Down The Drain

[R_Bert]

Nuclear Security.......disconnected.

 

 

About 10-15% of my career time was spent in this program, usually on-site in Russia.  A lot of my former colleagues in the US and Russia are feeling pretty betrayed / gut-punched right now.

 

http://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2015/01/19/after-two-decades-russia-nuclear-security-cooperation-becomes-casualty-deteriorating-relations/5nh8NbtjitUE8UqVWFIooL/story.html?event=event25

 

This is the result of a admin foreign policy that is literally "don't do stupid sh!t !".      Well, they did. I cannot begin to describe the damage getting to this point has done, and will have fallout for decades to come, in every off-shore nuclear weapons & energy related program we (the USA) tries to engage.   :wall:

[A.J. Holst]

Another epic fail by the Obama administration,

[R_Bert]

Yes, This one removed the major portal (and it was significant access) to the Russian nuclear weapons program.  It was the "feet on the ground" and affects 1000's of engineers, scientists, and nuclear workers in Russia alone.  Of anything we did to make the world safer from nuclear threat.....this was by far the largest and most important.

 

To bring it home, just in Oak Ridge, TN alone, it is tied to the majority of $0.5 B  (yes...billion) of program & project funding.  This is a MAJOR collapse in nuclear security (and this was not "security theater").  This was removing & destroying devices, and irreversibly down-blending uranium & plutonium, relocating for feed into power reactors.  Now, is BIG FUBAR.

Edited January 19, 2015 by R_Bert

[PackinMama]

Scary.

[Grand Torino]

The Administration doing what it does best....destroying America.

[JWC]

Why didn't we send a washed up old singer to sing a crappy song to that meeting???

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2015/01/16/john-kerry-and-james-taylor-play-paris/ Edited January 19, 2015 by JWC

[bersaguy]

Come on folks!!!  Did you really believe that the Russians would stay out of the Nuclear business? Did you really think the Cold war was ever really over??? I never believed it for a minute and never will. And the Russians have been playing with this administration like a child plays with puppets on strings since the very beginning. I doubt that the next administration will be any better at working with Russia either............jmho

[E4 No More]

Come on folks!!!  Did you really believe that the Russians would stay out of the Nuclear business? Did you really think the Cold war was ever really over??? I never believed it for a minute and never will. And the Russians have been playing with this administration like a child plays with puppets on strings since the very beginning. I doubt that the next administration will be any better at working with Russia either............jmho

I pretty much concur with this statement. Putin has made it pretty clear that he wants to go back to the old ways now that they can afford it with their oil reserves. That last part is tongue-in-cheek, if it wasn't clear. I believe that their economy is what drove this agreement back in the 80's-90's to begin with.

[R_Bert]

Come on folks!!!  Did you really believe that the Russians would stay out of the Nuclear business? Did you really think the Cold war was ever really over??? I never believed it for a minute and never will. And the Russians have been playing with this administration like a child plays with puppets on strings since the very beginning. I doubt that the next administration will be any better at working with Russia either............jmho

You greatly misunderstand the purpose of this cooperation.

 

It was never intended to remove their defense capability, but to bring their accounting & control, storage, physical security, and human reliability to industry best practices. 

 

The benefit to us was a cheap source of fuel, but would never have impacted their strike capability.  It did greatly reduce the risk of materials getting outside to bad operators, and it supplemented the paychecks of the Russians who needed to be relied upon (for a time, the RF could not afford to pay them), and it provided technical cooperation between the two sides (so yes.... for a period the cold war was indeed over....)

 

AND..... we dealt with the Soviets also.  So that argument of "old ways" does not hold water.

 

All of this is the result of a pissing match between current admins. This particular falling out started when we began to press the Russians over social agenda (they really don't like us telling them how live), then went to hell in a handcart when the Russians decided to go into Crimea.

 

SO... It ain't just a simple Black Hat - White Hat situation.  The Russians are xenophobic and paranoid, but they are not just plain evil.

 

BTW..  I have actually been inside the bowels of  a number of their closed city facilities as a weapons program inspector over the last 20 years.

Edited January 19, 2015 by R_Bert

[RED333]

You greatly misunderstand the purpose of this cooperation.

 

It was never intended to remove their defense capability, but to bring their accounting & control, storage, physical security, and human reliability to industry best practices. 

 

The benefit to us was a cheap source of fuel, but would never have impacted their strike capability.  It did greatly reduce the risk of materials getting outside to bad operators, and it supplemented the paychecks of the Russians who needed to be relied upon (for a time, the RF could not afford to pay them), and it provided technical cooperation between the two sides (so yes.... for a period the cold war was indeed over....)

 

AND..... we dealt with the Soviets also.  So that argument of "old ways" does not hold water.

 

All of this is the result of a pissing match between current admins. This particular falling out started when we began to press the Russians over social agenda (they really don't like us telling them how live), then went to hell in a handcart when the Russians decided to go into Crimea.

 

SO... It ain't just a simple Black Hat - White Hat situation.  The Russians are xenophobic and paranoid, but they are not just plain evil.

 

BTW..  I have actually been inside the bowels of  a number of their closed city facilities as a weapons program inspector over the last 20 years.

 

This is the very scary part, as much as I hate to say it, Bad people will do very bad things with this stuff.
 

[Dolomite_supafly]

In all honesty we should have never given them any amount of money. Less than 25 years ago we were sworn enemies but all of a sudden they want to be our allies when we offer to give them money.

I am so tired of the US trying to make friends using our tax money. That money could be used to take care of our veterans, our homeless as well as our kids that are going hungry.

This is how it goes. We have a country who hates us so we try to buy their friendship but even if they do become our friends it is only temporary because if we ever stop paying them they will hate us again. So many countries are addicted to our aid and if we stopped all payments the world, as a whole, would be outraged at the US.

And one more thing, I wonder how much of our money wax actually used as intended? We hear about all the corruption from the bottom to the top in both countries so one can't help but wonder if it is all just another way to scam the taxpayers our of their retirement.

[suspiciousmind]

Why didn't we send a washed up old singer to sing a crappy song to that meeting???

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2015/01/16/john-kerry-and-james-taylor-play-paris/

James Taylor is still one of the most talented songwriters that has ever lived.

Forgive my ignorance, but what sort of long term issues can this lead to?

[R_Bert]

In all honesty we should have never given them any amount of money. Less than 25 years ago we were sworn enemies but all of a sudden they want to be our allies when we offer to give them money.
I am so tired of the US trying to make friends using our tax money. That money could be used to take care of our veterans, our homeless as well as our kids that are going hungry.
This is how it goes. We have a country who hates us so we try to buy their friendship but even if they do become our friends it is only temporary because if we ever stop paying them they will hate us again. So many countries are addicted to our aid and if we stopped all payments the world, as a whole, would be outraged at the US.
And one more thing, I wonder how much of our money wax actually used as intended? We hear about all the corruption from the bottom to the top in both countries so one can't help but wonder if it is all just another way to scam the taxpayers our of their retirement.

I cannot speak for the efficiencies of our own government administration of the programs, but the Russian side was held pretty darned accountable via procurement audits for work done under contracts ( and inspected by folks like me).

When the Soviets fell, some weapons designers and nuclear specialists were suddenly without jobs, and for hire under great demand.....by the Iranians, Pakistanis, and North Koreans. As history now tells us, some did defect. But we tried to save a lot of people from going bad. And did.

No good answers, but as for .gov programs, it was better than most, and paid dividends back to us. Now.... its shut down by the Russians, who have had enough ( of the demands that come with dollars, which become less technical each year thanks to DOS /admin agendas.

But.... they don't hate us because the $ went away. They hate us on principle. And now refuse the $ (from that program anyway). They are choosing new countries to cooperate with....despot block, islamofacists, and G8, and emerging african. Basically, they are shutting us out of all the nuclear trouble-spots, and are setting the agenda for the regions. They are playing our game, better than we do. Edited January 20, 2015 by R_Bert

[Ugly]

This is very bad and in sure we will see the effects of it on our land in the future.

James Taylor is talented fer sure, I thought he just needed to get on anti depressants about 40 years ago, he is a downer.
But now I know it's his liberalism that has him depressed.

[tennesseetiger]

Nothing good will come of this...