Has Harley Davidson made a mistake?

[Dolomite_supafly]

Personally if I were going to tackle the problem if getting off gas it would be this. Run a hydrogen powered generator and the electricity it generated would be used to produce more hydrogen as well as power an electric motor. But the big problem with hydrogen based vehicles is the fact it gives off water unless it is collected. Water being dropped on the road during the summer months presents little problems but when you have thousands of cars depositing water on the roads in the middle of winter I suspect it would turn to ice and create havoc.

[Ugly]

The water problem could be contained and then drained when the lizard is  :rofl:

[Peace]

The water problem could be contained and then drained when the lizard is  :rofl:

 

If it was kept close to potable, then it could be harvested and put in useful circulation!

[kieefer]

I've been riding street for longer than it was legal and driving for nearly as long. I notice bikes and I notice when I don't notice them. When I notice loud pipes, the motorcycle is typically not in any position that it would be advantageous. Between car insulation, the stereo, the inverse-square law, sonic obstructions and being focused on other traffic, the directionality of the sound (typically backwards from the direction the bike is heading), those "loud pipes" are often not all that noticeable anyway. Except to those people outside or in their homes just trying to enjoy a bit of peace and quiet.

 

I've followed the argument for nearly three decades and started out of the opinion myself but the truth is, there's no supporting evidence. The best thing you can do as a motorcyclist is be situationally aware, avoid blind spots, wear a helmet and gear and don't ride out to a bar and load up on beer.

 

As to the "just an excuse", I'm sure that's true for some but there are many, I'm sure, who are simply sincerely wrong.

 

Now, it's a nice day. Time to do some riding... :)

Might add that extra lighting is also more helpful on bikes and as mentioned, ride defensively.

[Ugly]

If it was kept close to potable, then it could be harvested and put in useful circulation!

Good point, there could be roadside collection systems especially useful at rest stops

[No_0ne]

Pretty sure that was what was said when the first internal combustion engine came to market. How could anyone put a liquid in every city to power cars but they did. Before the internal combustion engine almost all vehicles were some sort of electric but at the time it was easier to run a liquid fuel. The idea of providing electricity for an electric vehicle is much easier, and cheaper, option than some sort of liquid fuel.

 

Except that both gasoline (along with illuminating gas) and electric powered automobiles were invented almost simultaneously in the 1880's, at least those with practical applications.  It's true that up through approximately 1900 electrics outnumbered gasoline engined autos, but both were eclipsed by the total number of steam powered vehicles then in existence.  Production of electric autos peaked in 1910, but had already been passed by the number of gas-powered autos being produced.  It's true that prior to about 1915 or so that electric vehicles were cheaper to operate than gas, but their initial cost was double that of a similar gasoline car, with far more limited range and speed.  Availability of electricity was better in cities than gasoline, but in many rural areas electricity wasn't available for recharging.  Illuminating gas, and gasoline, while relatively expensive could be had most anywhere in the US by the latter years of the 19th century, long before rural electrification was in it's infancy.  The invention of the electric starter in 1912 also helped doom the early electrics, as it removed one of the true disadvantages of gasoline engines versus electrics.  Limited range, expense of production, along with the weight of the batteries were all reasons why Thomas Edison eventually abandoned his efforts to build electrics, once declaring that Henry Ford "had it right" with his mass-produced gasoline powered cars (Clara Ford's personal car during the early years of the 20th century was a Detroit Electric!).  These same problems still exist, although recent technological breakthroughs like graphene do hold some promise towards eventually making electrics more practical.  The analogy of building a charging infrastructure to handle increased usage of modern electrics doesn't quite hold with that of building the gasoline distribution network that arose during the early 20th century, as there was no nationwide infrastructure which was already in place for any type of fueling for automobiles; today any new distribution network which could handle quick charging of high capacity batteries would come into direct competition with the petroleum industry.  There have been many previous attempts to replace the gasoline powered internal combustion engined automobile, none have had much success.  While there are probably many reasons for this, one of them is certainly that no competitive technology has been able to provide the convenience, power, reliability and relatively low cost of the 130 year old gasoline auto engine.

[No_0ne]

Personally if I were going to tackle the problem if getting off gas it would be this. Run a hydrogen powered generator and the electricity it generated would be used to produce more hydrogen as well as power an electric motor. But the big problem with hydrogen based vehicles is the fact it gives off water unless it is collected. Water being dropped on the road during the summer months presents little problems but when you have thousands of cars depositing water on the roads in the middle of winter I suspect it would turn to ice and create havoc.

 

This sounds a lot like a "perpetual motion" system to me ...

[Chucktshoes]

[quote name="No_0ne" post="1161570" timestamp="1403475116"]This sounds a lot like a "perpetual motion" system to me ...[/quote] Somebody paid attention in science class.

[Good_Steward]

Good point, there could be roadside collection systems especially useful at rest stops

I have made many a roadside a water collection system when traveling cross country on various bikes...,,,and cars, for that matter.

[peejman]

It's all about the infrastructure. Cars became big in a time when businesses and the government were willing to invest in the infrastructure necessary to realize their goals. Today, we can't even be bothered to repair our crumbling infrastructure, much less invest in something completely different. The payback period is longer than our attention span and the technology is changing much too fast.

I've said this a bunch of times previously.... Saving the world won't be popular until it's profitable.

[No_0ne]

Somebody paid attention in science class.

 

And even taught a few ... :)

[tnguy]

Burning hydrocarbons produces water also. Not really an issue.

[tnguy]

There have been many previous attempts to replace the gasoline powered internal combustion engined automobile, none have had much success.  While there are probably many reasons for this, one of them is certainly that no competitive technology has been able to provide the convenience, power, reliability and relatively low cost of the 130 year old gasoline auto engine.

 

True. But with modern materials and manufacturing methods, we are getting an awful lot closer. We're not there yet though which is why I think government should stay out of it and not be picking winners.

[Ugly]

http://www.agingrebel.com/10309

 

Came across this opinion article, thought it interesting 

[DaveTN]

http://www.agingrebel.com/10309
 
Came across this opinion article, thought it interesting

Since I haven’t priced ricers in many years I just cruised through the Honda, Kawasaki and Yamaha websites. If you look only at heavy cruisers and baggers that are in the same size class as a Harley I don’t see a lot of difference in price. That article says Harley is doomed because the upcoming riders won’t be able to buy a Harley. If that is true (and I have long said our kids won’t have the money for toys we had) then it will be true for all other manufacturers. It’s a product for those that can afford a $15K-$25K toy; the name on the sales contract won’t matter if they can afford the bottom line or not.

What I saw on those websites was a bunch of bikes trying to look like a Harley. The one exception I saw was the Honda Goldwing; it’s not trying to copy the Harley look.

I find it amusing that so many people see an addition at Harley as a sign they are in trouble. That’s no more than wishful thinking on their part. Harley Davidson is an American icon and for that reason alone many want to see them fail.

http://blog.motorcycle.com/2014/04/22/manufacturers/harley-davidson/top-selling-motorcycles-us-2013-harley-davidson-street-glide-special-breakout/

http://www.sturgismotorcyclerally.com/news/read-more-news/the-worlds-best-selling-motorcycle-company-is
 

Honda's supremacy in the Asian market awards this motorcycle giant the title of World's Best Selling Motorcycle. But, other competitors aren't too far behind. Take Harley-Davidson for example. Harley-Davidson's focus on American markets has shifted and sales are growing in Latin America now. They will likely continue to grow their international brand over the next few years.

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