SB 0070 by Kelsey - Possession of firemarm in vehicle parked on school property

[GKar]

And so the new offerings begin:  first up, a little ditty by our good friend and Constitutional scholar Sen Kelsey.  As of Jan 19, it has no House sponsor.  Senate co-sponsor is Janice Bowling.

 

----------------------------------------------------

 

SECTION 1.

Tennessee Code Annotated, Section 39-17-1309(e),is amended by adding the following language as a new, appropriately designated subdivision:

Any person who transports and stores a firearm or firearm ammunition in compliance with § 39-17-1313 while on or using a parking area located on property

owned, used, or operated by a school;

 

SECTION 2.

This act shall take effect upon becoming a law, the public welfare requiring it.

[E4 No More]

Could you be a little more vague? I feel that half of this is posted and missing the punchline. :)

[GKar]

What I have copied above is the entire content of the bill. 

 

I have no use for Kelsey after his first tenure on the Sen. Justice Cmte - thsu, my intro.  But the bill content speaks for itself - offered here for comment and analysis.

[Omega]

What I have copied above is the entire content of the bill. 

 

I have no use for Kelsey after his first tenure on the Sen. Justice Cmte - thsu, my intro.  But the bill content speaks for itself - offered here for comment and analysis.

Hard to analyze when there is no context. is this to make it legal, illegal etc.  Maybe a link to the source?

[Garufa]

See the red text below.  That is what the law would look like if the proposed bill is passed

 

39-17-1309.  Carrying weapons on school property.

  (a) As used in this section, "weapon of like kind" includes razors and razor blades, except those used solely for personal shaving, and any sharp pointed or edged instrument, except unaltered nail files and clips and tools used solely for preparation of food, instruction and maintenance.

( B)  (1) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, with the intent to go armed, any firearm, explosive, explosive weapon, bowie knife, hawk bill knife, ice pick, dagger, slingshot, leaded cane, switchblade knife, blackjack, knuckles or any other weapon of like kind, not used solely for instructional or school-sanctioned ceremonial purposes, in any public or private school building or bus, on any public or private school campus, grounds, recreation area, athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated by any board of education, school, college or university board of trustees, regents or directors for the administration of any public or private educational institution.

   (2) A violation of this subsection ( B) is a Class E felony.

(c)  (1)  (A) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, any firearm, not used solely for instructional or school-sanctioned ceremonial purposes, in any public or private school building or bus, on any public or private school campus, grounds, recreation area, athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated by any board of education, school, college or university board of trustees, regents or directors for the administration of any public or private educational institution.

      ( B) It is not an offense under this subsection (c) for a nonstudent adult to possess a firearm, if the firearm is contained within a private vehicle operated by the adult and is not handled by the adult, or by any other person acting with the expressed or implied consent of the adult, while the vehicle is on school property.

   (2) A violation of this subsection (c) is a Class B misdemeanor.

(d)  (1) Each chief administrator of a public or private school shall display in prominent locations about the school a sign, at least six inches (6'') high and fourteen inches (14'') wide, stating:

      FELONY. STATE LAW PRESCRIBES A MAXIMUM PENALTY OF SIX (6) YEARS IMPRISONMENT AND A FINE NOT TO EXCEED THREE THOUSAND DOLLARS ($3,000) FOR CARRYING WEAPONS ON SCHOOL PROPERTY.

   (2) As used in this subsection (d), "prominent locations about a school" includes, but is not limited to, sports arenas, gymnasiums, stadiums and cafeterias.

(e) Subsections ( B) and (c) do not apply to the following persons:

   (1) Persons employed in the army, air force, navy, coast guard or marine service of the United States or any member of the Tennessee national guard when in discharge of their official duties and acting under orders requiring them to carry arms or weapons;

   (2) Civil officers of the United States in the discharge of their official duties;

   (3) Officers and soldiers of the militia and the national guard when called into actual service;

   (4) Officers of the state, or of any county, city or town, charged with the enforcement of the laws of the state, when in the discharge of their official duties;

   (5) Any pupils who are members of the reserve officers training corps or pupils enrolled in a course of instruction or members of a club or team, and who are required to carry arms or weapons in the discharge of their official class or team duties;

   (6) Any private police employed by the administration or board of trustees of any public or private institution of higher education in the discharge of their duties; and

   (7) Any registered security guard/officer who meets the requirements of title 62, chapter 35, and who is discharging the officer's official duties.

 

   (8)  Any person who transports and stores a firearm or firearm ammunition in compliance with § 39-17-1313 while on or using a parking area located on property

owned, used, or operated by a school;

Edited January 20, 2015 by Garufa

[Omega]

Ok, so

 

 

See the red text below.  That is what the law would look like if the proposed bill is passed

 

39-17-1309.  Carrying weapons on school property.

  (a) As used in this section, "weapon of like kind" includes razors and razor blades, except those used solely for personal shaving, and any sharp pointed or edged instrument, except unaltered nail files and clips and tools used solely for preparation of food, instruction and maintenance.

( B)  (1) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, with the intent to go armed, any firearm, explosive, explosive weapon, bowie knife, hawk bill knife, ice pick, dagger, slingshot, leaded cane, switchblade knife, blackjack, knuckles or any other weapon of like kind, not used solely for instructional or school-sanctioned ceremonial purposes, in any public or private school building or bus, on any public or private school campus, grounds, recreation area, athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated by any board of education, school, college or university board of trustees, regents or directors for the administration of any public or private educational institution.

   (2) A violation of this subsection ( B) is a Class E felony.

(c)  (1)  (A) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, any firearm, not used solely for instructional or school-sanctioned ceremonial purposes, in any public or private school building or bus, on any public or private school campus, grounds, recreation area, athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated by any board of education, school, college or university board of trustees, regents or directors for the administration of any public or private educational institution.

      ( B) It is not an offense under this subsection (c) for a nonstudent adult to possess a firearm, if the firearm is contained within a private vehicle operated by the adult and is not handled by the adult, or by any other person acting with the expressed or implied consent of the adult, while the vehicle is on school property.

   (2) A violation of this subsection (c) is a Class B misdemeanor.

(d)  (1) Each chief administrator of a public or private school shall display in prominent locations about the school a sign, at least six inches (6'') high and fourteen inches (14'') wide, stating:

      FELONY. STATE LAW PRESCRIBES A MAXIMUM PENALTY OF SIX (6) YEARS IMPRISONMENT AND A FINE NOT TO EXCEED THREE THOUSAND DOLLARS ($3,000) FOR CARRYING WEAPONS ON SCHOOL PROPERTY.

   (2) As used in this subsection (d), "prominent locations about a school" includes, but is not limited to, sports arenas, gymnasiums, stadiums and cafeterias.

(e) Subsections ( B) and (c) do not apply to the following persons:

   (1) Persons employed in the army, air force, navy, coast guard or marine service of the United States or any member of the Tennessee national guard when in discharge of their official duties and acting under orders requiring them to carry arms or weapons;

   (2) Civil officers of the United States in the discharge of their official duties;

   (3) Officers and soldiers of the militia and the national guard when called into actual service;

   (4) Officers of the state, or of any county, city or town, charged with the enforcement of the laws of the state, when in the discharge of their official duties;

   (5) Any pupils who are members of the reserve officers training corps or pupils enrolled in a course of instruction or members of a club or team, and who are required to carry arms or weapons in the discharge of their official class or team duties;

   (6) Any private police employed by the administration or board of trustees of any public or private institution of higher education in the discharge of their duties; and

   (7) Any registered security guard/officer who meets the requirements of title 62, chapter 35, and who is discharging the officer's official duties.

 

   (8)  Any person who transports and stores a firearm or firearm ammunition in compliance with § 39-17-1313 while on or using a parking area located on property

owned, used, or operated by a school;

 

Ah, so I take that to be a good thing.  It codifies the ability to store your weapon in your vehicle when you have to go inside for any reason.  1 ( b ) it allows possession, and this one allows storage.  

[GKar]

You can keep up with legislative attempts regarding firearms and ammunition here:  http://wapp.capitol.tn.gov/apps/subjectindex/BillsBySubject.aspx?Primarysubject=1785&GA=109

 

Happy browsing!

Edited January 20, 2015 by GKar

[Garufa]

They have made is exceedingly difficult to find the full text of a bill.  Rather than having a simple "full text of bill" type like before the site was redesigned you have to click on the bill name to the far left of the page...then the pdf will appear.

 

Complete failure on what is otherwise a seemingly decent new layout.

[GKar]

So far, I'm actually finding this layout to be a bit more user-friendly than the old one.  We'll see if that continues to play out as the complexity grows during the session.

 

As far as SB 0070 - if all you desire is the ability to keep a firearm in the car while in a school parking lot, then it looks like this version might float your boat.  Seems a narrowly designed "fix"...a tactic that worked well for the Est (R)s last year for the parking lot bill: push through a very narrow fix early on so we can get 'em off our back by offering a pittance with regards to firearms legislation, then move on to "more important matters".  This time Kelsey gets to play Green's role from last year.

 

It does not address the fatal flaw in section b (1) - the flaw that converts an otherwise-legal firearms possession into a Class E felony when a high school cross-country team shows up on the other side of the park.  Instead, this new proposal re-enforces the language that creates the trap in section b (1):  "...property owned, used or operated by...". 

[300winmag]

It already is legal to possess a firearm at a school under 39-17-1313 (safe commute law) if you have a handgun carry permit and the firearm is in your vehicle.  This bill doesn't do much but clarify that such activity is legal.

[monkeylizard]

It already is legal to possess a firearm at a school under 39-17-1313 (safe commute law) if you have a handgun carry permit and the firearm is in your vehicle. This bill doesn't do much but clarify that such activity is legal.

 

I thought so too. -1313 doesn't say anything about "notwithstanding -1309 (or -1311 parks etc.)" so it would apply everywhere, right? What exactly is the point of this addition to -1309?

Edited January 20, 2015 by monkeylizard

[GKar]

<<It already is legal to possess a firearm at a school under 39-17-1313 (safe commute law) if you have a handgun carry permit and the firearm is in your vehicle.  This bill doesn't do much but clarify that such activity is legal.>>

<<What exactly is the point of this addition to -1309?>>

 

As the abstract to the bill states:  "As introduced, clarifies that it is not an offense for a person to transport and properly store a firearm in a motor vehicle parked on school property. - Amends TCA Title 39, Chapter 17, Part 13 and Title 49."

[monkeylizard]

So it expressly states that -1313 applies to schools even though -1313 already applies to schools? That's some valuable legislation right there.

[GKar]

IIRC, there was consideration in some quarters that the relationship between last year's change to 1313 and the existing language in 1309 might lead to ambiguity in some interpretations.  This is apparently a 'fix' to pre-empt any such ambiguity - if it ever indeed existed.  Like I said earlier, far more a red herring in my book than a really necessary substantive change...but why should we expect any different, considering the source? 

[300winmag]

I think it is just something to put out there to get the NRA vote but not give folks anything with substance.  I may think differently if something, such as the park bill, is passed and signed into law.

[Oh Shoot]

So it expressly states that -1313 applies to schools even though -1313 already applies to schools? That's some valuable legislation right there.

 

1313 requires that you have a permt. This bill would allow non-permit holders to do same. The reference to 1313 is for how the firearms must be stored in vehicle.

 

Right now, anyone may have firearms in vehicle, but that does not override 1359, 1311, or 1309 unless you have a permit. Dunno why he limited the thing to just 1309.

 

- OS

Edited January 21, 2015 by Oh Shoot

[Dolomite_supafly]

I would like to see NFA legalized without the defense to prosecution part. That is just rip for overzealous officers to begin arresting people for having NFA items and letting the courts dismiss the charges.

 

I would also like to see loaded long gun carry be legalized for HCP holders. Problem is we will see all the Open Carry buffoons ruining it really quickly for us. Heck, I would be happy with a requirement to conceal providing I can carry a loaded rifle or shotgun anywhere I can carry a pistol right now.

[GKar]

You can bet the folks at UT will not let this one go unscathed.  Watch for either an amendment to essentially render the bill toothless, or the ascension of a weaker bill that will garner enough support from the indebted Est Rs to bury this one.

[Omega]

You can bet the folks at UT will not let this one go unscathed.  Watch for either an amendment to essentially render the bill toothless, or the ascension of a weaker bill that will garner enough support from the indebted Est Rs to bury this one.

Ok, wth is Est Rs?  I am sure its something to do with Republican but Est?  Established?, Estimated? 

[Oh Shoot]

You can bet the folks at UT will not let this one go unscathed.  Watch for either an amendment to essentially render the bill toothless, or the ascension of a weaker bill that will garner enough support from the indebted Est Rs to bury this one.

 

They didn't make a peep about 1313 which gives same permission to permit holders.

 

Although of course TN Board of Regents has stated since that folks are still subject to firing/expulsion if caught. A fight they'll lose in court if ever challenged.

 

- OS

Edited January 21, 2015 by Oh Shoot

[GKar]

Establishment Republicans...those of Alexandrian persuasion.

[300winmag]

The way I read the bill, you would still need a permit to have a firearm in your vehicle, since 39-17-1313 safe commute law just covers people with permits.  Maybe I am reading this bill wrong.

[JayC]

This extends 1313 to school property for non-HCP holders.

 

It would be a good law if passed.

 

So it expressly states that -1313 applies to schools even though -1313 already applies to schools? That's some valuable legislation right there.

 

[Oh Shoot]

The way I read the bill, you would still need a permit to have a firearm in your vehicle, since 39-17-1313 safe commute law just covers people with permits.  Maybe I am reading this bill wrong.

 

The way I read it, the reference to 1313 is only for how firearms must be stored in vehicle. Otherwise this bill would indeed have no purpose at all.

 

- OS

[btq96r]

Very limited bill for college students and staff/faculty.

 

Unless the Tennessee Board of Regents is prohibited from making it a violation of TBR/School policy, there will still be a prohibition, with the penalty of expulsion for students who have a firearm in their vehicle, even if they have a HCP.  The only change that was brought about with the recent vehicle carry law was that they couldn't have you arrested for it if a HCP holder was caught doing it.

Edited January 22, 2015 by btq96r