Firearms Bills attacked by Establishment in Tennessee House

[Randall53]

Following is the contents of an email I received this morning. NOT good news at all.

 

Dear TFA Member and Supporter:

 

We now have proof that your fundamental rights that are recognized under the Second Amendment are under attack by Tennessee's legislative leadership!  This report from the Tennessee Spotlight (used with permission) sheds light on the shenanigans from the House of Representatives!

 

Tennessee Spotlight reports this morning:

 

Wednesday committee hearings reported out a sad outcome for liberty and constitutional government in Tennessee.

 

Having been set up by committee chairs as "Gun Bill" hearings, it was more like "'unable to fight' at the OK Corral". Realizing this, several bill sponsors chose to roll their bills to a future date. Those who chose to present were treated to a shellacking unseen in many hearings...and not because there was vigorous debate. There was little debate.

 

The committee in question was House Civil Justice Subcommittee, chaired by Coley from Memphis, and populated by Jones from Nashville, Beck from Nashville, Lundberg from Bristol, Carter from Chattanooga, and Wilburn from Somerville in West Tennessee.

 

Tennessee Spotlight exists to cover not just the substance of legislation (see tnspotlight.org for Issues) but the process by which it progresses or is killed off. Part of the process is the organization of the committees, including who chairs them. It is clear from this session that the committee organization part of the process is critical. The Speaker of the House is the person who does this. To any critical thinker, the fix was in from the start. Also note the Governor had made it clear that he had "flagged" many of these bills as unacceptable.

 

HB0994 by Todd, SB1058 by Green clarifies the ability of an employee to appeal a job termination if he/she believes the termination to be based solely upon the discovery of a firearm in his/her vehicle parked on company property. Jones asked if property rights were being considered in this legislation since "if I don't want you to bring your dog into my yard, you shouldn't do it. It's my property." Todd never answered her question but focused on the burden of proof aspect of the bill. This question keeps getting asked by people who refuse to allow employees the right to defend themselves to and from work. The bill eventually passed on a voice vote.

 

Sen. Mark Green's bill (SB0149) to eliminate from unlawful zones any areas "used" by schools had passed out of Senate Judiciary the day before 6-2-1. The bill was carried in the house by Debra Moody (HB0173) from Covington in West Tennessee.

 

The essence of the bill was the need to remove the word "use" from language in the current statute. Tennesseans are currently prohibited from carrying firearms onto property owned, administered, or "used" for school purposes. In a previous Attorney General ruling, he offered that a person carrying a firearm otherwise legally in a place where students are present in an official school function would be in violation of the statute. Thus, if your city allowed the legal carrying of firearms in a city park and the local middle school came there to play a baseball game (This kept getting brought up in Senate Judiciary), you would be in violation of the statute. The bill merely asked for the elimination of the word "use". There was little debate. The bill got a motion by Carter, but was killed for lack of a second.

 

Micah Van Huss brought HB0684, which merely restates the Tennessee State Constitution into law. "Article I, Section 26, "That the citizens of this state have a right to keep and to bear arms for their common defense; but the Legislature shall have power, by law, to regulate the wearing of arms with a view to prevent crime." There is not one single statistic that shows the added carrying of firearms does anything other than prevent crime. Just look at the recent drop in violent crime statistics coming out of Chicago.

 

Once again, the debate that did occur on this bill came mainly from the two Democrats on the committee. Jones went so far as to equate the intelligence of the Framers of the Constitution with backwoods hicks since "these were people who didn't have running water and indoor toilets" who wrote the 2nd Amendment. Beck offered that tourism is suffering now in Georgia because they enacted the same law last year. That statement, as I learned in Logic Class years ago, is an unfounded assertion. Carter asked the sponsor if the bill demanded that individuals wear firearms. Of course, the answer was no. Carter moved the bill but there was no second. The bill failed to even get to a voice vote. Well, I guess if you don't consider the fact that the three remaining Republicans on the committee, Lundberg, Coley and Wilburn didn't even open their mouths.

 

This bill had 24 House Sponsors. There are only six people on the committee.

 

HB0240 by Reedy, SB0207 by Niceley, which basically allows a gun dealer to skip the background check on a permit holder was presented. No debate. No nothing. No motion. No second. Bill failed. Here is an example of a bill trying to simplify the process of commerce while adhering to the intent of the law and saving the customer money. Bottom line. If you were to go into a gun store and buy a firearm every day for seven days, the merchant would be required to run the same background check every day and you would have to pay the same fee every time, regardless if you had just been cleared to receive a carry permit and passed all the state and federal background checks.

The final indignity, among many, was the presentation of HJR0072 by Pody which allows for the popular election of the Attorney General. Pody had asked longtime constitutional defender John Jay Hooker to testify on behalf of the law. Hooker, who has forgotten more about the Tennessee Constitution that the entire committee knows, gave an impassioned historical and legal perspective on the need for Tennesseans to be enfranchised to vote for the AG. (Do yourself a favor and watch the video here.) Why is this important?

 

Hooker reminded the committee that Tennessee was the only state where the Supreme Court appoints the AG and that, in the past, when the Supreme Court Justices were actually elected by the people, this gave the people control over who served as AG. However, with the justices having been unconstitutionally appointed by the Governor for the past 40 years, there was no check on the AG selection by the people.

 

Remember, the Tennessee AG refused to join over twenty-five other states who opposed ObamaCare. Also remember, that the organization that misinformed Tennesseans about Amendment 2 was just cited by the Tennessee registry of Election Finance to be in potential violation of election laws and an investigation is ongoing to determine who the organization actually was.

The only discussion was the fact that people didn't want the position of AG to become political and that in states where the AG was elected, it was seen as a stepping stone to become Governor. Pody had researched the issue and only 16% of the time has this happened. Lundberg asked what the percentage was where the AG had "run" for Governor. Pody did not know that answer. Far be it from elected officials doing anything "political".

 

It did not go unnoticed that following the adjournment of the committee that Bill Gibbons, Commissioner of Safety (?), came into the room to congratulate the members. Pretty obvious, huh?

 

Finally, the takeaway from this charade is the fact that only 6 out of 132 members of the General Assembly decided that legislation of this import was not worthy to be voted on by the Members. Over six million Tennesseans were disenfranchised by these shenanigans. We can and will do better.

 

Jeff Hartline, Executive Director
Tennessee Spotlight

John Harris
TFA Volunteer Executive Director

 

P.S.   If you are a TFA member, we need your continued member support.  Share this email with your friends and on Facebook.

If you are not a TFA member or need to renew your membership, please consider joining or renewing today by going now to the TFA's website!

[300winmag]

The school group situation is a big reason why I would not open carry a handgun in public in this state.  If you are carry anywhere in public and a school field trip group arrives, then you are breaking the law and subject to a felony charge.  It is absolute garbage probably more so than the whole park mess that we have to deal with.  

[bersaguy]

I think it might be about time that these people know many of us that just put in office let them hear from a lot of us and let them know just how fast we can take their job away come next election. I honestly don't think these people think we are watching and paying attention to what they are doing. If Necessary maybe a few petitions sent to the letting them know we are watching if letters don't work............jmho

[dawgdoc]

The school group situation is a big reason why I would not open carry a handgun in public in this state.  If you are carry anywhere in public and a school field trip group arrives, then you are breaking the law and subject to a felony charge.  It is absolute garbage probably more so than the whole park mess that we have to deal with.  

 

I have been under the impression that there are less OC advocates here than on the Georgia board that I also frequent.  This, coupled with the must show permit provision of the law, seems to explain a lot.  Also CC is useful if you end up in a posted location but you didn't see the posting.

[2.ooohhh]

The school group situation is a big reason why I would not open carry a handgun in public in this state. If you are carry anywhere in public and a school field trip group arrives, then you are breaking the law and subject to a felony charge. It is absolute garbage probably more so than the whole park mess that we have to deal with.

Oddly enough this exact situation happened to me today. The wife and I were having lunch at an establishment with this posting:

I'm halfway through my patty melt and I have to decide whether I want to run out in the cold rain and come back to cold food, or just risk becoming a test case b/c this class from Cheatham county decided to stop in for lunch.

[tartanphantom]

I think it might be about time that these people know many of us that just put in office let them hear from a lot of us and let them know just how fast we can take their job away come next election. I honestly don't think these people think we are watching and paying attention to what they are doing. If Necessary maybe a few petitions sent to the letting them know we are watching if letters don't work............jmho

 

Unfortunately, this approach has practically ZERO effect on people who are immersed in their own self-importance and sense of superiority-- which describes the current leadership oligarchy.

 

Anything short of a political bitch-slap (losing an election) is ineffective, and we just missed our opportunity this last cycle.

 

Get used to it, at least for the foreseeable future. As long as RINOS call the shots, we will be fed occasional crumbs of "feel-good" gun legislation just enough for them to proclaim how pro-2A they are come re-election time.

 

We were incredibly lucky that the knife legislation went through last year... honestly, I think the bulk of them didn't even read it.

Edited March 13, 2015 by tartanphantom

[300winmag]

Yeah open carry and mind your own business and some busy body calls the cops when the busy body sees the school group in the restaurant. 

 

I don't think I would want to deal with that.

[LagerHead]

Is anyone really surprised by these results? I'm not. There are a lot of good bills here, and I didn't really expect many, if any at all, to get the attention they deserve.

 

I'd like to add that Chicago's decrease in crime cannot honestly be attributed to their concealed carry laws. They saw a sharp decrease in crime in the year before the first person got their permit. Of course, they didn't see the sharp increase that gun-grabbers would have you believe is the inevitable result, either.

[Moped]

This didn't surprise me either. I called it last week.  Until we can unseat some of the leadership in the primary with our own candidates, we will get nothing else out of this group.

 

Personally, I think Haslam, Harwell and group have circled the wagons after one of their own lost her primary, the back in 2012.  This is their way of fighting back against the TFA and NRA.  And watch for Haslam to be Lamar's heir apparent to the Senate after his stint as Governor is over too.

[JayC]

Just remember, it's a lot worse than just a school bus of students showing up...  You at least can notice them and do something...  Here are some worse/harder to spot examples...

 

1. Teacher 'working lunch' in the back room of a restaurant

2. University club/sports team members stopping while driving back in a private coach bus

3. And by far my favorite, high school or college group showing up at the local range  :screwy:

 

All of these are examples of 'use' of property under the current AG's opinion letter and could result in an otherwise law abiding citizen getting charged with a felony.

 

The school group situation is a big reason why I would not open carry a handgun in public in this state.  If you are carry anywhere in public and a school field trip group arrives, then you are breaking the law and subject to a felony charge.  It is absolute garbage probably more so than the whole park mess that we have to deal with.  

 

[JayC]

Harwell is the weak link...  She is ripe for being put out of a job, it wouldn't be too hard to successfully challenge her the primary by going hard right, but we'd loose the seat in the general election. But honestly I think it would be worth loosing the seat.

 

This didn't surprise me either. I called it last week.  Until we can unseat some of the leadership in the primary with our own candidates, we will get nothing else out of this group.

 

Personally, I think Haslam, Harwell and group have circled the wagons after one of their own lost her primary, the back in 2012.  This is their way of fighting back against the TFA and NRA.  And watch for Haslam to be Lamar's heir apparent to the Senate after his stint as Governor is over too.

Edited March 14, 2015 by JayC

[Worriedman]

Harwell is the weak link...  She is ripe for being put out of a job, it wouldn't be too hard to successfully challenge her the primary by going hard right, but we'd loose the seat in the general election. But honestly I think it would be worth loosing the seat.

Ain't like we would miss a RINO or a dozen...

[Moped]

I think it would be worth losing too. And it would very beneficial, for the leadership to know the reason she lost and who caused it.

Personally, I think the Republican Leadership in Nashville sees us as a necessary evil to be courted during the election and ignored the rest of the time. Its the same way the Democrats treat the African American and LGBT vote. Edited March 14, 2015 by Moped

[tartanphantom]

Harwell is the weak link...  She is ripe for being put out of a job, it wouldn't be too hard to successfully challenge her the primary by going hard right, but we'd loose the seat in the general election. But honestly I think it would be worth loosing the seat.

 

I would lose no sleep over giving Harwell's seat to a Dem as long as sanity prevailed and the Dems were still in the minority. She's been involved in Tennessee politics since the 80's... I could go the rest of my life without ever seeing her in any office ever again.

Edited March 14, 2015 by tartanphantom

[Worriedman]

I think it would be worth losing too. And it would very beneficial, for the leadership to know the reason she lost and who caused it.

Personally, I think the Republican Leadership in Nashville sees us as a necessary evil to be courted during the election and ignored the rest of the time. Its the same way the Democrats treat the African American and LGBT vote.
 

You are a wise individual.  You nailed it!

[Moped]

I don't know about all of the rest of you, but I am a bit tired of being used.

[Randall53]

 And watch for Haslam to be Lamar's heir apparent to the Senate after his stint as Governor is over too.

 

Yep...and if you read the story of The Battle of Athens, the same kind of passing around of government office from one buddy to another and swapping it back and forth was alive and well then also.

[GKar]

As further evidence of the uselessness of current Establishment republicans as supporters of 2A legislation, take note of today's happenings in House Civ Just Sub with regards to Matheny's HB 0481 (clarifies that it is not an offense for a person to transport and properly store a firearm in a motor vehicle parked on school property).  After passing the Senate Jud Cmte 6-1 to move to the Senate floor, HB 0481 failed to advance out of the House Sub - Jones and Beck vote no, Carter and Wilburn vote yes, and both Coley and Lundberg request "Present, not voting"...thus, the bill fails.  Think THAT wasn't choreographed beforehand???  A$$hats...

[Randall53]

As further evidence of the uselessness of current Establishment republicans as supporters of 2A legislation, take note of today's happenings in House Civ Just Sub with regards to Matheny's HB 0481 (clarifies that it is not an offense for a person to transport and properly store a firearm in a motor vehicle parked on school property).  After passing the Senate Jud Cmte 6-1 to move to the Senate floor, HB 0481 failed to advance out of the House Sub - Jones and Beck vote no, Carter and Wilburn vote yes, and both Coley and Lundberg request "Present, not voting"...thus, the bill fails.  Think THAT wasn't choreographed beforehand???  A$$hats...

 

I wonder if 'Ol Bill Gibbons, Commissioner of Safety, came in to congratulate them all as it was reported he did in my OP?

[Worriedman]

I wonder if 'Ol Bill Gibbons, Commissioner of Safety, came in to congratulate them all as it was reported he did in my OP?

The folks who are reporting for Tennessee Spotlight say he showed up to "congratulate the executioners" in their words...

[Moped]

There needs to be change. The wagons are circled and we are considered the Indians. They need to be reminded of where their support comes from next election.

[Randall53]

I tried the last election. Maybe we'll have more support next time around. We can't quit trying!!

[bersaguy]

Like I said in my first post here. If we can sit here and post and read things that make us upset, it only takes a few minutes to write a short but sweet email to your local guy or gal representing you and making your feelings know and make sure come next election you will remember how they voted on things that you wrote them about. I wish I was smart enough to put a petition together here and begin gathering signatures and when we have enough to turn some heads in the Wagon Circle send it to them and see if we can't open a hole in the circle of wagons. If we never try we will never know.............jmho

[Worriedman]

Some here remember the fight we had over the State income tax.  It tool a lot of people, but we got it done.  These issues are won on a face to face level INSIDE Legislative Plaza.  If you you want to make a difference, you will have to show up.

As long as they can count on the media to take their part and advocates do not show the numbers needed to push an issue, they win, every time.  There were 565,646 hunting license purchased last year, and 480,000 plus handgun carry permits.  There is some overlap, but folks, that is a big enough number to make them sit up and listen.  If we got 20,000 at LP on "Gun Bill Day", I bet that would make a HUGE difference.

Edited March 19, 2015 by Worriedman

[300winmag]

We need folks that are well spoken to help gun rights.  Well spoken logic goes a lot further than hype and emotion.  For example, if we want to be able to carry on school or college property, we need folks who can show that college carry with a license is legal in half the country and that you can legally carry on K-12 school property in some states with a license.  Or that in most states, it is legal to carry in local parks with a license.  Of course we would add that there are very few problems with licensees carrying in those locations.

 

My opinion is that it is better to have concentrated efforts around 2 or 3 solid bills than waste time on 20 or 30 that have no chance of going anywhere.  Solid bills with good NRA backing and other lobbying efforts would be fixing the park issue, school property issue, and sign problems.  The knife rights group somehow was able to change politicians' minds on knife law pretty quick and even was able to drop opposition of the sheriff's association.  I think the NRA can do the same thing with the right approach.  Mississippi was able to get the enhanced license (carry just about everywhere) by rolling it into a bill to reform district attorney carry.  We could do the same thing here.

Edited March 19, 2015 by 300winmag