Pandemic planning?

[Sam1]

***Not meant to be a thread about ebola and the current clusterf*** going on with that mess***

 

Thought a thread concerning this from a technical & preparedness viewpoint would be good to get going.  I seen Matt Drudge came back form the dead on Twitter to post "self-quarantine" on his account which got me thinking... To what level could someone reasonably self-quarantine if you lived near anyone.  How would you all deal with work, or getting supplies that you may need.  How would you deal with utilities & services if they stopped working.  This would be like a short-term issue, maybe 6 months or so and not a total SHTF the world is burning & Alex Jones is president kinda thing.

 

I think most of us here have limited resources and funding, so how would you decide on what money is to be spent on which supplies/resources?  Obviously on this forum I think just about everyone has the security part covered, but food & water, get a gas generator or a solar panel that is quiet but does fractional levels of power etc...

 

Would be interested to hear everyone's take on or your plan if you've already got one, to deal with a self-induced lockdown for a serious plague/pandemic etc..

[TMF]

Things like work and school wouldn't be calculated into the plan if it was that bad. Quite simply, I wouldn't leave my house and would survive on what I have stored for as long as possible. All entry points would be barricaded appropriately and there would be signage warning people not to enter my property or deadly force would be used. In a pandemic scenario, things like that may be common.


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[peejman]

Things like work and school wouldn't be calculated into the plan if it was that bad. Quite simply, I wouldn't leave my house and would survive on what I have stored for as long as possible. All entry points would be barricaded appropriately and there would be signage warning people not to enter my property or deadly force would be used. In a pandemic scenario, things like that may be common.


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Pretty much this and what dolomite said about water (which is one area in which I'm lacking).  Access to clean drinking water will be a big deal.

[Sam1]

One thing I didn't really think of that Glenn Beck mentioned he was doing the other day was picking up a few jugs of chlorine to keep on hand and use in a sprayer if they need.  I had never thought about that specifically before, as we keep bleach around but they will ruin just about everything it touches.

[Troutburger]

Yeah a tyvek suit, gloves and gas mask would go a long way if you had to venture out. 

Then have the wife give you a quick spray down with a garden sprayer full of bleach water in the driveway prior to entering the house. 

[Dolomite_supafly]

Do not buy wet bleach for storage. It turns into salt water pretty quickly.

 

Go to a pool supply store and buy calcium hypochlorite in dry form. It lasts so much longer and once added to water becomes bleach.

[Trekbike]

Do not buy wet bleach for storage. It turns into salt water pretty quickly.

Go to a pool supply store and buy calcium hypochlorite in dry form. It lasts so much longer and once added to water becomes bleach.

I'm not at home so I can't check the label. Is that the same ingredient in powdered bleach?

[TMF]

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[Dolomite_supafly]

I'm not at home so I can't check the label. Is that the same ingredient in powdered bleach?

No clue.

[dawgdoc]

I was looking at the PVC rainsuits in Wal-Mart the other day and wondering if they would be an alternative to Tyvek suits.  Ideally you wouldn't want to reuse anything, but realistically we can't all have a ton of disposable stuff.  You could shower in bleach with a rain suit on.  Lowe's has chemistry-lab goggles for $3 (the kind that seal around your eyes).  I also notice that they had chemical face shields that look like the type they have in the hospitals (not that those worked out too good for the two nurses).

 

I worry about either having to self quarantine because things get bad like in "Contagion," or worse, someone in my family getting infected after all the hospital resources have been exhausted.  Right now, if you get Ebola, you'll get sent to Emory or the NIH.  When you get infected half-way through an outbreak, you might be lucky to be treated in a tent on the lawn of the National Guard Armory.

 

I'd be real interested in what they have learned about treating Ebola, other than serum from an Ebola survivor seems to help.  Is it simple supportive care like IV fluids that can make the difference in survival in the US vs Africa, or is it a lot more complicated?  Nurse Pham didn't look too bad on the video they showed the other day.

 

Also, if it came to an expected period of long-self quarantine, I would first use the food that gives off the most odor when cooking, and save the freeze-dried stuff and cans for later when there might be more "mouths with feet" wandering around.  

 

On a whim one day, I made a solar cooker using one of those reflective auto windshield shades just to see if we could cook without any fuel at all.  The water got real hot.  I also made a rocket stove using a large popcorn tin.

[Ted S.]

If I was worried about a pandemic (and I'm not), I would just do what TMF suggested. I wouldn't risk going to public places. I don't trust breathable tyveks/suits nor do I trust filter-based respirators for anything immediately life threatening, such as biohazards, contagions, aerasolized pathogens, etc. If your ppe can breath and doesn't have its own self-contained air supply or active air purifier, you run a lot of risks. Much cheaper to stock up in supplies, and come up with a "dig in" or "bug out" plan than getting proper ppe for a pandemic. Edited October 19, 2014 by Ted S.

[R_Bert]

I was looking at the PVC rainsuits in Wal-Mart the other day and wondering if they would be an alternative to Tyvek suits.  Ideally you wouldn't want to reuse anything, but realistically we can't all have a ton of disposable stuff.  You could shower in bleach with a rain suit on.  Lowe's has chemistry-lab goggles for $3 (the kind that seal around your eyes).  I also notice that they had chemical face shields that look like the type they have in the hospitals (not that those worked out too good for the two nurses).

 

 

I pondered that the other day.  With a full containment suit, bleach makes sense, but with exposed skin (around goggles), it seems hard to implement.

[TNWNGR]

Basic needs stuff, food, water, medications and fuel are the constant basics. If your going to self quarantine then enough for those needs. A full scale pandemic with societal breakdown comes down to a community or village support based best case for success.  

 

Fully encapsulated suits are more geared towards first responders as a full decon before, during and after removal is proscribed. In that case I'd only trust self contained breathing apparatus units. Yeah. I've done this stuff before so if it gets bad avoid public places, even better stay home until its over.

 

The reality of all of this is your basic disaster preps are the best baseline.

[Oh Shoot]

....

I'd be real interested in what they have learned about treating Ebola, other than serum from an Ebola survivor seems to help.  Is it simple supportive care like IV fluids that can make the difference in survival in the US vs Africa, or is it a lot more complicated?  Nurse Pham didn't look too bad on the video they showed the other day.

 

Dehydration and electrolyte/potassium depletion alone kills x number of Ebola victims.  It is the cause of dying from cholera, which we'll see again here if things ever go south enough for widespread sanitation services going down. Cholera fairly easily treated, even at home,  as long as patient can drink, has to be done with IV if they cant.

 

But sure, just IV early on with Ringer's Lactate or similar would allow x number of Ebola victims to survive the disease itself. Any disease with severe diarrhea/vomiting needs same basic treatment in that regard.

 

- OS

Edited October 20, 2014 by Oh Shoot

[peejman]

Dehydration and electrolyte/potassium depletion alone kills x number of Ebola victims.  It is the cause of dying from cholera, which we'll see again here if things ever go south enough for widespread sanitation services going down. Cholera fairly easily treated, even at home,  as long as patient can drink, has to be done with IV if they cant.

 

But sure, just IV early on with Ringer's Lactate or similar would allow x number of Ebola victims to survive the disease itself. Any disease with severe diarrhea/vomiting needs same basic treatment in that regard.

 

- OS

 

 

It's this ^ combined with a lack of other complicating factors and seeking treatment early.  ... same reason people here still die from the flu.  Contrary to what the media likes to present as fact, I think you'd be hard pressed to find many flu deaths that don't include some sort of extenuating circumstances. 

[Dennis1209]

Hey Dolomite, tell us about your well hand pump you installed? I've been wanting to do that myself but heard a hand pump probably would not work for a 90 foot deep well.

 

Fortunately I'm retired too and moved from urban to rural for a number of reasons, a pandemic sure would qualify. A pandemic / pestilence is a historical question of not IF but WHEN. I keep in mind the lag in reporting time, the accuracy of it to prevent panic, and the possible number of infections incubating and not diagnosed before I would consider panic and isolation mode. I have many of the prep's ready to go as described above. I still need to make me a sand / charcoal pre-filter before running it through my Berkley and a few other preps.

 

I can't completely prepare for any disaster but have the basics to at least extend our survival should it occur. I can't afford the one is none and two is one mantra. I'd be running my spider web of cords and running the 5,000 watt generator sparingly 2-4 hours a day to conserve gasoline.

 

I don't particularly like the idea of my bills automatically deducted from my account for several obvious reasons but... Under a quarantine situation you better have a supply of stamps if the mail is still viable. Then again, if your quarantined you don't want to be touching delivered mail, money or the like that others have recently touched.

 

BTW. Did you know those chemical lights have a limited shelf life? I purchased a couple hundred of them some years ago and needed them when my power went off for nine days. I only tried a few dozen but, not one of them would work. What a waste and surprise. I discovered my stash of D cell batteries for my lanterns had also by date expired, fortunately I was able to get some use out of them. Things I found out too late and fortunately it wasn't a national / global emergency. You know, my Berkley is still in the original shipping box. I best take it out, put it together and see if everything is there and it works before I need it. As a matter of fact, I have several items I best check before I really, really NEED them!

[R_Bert]

: some thoughts on isolation and containment

 

Now, the family that lived in the midst of Duncan's puke and bile.....have passed 21 day quarantine and have been released.

 

However, a person treating him (and in anti-C), became infected.

 

Indeed interesting.

Edited October 20, 2014 by R_Bert

[Dolomite_supafly]

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/42752-how-to-home-made-handpump-for-water-all-parts-at-lowes/

 

BTW, they use these types of pumps to pull water from hundreds of feet. Mine is at 45 feet and works great. Just make sure to drill the 1/8" holes down 10" from the top otherwise your pump will freeze up solid in winter.

 

For lighting I use 12v LEDs I bought off of eBay for like $3 each. They are as bright as any incandescent bulb but running off a 12V battery they will run for weeks. I also have a couple of solar panels capable of charging the battery in a day so as long as I have one shiny day a week I have light.

[dawgdoc]

 

 

Now, the family that lived in the midst of Duncan's puke and bile.....have passed 21 day quarantine and have been released.

 

However, a person treating him (and in anti-C), became infected.

 

Indeed interesting.

 

 

The doctor on ABC said that confirms the idea that the patient is spewing less virus particles early on but produces the most virus right before death.  It makes sense that death is preceded by the virus replicating like mad--either because the immune response to all that virus ends up killing you, or the virus is programmed to have a replication spurt as a last gasp, so to speak, before the host dies.  His point seemed to be that all those people on the airplane with the nurse should not have to worry (as much).  The unspoken part was that the healthcare providers, who were already at a greater risk relative to the average person an Ebola patient contacts, have even more to worry about.  If they could peg down the exact life cycle, then they could formulate more rational quarantine and monitoring plans. 

 

Some viruses, such as rabies, are only transmitted the last week of life before an animal dies, whereas others start being shed early on.  Each virus is different.  They talk about Ebola being an inefficient virus in humans because ideally the host should survive and transmit the virus continuously, but Ebola "burns itself out" by killing people before they can transmit the maximum amount of virus.  So the death spiral/last gasp theory sounds like what an inefficient virus would do.

[Jonnin]

I don't know how well isolation will work vs  a really nasty one.   Eventually you will encounter it ....  and if no vaccine, could be in trouble.