Most Popular Gun in U.S. Recalled

[The Legion]

America's oldest gun manufacturer, Remington, has agreed to replace millions of triggers in its most popular product—the Model 700 rifle. The company has been riddled for years with claims the gun can fire without the trigger being pulled, often with deadly results.

 

http://www.cnbc.com/id/102236497?__source=xfinity|mod&par=xfinity#.

[res308]

Yep. I wish they would just send me a new trigger. Or, just send me a coupon for a Jewel, Timney, Rifle Basics, etc. Don't feel like sending my rifle off.

[Omega]

According to the article I read, they will reimburse you if you have already replaced the walker trigger, which is the target of the new recall. Mine was sent in for the x mark recall, but I would be happy to trade it for a walker trigger if anyone is interested :)

[DaveTN]

Mechanical devices can fail. If you follow the rules of gun safety it is nearly impossible to shoot someone.

Switching off a safety on a loaded rifle while it is pointed at your son is reckless.

Glock has been plagued with accusations that the gun went off without pulling the trigger for years. Did they recall them? No, they offered “upgrades”.

I’ve seen many times those new to firearms posting that there is no such thing as a “accidental discharge” only “negligent discharges” and that a gun can’t discharge without pulling the trigger; that is what they have been told, and it is wrong.

I sent my 700 in and they replaced the trigger and sent it back. Did it need it? Probably not, but it didn’t cost me anything so I had it done. My rifle isn’t loaded unless it’s pointed down range, and the trigger is excellent; so I didn’t want to pay $150 for a trigger I don’t need.

Remington is trying to do what’s right. They are a great American Firearms Company that makes an excellent product. I wish them continued success.

[satalac]

Still debating sending mine in. Like was said previously, if you shoot someone with the gun, that's your fault, not the gun's. Maybe after my hog trip to Texas I'll send it in. I've never had a problem with it though.

[Erik88]

Remington is trying to do what’s right. They are a great American Firearms Company that makes an excellent product. 

 

What a crock of B.S.....

 

I guess you forgot about the R51? People have been complaining for years and they are just NOW doing something about it. This is purely a CYA move.

[DaveTN]

What a crock of B.S.....
 
I guess you forgot about the R51? People have been complaining for years and they are just NOW doing something about it. This is purely a CYA move.

They own the bolt market with the Remington 700, they own the pump market with 870. Two of the best long guns ever made. Of course you are a target when you are at the top.

The R51 was a problem; they pulled it from the market and offered buyers their money back. What else would you have them do?

This may well be a CYA move; that’s what companies do. People carelessly use firearms and you think they should be sued out of existence? Glock is still selling and they have had issues for many years.

[Erik88]

I suspect they won't be owning the market much longer.

 

I've lost a lot of respect for them and I'm sure the families of these people have too.

 

 

 

At least two dozen deaths and more than 100 serious injuries have been linked to inadvertent discharges of Remington 700 series rifles.

[DaveTN]

I suspect they won't be owning the market much longer.
 
I've lost a lot of respect for them and I'm sure the families of these people have too.

You are still a Glock fan are you not? Have you lost respect for them? How many families do you think blame a Glock for inadvertent discharges killing friends or family members? This is just a WAG but I’m going to say the number would eclipse the Remington 700 number.

[Erik88]

You are still a Glock fan are you not? Have you lost respect for them? How many families do you think blame a Glock for inadvertent discharges killing friends or family members? This is just a WAG but I’m going to say the number would eclipse the Remington 700 number.

 

what are you talking about? The only time I've heard of that was the back in the 90's and I don't think anyone was killed. Google isn't even turning anything up. There  are also no lawsuits against Glock for this.

 

It doesn't even matter. Two wrongs don't make a right. 

[Jct1911]

I wish I could send them my only 700 and them send me a check. I'd go replace it with a savage.

[Garufa]

I do love Remington but they've been pumping out crap for decades.

[Erik88]

Mechanical devices can fail. If you follow the rules of gun safety it is nearly impossible to shoot someone.

Switching off a safety on a loaded rifle while it is pointed at your son is reckless.
 

 

You need to do more research. I read this on another forum and I'm watching the video now.

Remington has blood on their hands. It's pretty disgusting honestly. 

http://www.cnbc.com/live-tv/cnbc-originals/full-episode/remington-under-fire-a-cnbc-investigation/367370307529

 

 

 

His wife, the boys mother is who was unloading the gun when it went off. She can't even talk about it. As far as she knew the kids were behind her, but the boy ran around to the other side of the trailer to get his jacket. She had the muzzle pointed down and it went through the trailer floor, out beside the trailer where he was and hit him. 

Edited December 7, 2014 by Erik88

[DaveTN]

You need to do more research. I read this on another forum and I'm watching the video now.
Remington has blood on their hands. It's pretty disgusting honestly. 
http://www.cnbc.com/live-tv/cnbc-originals/full-episode/remington-under-fire-a-cnbc-investigation/367370307529

I saw it several years ago when it first aired. I’ve done my research. To say they have blood on their hands is ridiculous.

The same claims have been made against many gun manufacturers.

As I said, I just got my 700 back from a trigger recall (not the one related to this). I thought about what the issues were and whether or not I needed it. With the way I use my rifle and the safety procedures I use I didn’t think it could be an issue. But I go through a lot of guns so I decided to do it in case someone else got the gun.

As you acknowledged yourself Glock has had claims of the gun firing without the trigger being pulled.

The Father in this case has settled and says Remington should be commended for the recall and putting this behind us. That’s good enough for me.

But let me be clear on this; I am not saying that a rifle can’t fire with the safety being flipped off; I am not saying that a handgun can’t discharge when dropping the slide to chamber a round. And I’m not saying that it doesn’t become a bigger possibility when Bubba is wrenching on actions, adjusting triggers, or replacing triggers or components on a mechanical device he doesn’t thoroughly understand. When he screws something up and kills himself or a bystander; there will be an attorney there to take his case.

[Omega]

I like my 700, though many complain about the x mark trigger I never had any issues with it.  I have also used many civilian and military 700 with the Walker trigger without a hitch, even with a few of them having their triggers lightened.  I thing Remington is just trying to get out of all these legal battles with this recall.  Whether the 700 is at fault or not, its still expensive to defend in court.  You guys see this?

 

 Remington's Response to CNBC Under Fire: http://youtu.be/B_KVS1hIbQg

 

[DaveTN]

I like my 700, though many complain about the x mark trigger I never had any issues with it.  I have also used many civilian and military 700 with the Walker trigger without a hitch, even with a few of them having their triggers lightened.  I thing Remington is just trying to get out of all these legal battles with this recall.  Whether the 700 is at fault or not, its still expensive to defend in court.  You guys see this?

Facts spoil everything; that’s why huge lawsuits haven’t been awarded. CNBC can say almost anything they want with little or no facts to back it up, they can slant the info they do have to make a sensational program. A sensational program that leaves people making statements like “Remington has blood on their hands.”

[Erik88]

Facts spoil everything; that’s why huge lawsuits haven’t been awarded. CNBC can say almost anything they want with little or no facts to back it up, they can slant the info they do have to make a sensational program. A sensational program that leaves people making statements like “Remington has blood on their hands.”

 

Actually, they have been awarded. Remington has settled out of court with numerous families for untold amounts of cash. I can tell you never watched the video I linked.

[whitewolf001]

Working in the automotive industry has led me to the belief that I'm more willing to trust a company that is truthful enough to come out and say, "hey, we @#$%ed up."(such as Toyota though this may a lil biased) rather than a company whose mission is to bury the recall and make it as low profile as possible to save face and suppress a PR nightmare(such as GM with the Cobalt that has gotten numerous people killed which they knew about 1 year prior to the official announcement). 

[Omega]

Actually, they have been awarded. Remington has settled out of court with numerous families for untold amounts of cash. I can tell you never watched the video I linked.

If I remember correctly, Remington settled a few, but no jury awards.  Don't get me wrong, I dislike Remington's business practices.  They rolled out a new caliber, the 300Blk with a bait and switch round which was supposed to be an affordable plinking round at around $12 to $14 a box but used some qc excuse to stop producing the round at that price point.  But I have to say that their 700 line has received a bad rap, if you follow a few simple rules you should never get anyone hurt or killed.  If your weapon is loaded, you never point it at anything you don't want a hole in.  At most an AD should go down range into a berm or possibly into the woods if you are hunting.  I could see a lawsuit from someone getting shot in the woodline from and AD, but you know how unlucky you would have to be?

 

The truth is that many companies will settle out of court due to the fact that it is cheaper for them in the long run.  Many see this and will file a suit because even if it was mainly their fault they stand a good chance of getting money out of it and lawyers will do the legal work with no out of pocket fees because they know that same thing.  if there are enough law suits a recall can be cheaper in the long run, even though there is nothing technically wrong with the product. If you talk to many walker trigger owners, there are not many that will send it back to Remington, that says a lot for that trigger.  I will gladly trade my x mark for a Walker, even though I have no problems with the x mark I like the Walkers ease of adjustability.

 

Look up on YouTube, their are many videos showing how to adjust the trigger properly but once you get in there you have to take responsibility for the fact that you have modified the trigger beyond what the factory meant it to be at and any repercussions should be on you.  If you buy a used rifle, its up to you to do your do diligence to make sure it is in tip top shape when you take it out shooting.  If you are unsure of the proper trigger setting, take it to a smith or return it to the manufacturer to make sure; that goes for any make or model.  Same goes for all these ARs we love to build, there are a few things that can make the rifle unsafe and its not the manufacturers fault for any modifications you make. 

[SmokyBaer]

Working in the automotive industry has led me to the belief that I'm more willing to trust a company that is truthful enough to come out and say, "hey, we @#$%ed up."(such as Toyota though this may a lil biased) rather than a company whose mission is to bury the recall and make it as low profile as possible to save face and suppress a PR nightmare(such as GM with the Cobalt that has gotten numerous people killed which they knew about 1 year prior to the official announcement). 

 

All those manufacturers have "blood on their hands"... even Toyota with the accelerator issues a while back and now the airbag thing that nobody fessed up with until they got busted.  "Oh yeah, we meant to say something bout dat but..."  :shrug:

[whitewolf001]

All those manufacturers have "blood on their hands"... even Toyota with the accelerator issues a while back and now the airbag thing that nobody fessed up with until they got busted.  "Oh yeah, we meant to say something bout dat but..."  :shrug:

The accelerator issue that got that family in California killed? You mean where they put all-weather mats on top of carpet mats where it clearly states to not do that right on the mats? Also people removing the clips retaining their mats in place might have had issue with this as well. Thus peoples own prerogative got them killed in some cases. Pertaining to the clock-spring issue, there is no excuse there for their actions. I wasn't aware that this too was swept under the rug like GM's. We only started issuing the recalls recently and apparently some dealerships were notified of the issue and what to watch for as they had an inkling that it may become prevalent. If they had ANY inkling, action should have been taken immediately, but then I'm not a corporate fat cat... Not trying to sound like a buttocks, just going off the information that I have at my disposal. My opinion is subject to change depending on data. ;)

 

"Mfg. Campaign No. N/A - Accelerator Pedal. DOM: 1/03-6/03. If retention clip used to secure floor carpet cover is missing, cover can interfere with operation of accelerator pedal when pedal is depressed to nearly full throttle position. Accelerator pedal can become stuck and result in vehicle crash. Correct by replacing retention clip and floor carpet cover. (This action is Safety Improvement Campaign not being conducted under National Traffic and Motor Vehicle Safety Act.)"

 

 

 

But back to the topic at hand, I still stand by Remington's decision to issue the recall, even if many of the guns they've been churning out have been garbage BUT, that being said, they do need to get their act together. They're doing the opposite of what Taurus did and have been getting worse and worse, with the R51, 700 recall, 887 recall, and even the Ultra Mags have a magazine feed issue. I found a vid of it on youtube at one point, I'll see if I can't dig it up. **Mind the language, lol.

http://youtu.be/ykJM2cP8uHc
 

Edited December 9, 2014 by whitewolf001

[Omega]

The accelerator issue that got that family in California killed? You mean where they put all-weather mats on top of carpet mats where it clearly states to not do that right on the mats? Also people removing the clips retaining their mats in place might have had issue with this as well. Thus peoples own prerogative got them killed in some cases. Pertaining to the clock-spring issue, there is no excuse there for their actions. I wasn't aware that this too was swept under the rug like GM's. We only started issuing the recalls recently and apparently some dealerships were notified of the issue and what to watch for as they had an inkling that it may become prevalent. If they had ANY inkling, action should have been taken immediately, but then I'm not a corporate fat cat... Not trying to sound like a buttocks, just going off the information that I have at my disposal. My opinion is subject to change depending on data. ;)

 

"Mfg. Campaign No. N/A - Accelerator Pedal. DOM: 1/03-6/03. If retention clip used to secure floor carpet cover is missing, cover can interfere with operation of accelerator pedal when pedal is depressed to nearly full throttle position. Accelerator pedal can become stuck and result in vehicle crash. Correct by replacing retention clip and floor carpet cover. (This action is Safety Improvement Campaign not being conducted under National Traffic and Motor Vehicle Safety Act.)"

 

 

 

But back to the topic at hand, I still stand by Remington's decision to issue the recall, even if many of the guns they've been churning out have been garbage BUT, that being said, they do need to get their act together. They're doing the opposite of what Taurus did and have been getting worse and worse, with the R51, 700 recall, 887 recall, and even the Ultra Mags have a magazine feed issue. I found a vid of it on YouTube at one point, I'll see if I can't dig it up. **Mind the language, lol.

http://youtu.be/ykJM2cP8uHc
 

I have two of the Toyotas in question, they wanted to cut the corner of my mat off and place an override on my gas pedal so if both the brake and gas were pushed at the same time the brake would override the gas...bad idea on a 4WD that actually goes off-road.  I did not comply with the recall, IF my gas pedal gets stuck, you flip it into neutral and get off the road.  When going up steep inclines off road, I rev the engine while holding the brake so I don't slide backward.  I could not do that if they did the mod.  Now the airbag, yes I see that as a legit issue and should of been recalled as soon as they noticed it.

 

I have seen many YouTube videos purported to show this, but I take those with a grain of salt.  There are quite a few showing how to properly set the trigger, and some will explain how if it is done wrong then you will get this failure.  If it were such a problem then how come experts for either side have not been able to replicate these failures?  If I have a weapon that I do not maintain or modify, I don't expect the manufacturer to be responsible.  Now if its a brand new weapon out the box, then yes I would expect the manufacturer to make it right.  With all the thousands or maybe even millions of rifles sold you would think this would surface way more than it has if it was an manufacturer issue.

[SmokyBaer]

Jus me, but I see no difference in blaming user-error for moving a mat that now sticks an accelerator and putting 3 pounds of junk on a keyring causing it to flip itself off.  Both instances have the companies scurrying to cover their assets by blaming somebody besides themselves.  Granted, the airbags blowing up in your face is more in line with Remington's hairy discharge problem.  The problem there is nobody else to use the blamethrower on so they gotsta swallow hard and eat it.  None of those companies did an instant recall when they first found the problem.  In my opinion, there are no "Good Guys" in corporate imaging just the lawyers and fanboys that want us to believe the :poop: they are shoveling out.   Not that I'm bitter or anything, jus saying, "Who can you believe in these days?"

[Omega]

Jus me, but I see no difference in blaming user-error for moving a mat that now sticks an accelerator and putting 3 pounds of junk on a keyring causing it to flip itself off.  Both instances have the companies scurrying to cover their assets by blaming somebody besides themselves.  Granted, the airbags blowing up in your face is more in line with Remington's hairy discharge problem.  The problem there is nobody else to use the blamethrower on so they gotsta swallow hard and eat it.  None of those companies did an instant recall when they first found the problem.  In my opinion, there are no "Good Guys" in corporate imaging just the lawyers and fanboys that want us to believe the :poop: they are shoveling out.   Not that I'm bitter or anything, jus saying, "Who can you believe in these days?"

I think they have a reasonable right to put the blame where they have.  The rugs in question have at least two clips that keep the mat from moving forward.  They are a bit of a nuisance how they stick up so its possible to step on them or stub your shoe on them so I can see how some would remove the clips.  As for the key chain part, come on why would you want to have a ton of keys on a ring like that.  Its like those gas station bathroom keys with the brick on them, you expect a lock to hold a brick in the keyhole without bending the key?  In those instances I do think that they made the recall to keep from having to litigate a bunch of cases and spend way more money than the recall will cost. 

 

Like I said, there are plenty of cases where the equipment does have genuine problems.  But once you go messing with factory settings I don't think its the manufacturers fault or responsibility to fix it.  You think a manufacturer will warranty a product when you do something like rooting a phone, chipping an xbox or something as simple as using reloads in some guns?  I am not one of those that think that all these corporations have no faults, on the contrary, they have plenty and it affects us in one way or another.  But not everything is their fault either.  Heck I read where the parents from Newton CT (Sandy Hook) are considering suing Bushmaster for wrongful death.  And they may get some money out of it, but it doesn't mean Bushmaster is at fault; they did pay out in the Washington sniper case so it may be likely they will pay here too. 

[SmokyBaer]

Well there ya go... if Bushmaster had not built the trigger, the bad guy could not have pulled it.

Makes perfect sense.  NAW!! :wall: