Giving the PoPo the bird

[Ugly]

I came across this story and besides the scenario where the drivers girlfriend had her head in his lap, the deputy said the driver used an improper hand signal because his arm was out the window and middle finger out. 

 

I had a deputy tell me that it's not illegal to give someone the bird but he did say as a man, he wouldn't take it very long. Which I can understand. 

 

Personally I can't remember the last time I gave anyone the bird, I'd rather use words in the form of conversation to address the issue. Unless the organizers bus drove by, I wouldn't hold back.

 

So my question is; is giving the bird a violation of law or just immature ethics?

[btq96r]

I came across this story and besides the scenario where the drivers girlfriend had her head in his lap, the deputy said the driver used an improper hand signal because his arm was out the window and middle finger out. 

 

I had a deputy tell me that it's not illegal to give someone the bird but he did say as a man, he wouldn't take it very long. Which I can understand. 

 

Personally I can't remember the last time I gave anyone the bird, I'd rather use words in the form of conversation to address the issue. Unless the organizers bus drove by, I wouldn't hold back.

 

So my question is; is giving the bird a violation of law or just immature ethics?

 

It's just immature.  Besides if an officer can't summon the patience to deal with someone flipping them off and "wouldn't take it very long," I don't want that person wearing a badge, and the powers that come with it.

[peejman]

Being an asshole isn't illegal.

[dralarms]

Reminds me of an old tale.

THP officer was ticketing a gentleman for running a stop sign. No big deal, this young punk ride by on a harley, flipped the officer off and proceeded to ride off. Officer goes after him and the young punk says "you can't ticket me for flipping you off, it's my first amendment right"

The officer, being a really smart man, says "you are right sir, I'm ticketing you for improper use of hand signals, you motioned a left turn and then stayed straight"

The ticket stuck.

[Dolomite_supafly]

You might get hit for a disorderly conduct charge if the officer decides to be a dick.

[Ugly]

I forgot to post the link. The LEO's were in an armored vehicle too

http://www.ocala.com/article/20150413/ARTICLES/150419881

[Ted S.]

Being an asshole isn't illegal.

It seems to be a requirement for most fields these days.

[btq96r]

I forgot to post the link. The LEO's were in an armored vehicle too

http://www.ocala.com/article/20150413/ARTICLES/150419881

 

Judas Priest.  An armored vehicle for a traffic stop? 

 

As if the whole thing didn't have enough of a Fallujah vibe to it, check out how one of the officers was decked out for battle enforcing the law.  That’s a US Marine Corps camouflage pattern under all that body armor designed to protect against IED shrapnel, which I’m sure they see plenty of in Gainesville, Florida.

 

[Dolomite_supafly]

That is the militarization of Law Enforcement. And yet another reason why people hesitate to approach or talk to officers. I know I would not even give a nod to an officer looking like that.

[npgunner]

That is the militarization of Law Enforcement. And yet another reason why people hesitate to approach or talk to officers. I know I would not even give a nod to an officer looking like that.

It certainly doesn't help the PR-disaster law enforcement has under gone recently ...

[btq96r]

That is the militarization of Law Enforcement. And yet another reason why people hesitate to approach or talk to officers. I know I would not even give a nod to an officer looking like that.

 

I'll go one further.  If I'm ever stopped by a team that looks like that, I'm not saying anything, at all.  I'll hand them my license, registration and insurance as required by law on request, and sign a citation if given one.  But I won't answer any questions, or say anything else to the officers.

 

If that's policing, I'm not cooperating with it.

[Ugly]

I defiantly don't dig the militant vibe, to protect and serve whom?

Operation Jade Helm...... Edited April 14, 2015 by Still Ugly

[btq96r]

I defiantly don't dig the militant vibe, to protect and serve whom?

Operation Jade Helm......

 

Jade Helm is just an exercise for SOF troops who actually need the training in varied operating environments to keep sharp.  These LEO's are just dressing up in whatever looks good from the latest tacticool catalog, purpose immaterial.  That's why you see things like the shoulder protectors meant to protect from shrapnel from IED's. 

 

It's a joke to those of us who can pick apart their kit and configuration.  Their desert boots will be replaced by clown shoes should they ever need to put their fashion into action.  I especially love how the guy I posted the pic of has an admin pouch over his mag pouches.  $5 says he has Snickers bars taking priority over magazines. 

[Ugly]

Btr, that's my point about Jade Helm. Is it training for over seas or to familiarize the locals? Why would these guys be dressed for battle? Edited April 14, 2015 by Still Ugly

[Monkeyman2500]

Poor choices all the way around. Not sure who looked like the bigger looser in that situation. Edited April 14, 2015 by Monkeyman2500

[Chucktshoes]

Poor choices all the way around. Not sure who looked like the bigger looser in that situation.

Yet only one of the losers has qualified immunity protections for the violence he engages in daily as part and parcel of his job. He committed an aggressive act of violence because he was insulted by an individual who did not respect his authoritah.

[BrasilNuts]

That is the militarization of Law Enforcement. And yet another reason why people hesitate to approach or talk to officers. I know I would not even give a nod to an officer looking like that.

I'm just pulling this out of my butt at 0530 so.....

Seems to me that somewhere in the 80's or 90's they went from being called Peace/Police Officer to LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER. With that change in terminology a lot of attitudes, citizen and officer, started to change.

When you pay people to enforce, that's what they do.

[DaveTN]

I don’t know what the procedures are in this state, but when I was a cop we couldn’t be the complainant on a disorderly conduct charge. However, if I was driving and someone flipped me off I would stop them to see if everything is okay. It’s a pretty bizarre act and a good way to get a cop to stop you.

I don’t know what those cops were doing to be dressed like that; they may have been executing warrants on violent suspects; who knows. But when you see cops being allowed to dress like that or wear subdued uniforms and masks, there is only one person responsible; the Chief or Sherriff. Unless there is a reason; it’s ridiculous and dangerous. Citizens being stopped or approached for routine traffic violations should not be stopped by cops that are not wearing a standard Police uniform.

[peejman]

Judas Priest.  An armored vehicle for a traffic stop? 

 

As if the whole thing didn't have enough of a Fallujah vibe to it, check out how one of the officers was decked out for battle enforcing the law.  That’s a US Marine Corps camouflage pattern under all that body armor designed to protect against IED shrapnel, which I’m sure they see plenty of in Gainesville, Florida.

 

 

 

 

When I see that, this is the first thing that comes to mind...

 

Hut, hut, hut, hut

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2quc-iQ96R0

[Spots]

Judas Priest. An armored vehicle for a traffic stop?

As if the whole thing didn't have enough of a Fallujah vibe to it, check out how one of the officers was decked out for battle enforcing the law. That’s a US Marine Corps camouflage pattern under all that body armor designed to protect against IED shrapnel, which I’m sure they see plenty of in Gainesville, Florida.

I will and have told a cop he didn't rate to wear those cammies. Ive been pulled over by an officer wearing gear like that, for a tail light out of all things. I asked what was going on, he gave me a funny look and I mentioned his gear. His response was I like to be prepared. My response was that his 350 lb bag of ass was making my Marine Corps uniform look bad and he didn't rate to wear it. I got a ticket, but it was worth it to see the look on his face. The military is the military, police are police. When you make traffic stops dressed for patrol in Baghdad you intimdate the unknowing and piss off the ones who know your playing rambo. Serving a no knock on a violent felon? By all means, wear whatever protects you best. Pulling school zone duty? Wear a uniform that identifies you as a peace officer and looks respectable and decent.

[EssOne]

I was a Peace Officer from '65 to '93 in a 5,500 man agency. We were strictly forbidden to take any enforcement action against a misdemeanor, non-violent act in which we were the victim. The training doctrine of that era was to ignore such insults.

I despise the term LEO and won't use it except when corresponding with someone too young to recall the Peace Officer title.

Most of the Olphart retirees of my generation have grave reservations about cops suiting up like Navy Seals going after Bin Laden on an everyday basis. If it's needed to go after really risky felons, or to operate in a chronically criminal, unusually dangerous area, then so be it - if cops are going to protect the public, then it's only fair to give them the gear they need to do it. But to don this combat paratrooper garb for everyday duty in every town is an incredibly bad idea. The loss of public good will arising from it makes good judgment in its use more than mandatory.

If it's needed throughout the nation for everyday officer safety, and not in just the really dangerous environments, then we might as well fold up our tents and go home - our society is done and over with.

(And flipping someone off in present day America is a very fine way to wind up on a slab down at the city morgue. Just in case anyone is wondering about that.) Edited April 14, 2015 by EssOne

[Dolomite_supafly]

I'm just pulling this out of my butt at 0530 so.....

Seems to me that somewhere in the 80's or 90's they went from being called Peace/Police Officer to LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER. With that change in terminology a lot of attitudes, citizen and officer, started to change.

When you pay people to enforce, that's what they do.

 

Actually it has been going on longer than that even. There was a big push after the Vietnam War to hire veterans, just like now with the wars in the Middle East. So back in the 70's, and on, the military were being hired by police departments.

 

The LE community has gone from a point of being there to help like most officers were doing 30+ years ago to a "us" vs "them" mentality we often see today.

The reason this has happened is because there was a shift about 30-40 years ago, maybe longer, to hire prior military over those who had no military experience. Along with those military personnel came the military mindset that many had. And then with the influx of military personnel came the influx of military tactics, ways of training as well as the "us" versus "them" mentality. This is the reason there has been a militarization of most police departments as well. That and a lot of the same equipment used by officers while in the military are now being provided to LE as part a program that supplies LE with surplus military hardware. So in essence LE is now just a civilian extension of the military in both mindset as well as equipment.

And now those same soldiers who joined the LE community are now in senior positions. It is those same senior officers that are now making changes to training and department policies. And that training and regulations are going to mirror what they knew in the military.

Also, the "us" versus "them" mentality is how the military always trains. That is there is always an enemy in the military and then when the soldiers transition to civilian jobs, especially LE, they keep the same "us" vs "them" mentality except those that are not in law enforcement are now the new "enemy". This is why they no longer want to help, it is because those that are not LE are now their new "enemy".

 

 I suspect most officers buy this gear not because they need it but because it looks cool or intimidating. I know an officer that is an RSO and rarely works patrol. He wants all the cool guy gear to wear around the elementary school kids. He also said he wanted an accurate rifle to be able to shoot people, not criminals, at 300+ yards. I told him there is no situation in which LE should be shooting anyone at 300 yards and, again, he could not understand why. He said rather than chase someone down he would just shoot them.

 

I don't have a problem with people having protective gear, heck I have everything I would hope to need to protect myself. And it is good to be trained on all the gear you might have to use. The problem I have is when that gear serves no purpose other than intimidate or that when one group can wear it and another can't. Imagine the kind of reaction I would get if I decided to go into Walmart in full kit, minus a rifle? LE would show up in a similar get up and tell me I cannot wear mine yet they can wear theirs.

[Spots]

Actually it has been going on longer than that even. There was a big push after the Vietnam War to hire veterans, just like now with the wars in the Middle East. So back in the 70's, and on, the military were being hired by police departments.

The LE community has gone from a point of being there to help like most officers were doing 30+ years ago to a "us" vs "them" mentality we often see today.

The reason this has happened is because there was a shift about 30-40 years ago, maybe longer, to hire prior military over those who had no military experience. Along with those military personnel came the military mindset that many had. And then with the influx of military personnel came the influx of military tactics, ways of training as well as the "us" versus "them" mentality. This is the reason there has been a militarization of most police departments as well. That and a lot of the same equipment used by officers while in the military are now being provided to LE as part a program that supplies LE with surplus military hardware. So in essence LE is now just a civilian extension of the military in both mindset as well as equipment.

And now those same soldiers who joined the LE community are now in senior positions. It is those same senior officers that are now making changes to training and department policies. And that training and regulations are going to mirror what they knew in the military.

Also, the "us" versus "them" mentality is how the military always trains. That is there is always an enemy in the military and then when the soldiers transition to civilian jobs, especially LE, they keep the same "us" vs "them" mentality except those that are not in law enforcement are now the new "enemy". This is why they no longer want to help, it is because those that are not LE are now their new "enemy".

I suspect most officers buy this gear not because they need it but because it looks cool or intimidating. I know an officer that is an RSO and rarely works patrol. He wants all the cool guy gear to wear around the elementary school kids. He also said he wanted an accurate rifle to be able to shoot people, not criminals, at 300+ yards. I told him there is no situation in which LE should be shooting anyone at 300 yards and, again, he could not understand why. He said rather than chase someone down he would just shoot them.

I don't have a problem with people having protective gear, heck I have everything I would hope to need to protect myself. And it is good to be trained on all the gear you might have to use. The problem I have is when that gear serves no purpose other than intimidate or that when one group can wear it and another can't. Imagine the kind of reaction I would get if I decided to go into Walmart in full kit, minus a rifle? LE would show up in a similar get up and tell me I cannot wear mine yet they can wear theirs.

Not to mention, what moron wants to wear all that shit all the time. I used to love being able to get back and strip off my gear. I guess its different when you just sit in a patrol car or around and air conditioned office all day with short little 10 min walks every now and then. Its all about the image. When I think professional, my military mindset goes to my charlies and bravos. Short or long sleeve shirt, green wool trousers, dress shoes. Basically buisness casual. What police officers used to wear before the tacticql gear flood.

[Spots]

Btw I will add I am that guy sometimes. I have been known to give a cop the bird when he has someone pulled over or is radaring and I am on the bike. Its a big joke to most bikers, we know that a lot of them are way to uptight and it'll make them indignant and rub them raw. Otherwise we wouldn't do it.

[E4 No More]

I was flipped off many times as a cop. I never tried to find a reason to cite them for it because contempt of cop isn't illegal and the Supreme Court had ruled that you cannot disturb a cop's peace because their job is inherently NOT peaceful.