Lehmans is one brand I think they use them for RVs

I'm going to have to check those out.

 

Hammer285,

 

Have you read "Lucifer's Hammer?"  It's about a comet that hits the Earth and the resulting TEOTWAWKI scenario.  There is one character, an overweight scientist, who sees what is coming and shows up at one of the surviving communities with knowledge on how to make insulin, as well as other knowledge learned from Foxfire books.  He says something to the effect of, "All I need is one sheep a month."  From what I know, making insulin is doable, but I'm sure it is complicated (extracting it from animal pancreases) and something that one might learn before they needed it.

SHTF....

Step 1: Run to Pharmacy and buy all insulin.

Step 2: Find a solution to keep it cool enough for their 2 year shelf life.

Step 3: Find an overweight scientist and some livestock  :stir:

[Tobashadow]

I feel like I have hijacked the EMP thread with the insulin topic. I should probably just start a new one devoted to that alone :hijack: haha. I thank you all for the information. I believe I have what I need to get an action plan together.
I checked those out, but they only work at keeping current vials cool enough - but unused need to be cooler.

I'm going to have to check those out.

SHTF....
Step 1: Run to Pharmacy and buy all insulin.
Step 2: Find a solution to keep it cool enough for their 2 year shelf life.
Step 3: Find an overweight scientist and some livestock :stir:

I've been watching alot of videos with people living in converted vans 24/7 and the most popular setup is a solar panel into a small bank of 3-4 batteries into a 12volt refrigerator and freezer.

The panel is not very big, about half the size of the top of a full size van.

The best battery seems to be used ones from cell towers. Small and sealed with a extremely long (10+ year) run life.

These guys run off the grid with everything with that setup and most have a small generator for cloudy days but most end up never using it with the panel mounted even flat on the roof getting enough.

What I've learned is three things.

Get too big of a panel.

Get good industrial batteries.

Use 12v items because converters waste power. Edited May 9, 2015 by Tobashadow

[Moped]

There will be radio and TV, whether there is a grid or not, at least until we run out of diesel. Not a lot of battery TV receivers, so mostly all radio.

That will last about 24 to 48 hours. Same for hospitals.

As for the grid, I can tell that TVA is working hard to fortify their portion of the grid from cyber attack.

[Moped]

I feel like I have hijacked the EMP thread with the insulin topic. I should probably just start a new one devoted to that alone :hijack: haha. I thank you all for the information. I believe I have what I need to get an action plan together.
I checked those out, but they only work at keeping current vials cool enough - but unused need to be cooler.

I'm going to have to check those out.

SHTF....
Step 1: Run to Pharmacy and buy all insulin.
Step 2: Find a solution to keep it cool enough for their 2 year shelf life.
Step 3: Find an overweight scientist and some livestock :stir:

No worries!!! There's been some good ideas thrown out and that's what this is all about!

[Moped]

Solar power might be the way to go for running a refrigerator!

Speaking of solar panels, I was driving up 11E this afternoon between Four Way In and Strawberry Plains and noticed a about an acre sized solar farm, right on the side of the highway. Anyone know anything about it? The panels lomed to be about 4'x8'.

[mikegideon]

That will last about 24 to 48 hours. Same for hospitals.

 

Your source for that info?

[Moped]

I speced a gen set for a client with a 48 hour tank several months ago. Pretty large. Granted the smaller the generator the smaller the tank, but most places aren't going to want to spend a lot of money on fuel that will go bad in a year or two.

I suggested going with natural gas, but this client didn't want that. Had to be diesel. Edited May 10, 2015 by Moped

[mikegideon]

I have six of them here in Nashville. Each has hundreds of gallons, and up to 1000 gallon capacity. Most will go way past 48 hours. During the Katrina aftermath, we refuelled them (along the Gulf coast) while they were running, and kept them going for weeks. we had our own supply lines, so there was no danger of running out of fuel. FWIW, the federal government was real interested in keeping us on the air, and called me every day or so to get status reports. LOTS of radios hooked to car batteries out there.

 

FWIW, my cell service wasn't so good.

 

BTW... Natural gas is a bad choice, because they tend to shut the gas lines down during most disasters. So, it's the opposite of what you would think in terms of reliability. It's why we have diesel fuel on top of skyscrapers in NYC.

Edited May 10, 2015 by mikegideon

[Rhodewarrior]

After thinking about how I could survive, I realized my gun safe is electronic!!  No hunting or protection with a firearm.  I guess I would have to use my bow or trade out the safe for a mechanical lock. :doh: