Why is William Ayers important to this election.

[Guest Ghostrider]

I know, I'm as tired as anyone of you about this election busines. BUT; I lived through that period of time and heard this years ago, it's just taken me a long time to find the video. I've found the text of it before, but no one reads anymore, at least young people, and they are the ones that need to hear this.

Now, I'm not going to debate the relationship between the messiah and Ayers, you can figure that one out for yourself.

Do watch the video and think about 25 million while you do. Then take a look at your parents, friends, etc and figure out if they would be in that number.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJn5b8_weUY[/ame]

[Guest m&pc9]

I didnt know they went that far.

[Guest Dean_JC78]

Ayers makes me sick.

Some people really do not think it matters today but I say it does for the simple fact that it shows a pattern.

Obama came from a VERY corrupt political system in the windy city. He did not reform them but rather they conformed him. Ayers, Tony, Wright, and his hateful wife are not smears against him but these are the people he shares views with. Though he says he never heard anything Wright say he disagreed with, I am guessing that means he agreed with all of it.

If it was just one of those guys you could argue that its not a big deal but Obama has surrounded himself with the scum of the earth as his friends! That is not a smear, that is a pattern!

[fury2neon]

Ayers is just one among many terrorist supporters of Obama.

Hamas and Hezbollah through in their support last spring.

Gaddafi has bee raising money for Obama and says "the man from Kenya will be president of the United States"

Other terrorist leaders have also voiced their support but the press just seems to ignore it.

Who would have thought that we would be electing someone who has the support of the people who celebrated the 9/11/01 attacks.

[TGO David]

Ghost, you know that the GOP merely went back in time to record that video for the sole sake of smearing Obama's good name in 2008.

But seriously, for some reason the American public has become disconnected with the idea that people should be judged by the company they keep. It is now considered to be politically incorrect or divisive to look at who a person surrounds themselves with, who they seek or get counsel from, who supports them monetarily or morally, etc.

The hypocrisy of the Left knows no bounds at all. Obama, the candidate of "Change" is worshiped for his re-branded Socialism masquerading under the thin guise of Progressiveness and has aligned himself with a career Washington insider, Biden, as his running mate. Meanwhile, McCain is mocked for choosing a running mate who IS progressive, who has not come up through the corrupt ranks of the Washington political establishment, and who actually has taken on unethical government agencies in her home state and beaten them into pulp.

Change? Give me a break.

[Guest Len]

Judging people by the company they keep is a legitimate strategy in judging the character of a person. And guilt by association has no place in our system of justice. It seems to me the line between these two ideas is pretty fine at times. The claims about Obama's relationship to Ayers is a great example of this.

Here's what my research on the relationship between Obama and Ayers has found. (Despite what some may think, I am not a knee-jerk liberal. A liberal yes, but a considered one.) Note the last entry, from a Republican state Representative from IL.

Columbus Dispatch: "Numerous Investigations" Have Concluded That Obama And Ayers "Are Not Close." "Numerous investigations have concluded that Obama and Ayers, founder of a 1960s radical group that bombed government buildings when Obama was a little boy, are not close." [Columbus Dispatch, 10/12/08]

Factcheck.org: McCain-Palin Are Making "False And Misleading Statements" About Obama And Ayers Relationship "Which Was Never Very Close." "Voters may differ in how they see Ayers, or how they see Obama's interactions with him. We're making no judgment calls on those matters. What we object to are the McCain-Palin campaign's attempts to sway voters - in ads and on the stump - with false and misleading statements about the relationship, which was never very close. Obama never 'lied' about this, just as he never bragged about it. The foundation they both worked with was hardly 'radical.' And Ayers is more than a former 'terrorist,' he's also a well-known figure in the field of education." [Factcheck.org, 10/10/08]

New York Times: Obama And Ayers "Do Not Appear To Have Been Close." "And the effort to tie Mr. Obama to Mr. Ayers is overstated. Mr. Ayers, who is now an education professor in Chicago, did host a coffee for Mr. Obama's first run for office, and serve with him on a charitable board, but the two men do not appear to have been close, and Mr. Obama does not appear to have expressed sympathy for Mr. Ayers's past radical actions." [New York Times, 10/11/08]

AP: Palin's Reference To Obama And Ayers "Palling Around" Was "Exaggerated At Best If Not Outright False." "Her reference to Obama's relationship with William Ayers, a member of the Vietnam-era Weather Underground, was exaggerated at best if not outright false. No evidence shows they were 'pals' or even close when they worked on community boards years ago and Ayers hosted a political event for Obama early in his career. Obama, who was a child when the Weathermen were planting bombs, has denounced Ayers' radical views and actions." [AP, 10/5/08]

CNN Calls Palin Claim That Obama Palled Around With Terrorists "False." "The New York Times article cited by Palin concluded that 'the two men do not appear to have been close. Nor has Mr. Obama ever expressed sympathy for the radical views and actions of Mr. Ayers.' Other publications, including the Washington Post, Time magazine, the Chicago Sun-Times, The New Yorker and The New Republic, have said that their reporting doesn't support the idea that Obama and Ayers had a close relationship. The McCain campaign did not respond Saturday to a request for elaboration on Palin's use of the plural 'terrorists.' Verdict: False. There is no indication that Ayers and Obama are now 'palling around,' or that they have had an ongoing relationship in the past three years. Also, there is nothing to suggest that Ayers is now involved in terrorist activity or that other Obama associates are." [CNN, 10/5/08]

New York Times: A Review Of Records And Interviews Shows That Obama And Ayers "Do Not Appear To Have Been Close" And Obama Has Never Expressed Sympathy For The Radical Views Or Actions Of Ayers. The New York Times reviewed records of the school project and interviewed a dozen people who knew both Obama and Ayers and determined "the two men do not appear to have been close. Nor has Mr. Obama ever expressed sympathy for the radical views and actions of Mr. Ayers, whom he has called 'somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago, when I was 8.'" [New York Times, 10/3/08]

Washington Post: Obama And Ayers "Have Had Only A Casual Association." "In fact, both a Washington Post article in April and today's New York Times piece revealed Obama and Ayers to have had only a casual association: the former radical hosted a coffee for Obama's first bid for state Senate, they served together on an educational charity board and both live in Chicago's Hyde Park. [Washington Post, 10/4/08]

Palin Has "Exaggerated" Obama's Ties To Ayers. According to the AP, Palin "has exaggerated the nature of Barack Obama's personal ties to a former 1960s radical..." [AP, 10/8/08]

MNSBC: "Obama Was Never 'Palling Around' With Ayers." "But as the New York Times reported today, Obama was never "palling around" with Ayers. "A review of records of the schools project and interviews with a dozen people who know both men, suggest that Mr. Obama, 47, has played down his contacts with Mr. Ayers, 63. But the two men do not appear to have been close. Nor has Mr. Obama ever expressed sympathy for the radical views and actions of Mr. Ayers, whom he has called 'somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago, when I was 8.'" [MSNBC 10/4/08]

Politifact: Palin's Claim That Obama Was "Palling Around With Terrorists" Is "False." Politifact, a service of CQ and the St. Petersburg Times wrote, "In previous speeches the day before her appearance in Clearwater, Palin accused Obama of 'palling around with terrorists.' We think that statement goes too far, and is just false, as there is no evidence that Obama has had any relationship with Ayers as a U.S. senator." [Politifact, 10/6/08]

LA Times: There Is No Evidence that Obama Shared Ayers' Approval Of Violence Or His Views About Whether America Is 'A Force For Good In The World.' For Palin And McCain To Insinuate Otherwise Is A 21st Century Form Of McCarthyism." In 2008, the Los Angeles Times reported, "But their association should not be distorted. There is no evidence that Obama shared Ayers' approval of violence or his views about whether America is "a force for good in this world." For Palin and McCain to insinuate otherwise is a 21st century form of McCarthyism." [Editorial, LA Times, 10/7/08]

Former Illinois State Republican Rep. Diana Nelson, Who Worked With Both Obama And Ayers Over The Years, Called The Ayers/Obama Attacks "Ridiculous" And Said "There Is Not Reason At All To Smear Barack Obama With This Association. It's Not Nonsensical, And It Just Makes Me Crazy, It's So Silly." "'It was never a concern by any of us in the Chicago school reform movement that he had led a fugitive life years earlier,' said former Illinois state Republican Rep. Diana Nelson, who worked with both Obama and Ayers over the years. 'It's ridiculous. There is no reason at all to smear Barack Obama with this association. It's nonsensical, and it just makes me crazy. It's so silly.' Nelson says her fellow Republicans 'might snort when they hear the name Bill Ayers, because they know he comes from a wealthy family, they know he became a radical activist early in his life ... but beyond just snorting, I don't think anyone gives it another thought.' 'I don't remember ever hearing anyone raise concerns or questions or concerns about [Ayers'] background,' says Anne Hallett, who has worked closely with Ayers on the Annenberg Challenge grant and with Obama on education and other community and legislative matters. 'And that included everybody I was engaged with,' including prominent Republicans, and corporate and civic leaders in Chicago, Hallett adds. Hallett calls this attack on Obama's association with Ayers and the Annenberg Challenge by further association, 'a smear campaign. It's a political diatribe that has no basis in fact. The Chicago Annenberg Challenge was an extremely positive initiative. It was well-vetted, thorough, and the fact that it is now is being used for political purposes is, in my opinion, outrageous.'" [NPR, 10/7/08]

• Nelson: "I Have Been Appalled By The Scurrilous Attacks" Against Obama For Knowing Ayers And "The Smear Campaign Of Guilt By Association Is Wrong."
  Former Republican Illinois State Rep. Diana Nelson wrote, "Perhaps because I served as an Illinois state representative in Springfield during a very different political climate, when Republican politicians like me had friends on the other side of the aisle, I have been appalled by the scurrilous attacks being made against Barack and Michelle Obama, which attempt to paint them as deeply flawed characters because they know William Ayers and Bernardine Dohrn. This much is true: Ayers and Dohrn, whether out of misguided anti-war sentiment or rebellion against a privileged upbringing, were actors in the Weather Underground, a radical, bomb-throwing student-protest movement during the 1960s. Bad, by all means. Stupid, yes. However, with age comes maturity. Ayers and Dohrn married, raised children and established careers in Chicago that brought them in contact with myriad individuals in the Chicago school-reform movement and those trying to improve our juvenile justice system. I visited the home of Ayers and Dohrn recently for a book-signing event for Michael and Susan Klonsky, activists and leaders of the small-schools movement. Activists to this day, of course, Ayers and Dohrn hold coffees for many politicians, including Obama. As a professor of education at the University of Illinois at Chicago, Ayers has directed his energies into mentoring new teachers. For bloggers to connect Obama's and Ayers' volunteer service on the Chicago Annenberg Challenge or the Woods Fund of Chicago board of directors as somehow part of a radical conspiracy is just plain silly. Also on the board of the Woods Fund is R. Eden Martin, president of the Civic Committee of the Commercial Club of Chicago and an influential business leader. What would bloggers say about that connection? This smear campaign of guilt by association is wrong. It makes no sense and diverts the body politic from an examination of Obama's and John McCain's positions on the Iraq War, the economy and the No Child Left Behind Act. Please, let us witness a return to civility. I am absolutely sickened by the detour down the low road that political campaigns have taken today." [Chicago Tribune, 10/13/08]
  

Edited October 25, 2008 by Len
Made easier to read

[Guest SUNTZU]

Weekly World News (The World's Only Reliable Newsource) - The recent unveiling of Obama’s mutant half brother has guaranteed him the mutant vote. Since then, Obatma has been on a road tour with Bat Boy rallying support for the Democratic candidate. The two are making appearances in key swing states, happily handing out stickers and posing for pictures.

http://www.weeklyworldnews.com/election-08/obatma-and-bat-boy-tour-us/

What? It's a newspaper, isn't it? That means its the truth, no matter what they want me to believe, right?

[fury2neon]

Weekly World News (The World's Only Reliable Newsource) - The recent unveiling of Obama’s mutant half brother has guaranteed him the mutant vote. Since then, Obatma has been on a road tour with Bat Boy rallying support for the Democratic candidate. The two are making appearances in key swing states, happily handing out stickers and posing for pictures.

http://www.weeklyworldnews.com/election-08/obatma-and-bat-boy-tour-us/

What? It's a newspaper, isn't it? That means its the truth, no matter what they want me to believe, right?

The weekly world news is as accurate as the NY Times.

And I gotta get me one of those Tesla Shields...

[Guest Ghostrider]

Len, I respect that you are a "considered" liberal. But my research came to different conclusions.

1. Fact: Obama launched his political career in Ayers living room.

2. Fact: Obama wrote a review/blurb for one of Ayers books in which Ayers mentioned obama as one of his neighbors. source: http://michellemalkin.com/2008/10/19/oh-these-are-the-people-in-your-neighborhood/

3. Fact:

Last April, Sen. Obama dismissed Mr. Ayers as just "a guy who lives in my neighborhood," and "not somebody who I exchange ideas with on a regular basis." Yet documents in the CAC archives make clear that Mr. Ayers and Mr. Obama were partners in the CAC. Those archives are housed in the Richard J. Daley Library at the University of Illinois at Chicago and I've recently spent days looking through them.

source: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122212856075765367.html

4. Fact: Ayers himself confirmed that obama knew about his radicalism. And that their "views matched" [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xBlTdsnOh8[/ame]

5. Fact:

Obama and Ayers actually shared an office address at 115 S. Sangamon Street in Chicago.

source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_HZMD97nMw&eurl=http://politicalpartypoop.com/category/terrorist-pimps/

There are lots more, but I'm ready to call it a night.

I suppose we'll just have to agree to disagree on this, but there is a lot more that "political propaganda" about this relationship. I live through that period of time, and I know personally that the weather underground was one of the most dangerous radical groups around. At the time, they hid behind the 'antiwar' mantra, but now ayers and his viper of a wife are successfully indoctrinating college kids.

I call that; sad.