Dirt Bike anyone?

[Lumber_Jack]

Just a thought, but any chance you can do what you want on a mountain bike? You might be surprised by the terrain you can ride on one if you haven't tried.

It sure would be a lot cheaper, easier to haul around, plus more exercise. :)

Yeah, usually I'm trying to save energy as I'm heading into remote woods to cruise timber. And generally speaking in the mtns, most road access is in the creeks and bottoms so usually travel is uphill, so in that case I'd be better hiking.

[gregintenn]

If you're able to spend more, the other bike I can suggest is a KTM 300 EXC.   It's a "do all" bike that I've always wanted.  The video does a good job in the begining at explaining why a 2 stroke still wins the hearts of many folks.   

 

[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cwImtQw3WA[/media]

I have friends who own KTMs. They are definitely competitive in hare scrambles, and sound as good to me as a vintage Martin guitar, but seem awfully high maintenance for a casual ride.

Edited January 4, 2015 by gregintenn

[Lumber_Jack]

What kind of maintenance do these things require? I am mechanical so it's not an issue just wondering what type of home maintenance and shop work is needed and how often

[tennessee01tacoma]

I ride a 1980 Suzuki PE400, its an enduro style 2 stroke with low gearing its made for off road and trails not too much top speed. I would say anything 250 or bigger is great for your average adult male. As for 2 vs 4 stroke I love the simplicity of a 2 stroke, no timing to worry about no valve train to worry about just fuel compression and fire. The downside of two strokes is that peak power and torque usually come in a burst not smooth and gradual like a 4 stroke, but I've seen too many times where this has been used to the riders advantage, so I don't consider it a problem. Gearing is key for a 2 stroke, in w two stroke its better to be in a lower gear turning more rpms than to be in a higher gear turning lower rpms. Edited January 4, 2015 by tennessee01tacoma

[Spots]

What kind of maintenance do these things require? I am mechanical so it's not an issue just wondering what type of home maintenance and shop work is needed and how often

A two stroke will need fresh rings and plugs on occasion. Nothing super crazy. And change the oil. The new MX style four strokes can be quiet maintenance intensive, with valve adjustments and top end rebuilds. An older trail style four stroke like the XR series is just gas and go with ocassional oil changes. They are bomb proof. A 2 stroke KDX 220 is an amazing trail bike, one I had forgot about. 125 two strokes are peaky and can be more difficult to ride due to the lack of low end tq and the sudden spike in power. A 250 2 stroke is basically equivalent to a 450 four stroke, that raced together for years. A 400cc+ two stroke is a rare beast these days and can hurt you badly if your not an experienced rider.

[173rdABN]

I've owned my YZ295 for 2 years now. Never changed a plug, and yes I check it often, never an issue with it. I've also spent LOTS of time getting the jetting correct. Because its a big bore there isn't just a factory spec on what to do with the motor. I have a coated piston in there which comes standard from Eric Gorr and he says they last 100ish hours. I'd normally change my top ends about every 60 hours before. I'm welllll past 100 hours now and it still looks new in there (the top end). So, I'm going to see how far I can push it and just do a total engine rebuild when its at its breaking point. I ride at LBL a couple times a month in the summer time with a buddy. If you get a bike and want to head up there, let me know. I'd be happy to haul our bikes up there for a good day of riding.

Oh, oil changes, about every 2-3 rides. Never past 3 rides. Rode 4 times once on the same oil and it came out grey. Wasn't happy with that and felt really bad I did that to my motor. Cant get lax when it comes to that. Even 4 strokes need the oil changed every couple rides. Also, 4 strokes use oil filters, 2's don't. Little cost savings right there. I just throw in 75W Bel Ray gear oil and my motor is a happy camper.

Another great thing if you can afford it, is run flats. Tubliss is what they are called. I just ran one in the rear to start, and I got to LBL one day and my tire was flat. Rode all day on a flat tire. was like having a tank track. didn't hurt the bike or rim what-so-ever. I was sold. Period. Hands down. end of report. I put on in the front tire the next day. Best $100 you can spend (per rim). And with you riding in the woods, and ever getting a flat its not very fun to push your bike out the entire way. haha.

Jetting is seriously a big deal though. I used to get a lot of splooge out of my bike. Oil that wasn't burning from the premix and going through the pipe and collecting in the muffler packing. It used to pour out of my pipe when I got the bike. the guy before me said he hadn't had time to get the jetting right so it was left one me. I've gone through a couple things of muffler packing now trying to get it perfect, and when I did, MANNNNNN was there a difference in performance. jet, jet, and jet some more. get it right the first time and your bike with thank you for it years and years later when its still running right.

Edited January 5, 2015 by 173rdABN

[Wyldk2]

You know,I actually looked into getting a motosports MX bike even as I have an ATV. But if i were to do that, I fear my motherwould haunt me for buying a motorcycle. True, there are places you can go that an ATV cannot, but there are places I can go where a MX has trouble.

 

I may still one day get an MX but right now the only 2-wheeler I have is my trusty K2 mountianbike. Excellent quiet stealthy bike, yet it lacks the power to hill climb.

 

I did ride on friday some trails at Windrock that added a pucker factor of maybe 9 on the 1-10 scale that i know a MX would look at and just run it all out.

Edited January 5, 2015 by Wyldk2

[Lumber_Jack]

Yes, I haven't even broached the topic with my wife. She is very anti-motorcycle but that's due to the risk of collision with vehicles. I don't see much difference when ridden responsible off-road as an ATV. I really have no desire to ride on the street, plus she'd divorce me over that one

[Johnny Rotten]

If you're able to spend more, the other bike I can suggest is a KTM 300 EXC.   It's a "do all" bike that I've always wanted.  The video does a good job in the begining at explaining why a 2 stroke still wins the hearts of many folks.   
 
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cwImtQw3WA[/media]

I remember racing Plaster City CA, its a racing town in the SoCal desert, we were lined up (over 100 bikes) in a lemans style type start, I was lined up next to a Factory KTM rider with a 500 and I had a brand spanking new CR500 my buddy was on the other side of me (CR500 to), we were sizing him up and we only came up with his smaller then usual rear sprocket, we go 0-90+mph in know time, our bikes are flat out, maybe 100 but I doubt it, maybe about 2 miles into the race Mr KTM passed us like we were painted to the ground he was doing at least 30mph faster then we were, we only closed on him in the hilly areas as long as he was on flat land he was long gone..

[glowdotGlock]

I have had everything from a 125cc 2 stroke to a 650 4 stroke. And for the woods and trails you definitely benefit from the 4 stroke. I haven't rode in a few years and don't even own one anymore but my last bike was a Honda XR 400 and it was a great trail bike. 2 strokes are fun, fast and light but are a little more maintenance. I've always said real motors have valves.

[Good_Steward]

Yes, I haven't even broached the topic with my wife. She is very anti-motorcycle but that's due to the risk of collision with vehicles. I don't see much difference when ridden responsible off-road as an ATV. I really have no desire to ride on the street, plus she'd divorce me over that one

I love my bikes. I couldn't imagine not being able to do what I do as far as riding. Two 3,000+mile trips and one 4,200+ mile trips this year, Iron Butt rides, not to mention the short 3-400 mile trips. Edited January 5, 2015 by Good_Steward

[Good_Steward]

I will also add that a novice, and experienced for that matter, rider needs to be ridiculously careful on the trails. There are a lot of opportunities to be hurt in a split second. More so than on a street bike, IMO.

[TripleDigitRide]

Haven't ridden dirt since '94. Had a '92 YZ250 and a '93 KX500. Miss those days.

[Lumber_Jack]

I will also add that a novice, and experienced for that matter, rider needs to be ridiculously careful on the trails. There are a lot of opportunities to be hurt in a split second. More so than on a street bike, IMO.

I can appreciate that. But the incidence of being hit by a tractor trailer is minimal. My wife is a Doctor, she's spent too many stints in the ER. I don't conclude that motorcycles are more likely to be involved in an accident but the likelihood of injury is much higher, that's just physics....and she's the boss.

[lunarpowered]

If you get a trail bike, make sure it isn't electric start only. I've been stranded before with a Yamaha TTR that only had electric start. Had to push it to a hill high enough to bump start it. Edited January 5, 2015 by lunarpowered

[JohnC]

Only difference between that bike and a 89, is the aluminum frame and a few other goodies, I haven't followed bikes in yrs so I don't know if the $10.5k price tag is good or bad, gut feeling it's a couple k over a regular bike...I'm too old to ride 500's nowadays I'd probably do something really stupid and pay big time for it, this is more my speed today:

It is a little more than a 450R.

That's mainly because they have to build the engines (Honda has a contract with them and they only sale the engine parts, not an assembled engine) and take a new 450R, remove the engine and rebuild the frame to fit the motor.

I will buy one of these when I get a chance. I have a deep love for the 500 pinger. Especially the sound and smell with a high comp head running on leaded C12.

Back to the OP. If you don't mind mixing 2-stroke and a little more maintainace than a 4 stroke, try that KTM 300 or a 250 2-stroke.

[Caster]

I gotta disagree on the two strokes.
I had a Suzuki PE400 that was a thumper in woods. Great low end but would jump like a bullfrog with a simple twist.
Maintenance was brain dead and only mildly involved. New plug was the most frequent. I did go through a lot of plugs. New top end about twice over four years.
I was in my late teens....I abused the unholy hell out of it.
I used to sneak out on the road and run it at wide open throttle in second or third gear just because I loved to hear the sound.
I wouldn't run a 4 cycle as hard.

If you go with a two stoke, do yourself a favor, don't assume they're simple...even though they are. Spend a little time and educate yourself thoroughly. They're so simple to turn wrenches on, if you really know what's going on in there, it's quite fun and adds to th experience.
I will say you'll need to keep a wrench and a spare plug or two in a tool kit. A 4 cycle need not do such a thing but a plug can and will act stupid when you're furthest from the truck. Lol!

[Caster]

I know they've come a LONG way with 4 cycle and I've seen some well built late models that are just plain scary but they still can't give you the thrill. 4 cycles have a pyramid power band. Comes up and peaks then falls off if you look at a graph.
A 2 stroke is a plateau. It jumps up immediately and maintains a level amount of power over a broad rpm range.
I've rode a 650 single cylinder (4 cycle) that pulled so hard it was rough on your shoulders and it paled in comparison to a buddy's KX500. That thing is just plain STUPID!

It's really sad to see the 2cycle dying off.

[rbishop]

KTM makes some two-strokes that have tons of torque and low end pulling power. They might be a little advanced for a beginner though. I have ridden off-road for 45 years. The only difficult thing about it these days is finding a place to ride. Not much public land available anymore. The national forests have long been a no go. The last off-road riding I did was on a large tract of leased property.

[Lumber_Jack]

I didn't realize the entire National Forest was off limits to non DOT approved ATVs. That's such a waste. So much of that land goes virtually unused. Rant over

[Lumber_Jack]

I, as a forester, do have several places I can ride.

What do you all see as best tips for learning to ride? Anything to be aware of. I have ridden 4wheeelers extensively, but this is a new ball game.

[gregintenn]

I, as a forester, do have several places I can ride.

What do you all see as best tips for learning to ride? Anything to be aware of. I have ridden 4wheeelers extensively, but this is a new ball game.

Practice. It's basically a bicycle you don't have to pedal.

 

Wear a helmet and good boots.

Edited January 5, 2015 by gregintenn

[Lumber_Jack]

I have good bicycle skills both mountain and road. I feel confident I can learn to ride in reasonable time

[10-Ring]

Forget everything you know about 4 wheelers. Practice in an open area where there isn't anything hard and stationary to hit until you get the hang of things. I've taught a lit of people to ride over the years and always start them on some kind of dirt bike.

[Caster]

An open field. Practice and take it easy.

Let you in on a few secrets. 99.9% chance you will never have a wreck until you start thinking you're good. If you ever catch yourself thinking you're getting good at it....take a break.

Also, get a GOOD helmet. If you have a $2 head then wear a $2 helmet. Appraise the value of your body and spend money on boots, helmet etc accordingly. No one who rides regularly ever says, man I wish I had bought cheap crap instead of this top shelf stuff. No one.