Prepper gone bad

[Hershmeister]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes http://www.wtsp.com/story/news/crime/2014/06/16/manhunt-underway-for-valrico-prepper/10613673/ Search warrant: http://archive.wtsp.com/assetpool/documents/140616053710_WintersSearchWarrant.pdf

[173rdABN]

Thats what happens when you make what you have known to the public.

[JAB]

The article said they feds were carrying out shovels and weapons - no mention of having found the explosive devices that supposedly justified the search.  Will have to wait for more details but this is sounding a lot like a fishing expedition.  Sure, the guy ran but he obviously doesn't trust the government and he might have run for that simple reason.  That doesn't automatically mean he was doing anything illegal.

[Ted S.]

This is really odd. For a biblical end times prepper, the warrant suggests he is beyond hell bend on killing only government agents...

Edited June 17, 2014 by Ted S.

[Ugly]

Seems like an expedition to me too!

See something, say something.

[Someotherguy]

But but...He had food buried!!

 

ridiclulous.... :shake:

 

http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/hillsborough-regional-news/fbi-searching-for-valrico-man-wanted-on-federal-charges

[Dennis1209]

Here fishy fishy fishy...

[Ted S.]

Anyone else read the Warrant? The warrant suggests he made desructive devices and boobie traps. Also did straw purchases on a lot of guns.

Edited June 17, 2014 by Ted S.

[Hershmeister]

Search warrant outlined straw purchasing, felon owning guns and illegal DD's

[Chucktshoes]

I wish him success in his future endeavors.

[Ted S.]

I wish him success in his future endeavors.

 

No comment...

 

:stalk:

[Hershmeister]

[quote name="Chucktshoes" post="1159882" timestamp="1403037243"]I wish him success in his future endeavors.[/quote] Which ones? License Plate Production Personnel Rock Reduction Specialist Guest star role in "Orange is the new Black" Or the perennial favorite, Bunkmate

[RobertNashville]

Anyone else read the Warrant? The warrant suggests he made desructive devices and boobie traps. Also did straw purchases on a lot of guns.

A warrant can suggest a lot of things and this days I don't tend to  put much stock in accusations.

 

It would seem to me that if they had any significant evidence against him they could have arrested him and then searched to their heart's content; this sounds like a fishing expedition to me based on what I know at this point.
 

[Ted S.]

A warrant can suggest a lot of things and this days I don't tend to  put much stock in accusations.

 

It would seem to me that if they had any significant evidence against him they could have arrested him and then searched to their heart's content; this sounds like a fishing expedition to me based on what I know at this point.
 

 

I agree, and think that warrants are bogus, but the article itself gives very little situational information, and the warrant is very detailed.

 

I won't justify the actions of any government agent as moral. They have the legal right to act on evidence they say they have under oath, and the constitution gives them the right to do so as long as it is in accordance of the Fourth Amendment. If they violate anything, it is something that would be settled in court. Of course, that is assuming that the system works...

 

I don't believe that laws are valid in general. I think this guy should have been left alone. Who cares if he did have someone else buy a bunch of guns for him? Who cares if he did manufacture destructive devices? Why should anyone care? If they aren't bothering other people or infringing upon someone else's immediate right to life or freedom, no one should care. It's their business unless they bring someone else into it involuntarily, but there are over 300,000,000 Americans and the Best Government that money can buy in place to disagree with me.

[Wheelgunner]

Sure is scary knowing that there's a guy on the loose who stores food, owns firearms, and doesn't like O.  

 

And did you see how many bombs the feds carried out of his house?!  ...oh, wait

[Someotherguy]

Well, he apparently turned himself in today...

 

 

http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/hillsborough-regional-news/fbi-valrico-doomsday-prepper-martin-winters-captured

[BigK]

I'm sure in the end, evidence of some kind of wrong doing will be presented. Perhaps he has a garden and they'll find some fertilizer or maybe he has a slow drain and they'll find some Drano or maybe he reloads and they'll find some Bullseye. Any will be listed in their report as bomb-making implements of mass doom and destruction to justify pi$$ing on his Constitutional rights.

 

On the other hand, they may find something legit, who knows. Just sounds like a BS fishing expedition to me too. Any of us could be victim to this kind of crap. All it would take is one a$$hat anti to turn you in saying they "think" you have illegal weapons or bombs, etc. In they end, we may be exhonnerated, but the inconvenience and cost would still be up to us to bear.

Edited June 18, 2014 by BigK

[Hershmeister]

[quote name="Someotherguy" post="1160225" timestamp="1403126496"]Well, he apparently turned himself in today... [url="http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/hillsborough-regional-news/fbi-valrico-doomsday-prepper-martin-winters-captured"]http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/hillsborough-regional-news/fbi-valrico-doomsday-prepper-martin-winters-captured[/url][/quote] He's been promoted to "doomsday prepper" status

[Chucktshoes]

Looks like the feds found bupkis. I'm just happy he didn't exercise the right to defend himself and his property against this act of aggression.

 

http://www.wtsp.com/story/news/local/hillsboroughcounty/2014/06/19/valrico-agents-fbi-explosives-guns-weapons-search-prepper-doomsday-winters-daughters-glasser-wtsp/10904077/

 

 

Valrico, Florida -- When federal agents raided Martin Winters' home in Valrico this week, they were also armed with a warrant they obtained with information from an undercover informant.

According to the indictment, agents were looking for as many as 50 high-powered AR-15 rifles and several explosive devices buried around Winters' properties.

But after several hours, agents apparently found far less than what they were led to believe they would.

When Special Agent Dave Couvertier, the FBI's spokesman, was asked what they had discovered, he declined comment.

--------

"And it's my understanding that no guns were dug up," Faught said after the hearing. "It was alleged by the government that there were 50 to 60 guns and I'm only aware of five of them that were found and they were found in his house in a safe."

[Someotherguy]

Awesome work FBI...you really got him now...All that buried food should get him at least 30 years in the penn :rofl:

[Guest theconstitutionrocks]

ok...so make sure I'm tracking...they said if he just complied with the search warrant all this could have been avoided...soooo, they are accusing him of building explosive devices but they didn't find any? And now, because he "ran" he's now a fugitive and breaking the law. And all that dangerous food, and animal husbandry.

 

The message seems pretty clear...if we want to investigate you, you had better comply, or we will then "legally" make you a criminal. And people wonder why folks are getting pissed off.

[vontar]

http://www.wtsp.com/story/news/local/hillsboroughcounty/2014/06/19/valrico-agents-fbi-explosives-guns-weapons-search-prepper-doomsday-winters-daughters-glasser-wtsp/10904077/

 

And it's my understanding that no guns were dug up," Faught said after the hearing. "It was alleged by the government that there were 50 to 60 guns and I'm only aware of five of them that were found and they were found in his house in a safe."

 

 

hmmm

[RobertNashville]

ok...so make sure I'm tracking...they said if he just complied with the search warrant all this could have been avoided...soooo, they are accusing him of building explosive devices but they didn't find any? And now, because he "ran" he's now a fugitive and breaking the law. And all that dangerous food, and animal husbandry.

 

The message seems pretty clear...if we want to investigate you, you had better comply, or we will then "legally" make you a criminal. And people wonder why folks are getting pissed off.

I can understand this fellow's urge to flee...to not want his property searched...to be afraid of the government LEOs but ff there was nothing improper about the search warrant then he should have complied and then settled the matter in court.  If there WAS something improper about the search warrant then he still should have complied and then settled the matter in court. In short; these kinds of things aren't settled "in the street' or standing at the front door of your house or by running.

 

The Constitution protects us from unreasonable searches, not all searches but it's a judge who decides whether the search was or wasn't reasonable (note I used past tense). Once you run, it's a whole different matter.

 

Think of it this way, if this guy really was building bombs and maybe thinking of starting his own little revolution against the government; wouldn't we want the FBI/law enforcement to search his property and maybe stop him before he did anything?

[Grayfox54]

The guy is a prepper, anti-governement, anti-obama, very vocal and posting on the internet about it. Any of these things are perfectly legal BUT, it will get you on .govs radar. Once you've been noticed, its only a matter of time before they come knockin'. This guy has already been found guilty no matter if he did anything illegal or not.. 

[Chucktshoes]

Personally, I think he was very smart to slip away and turn himself in after the fact. Considering the subject of the warrant and what they were looking for, I doubt very seriously it started with a polite knock on the door followed by a "sir, can you come out? This is the FBI and we have a warrant to search your property if you would be so kind to open the door." No, they went in with the SWAT team on a dynamic entry. Considering the high mortality rates of the subjects of these types of raids by the murderers in the FBI, I'm not sticking around to get murdered in my own home. At least not if I am planning to live through the encounter. I'll slip away and turn myself in later when it can be done peacefully, and publicly. If I'm sticking around for the initial event it's because I'm not planning on seeing the next sunrise. Edited June 23, 2014 by Chucktshoes