1911 Slamfire Help

[Dolomite_supafly]

No need to even take the slide off. You can clear the gun and lock it back then remove the firing pin stop. You might have to press on the firing pin safety but I cannot remember exactly.

[TNMTBik3r]

OK the spring IS shorter than the entire pin. I guess I meant the spring stuck out past the pin nose.

Again sorry about the link, if I get to my computer sometime tonight I will embed the pics. Mobile devices even viewing the full version are missing many post options.  Booted up the computer and fixing the pics.


Also, I have to push the pin past flush with the firing pin stop for any protrusion of the pin.

Edited June 3, 2014 by jonathon1289

[TNMTBik3r]

I don't think this has the firing pin block (series 80). I can push the firing pin forward with or without the grip/thumb safety engaged.
The manual states there is a firing pin lock that prevents movement of the pin until the trigger is intentionally pressed. Well I can move the pin regardless...is this correct or am I taking the manual too literally?

ETA - disregard the above. The manual is for the GI Expert series. Mine is just the Expert, model 96747. Edited June 3, 2014 by jonathon1289

[Dolomite_supafly]

It sounds like a 70 series. If there is not a button on the bottom of the slide then it is a 70 series. If there is a button, like you see on Glocks, then it is a 80 series.

 

It is normal for the firing pin to fall past the firing pin retainer before it protrudes.

 

The ONLY thing I can see happening is the firing pin hitting the primer and igniting which is extremely unlikely without falling. The other could be a proud primer like you said.

 

If the hammer is not falling then I would try a few other brands of ammo and if it doesn't happen again then I would say it was the ammo. If it does happen again with a different brand I would buy a Ed Brown firing pin and it will come with a new firing pin spring. That should prevent the firing pin from igniting a round.

[TNMTBik3r]

Now I am just getting confused...the manual is for the GI Expert which is no longer listed on the Para website - the Expert Stainless is listed but does not say if it has the firing pin block or if it is series 70/80, and no updated manual on the website that I see.

 

The slide has the button, but it is recessed and not a push-able button like on other pistols...and looking at series 80 pics on Google the button should be push-able with a finger. This one does not budge even with a punch - so is it a series 80 and the block is somehow stuck? Even if I remove the firing pin the button does not move.

 

Going back to ammo, I had put 50 rounds of PMC Bronze factory though, then about 400 reloads, and the 2 slam fires were the first 2 rounds of a 2nd box of PMC Bronze (51/52 factory ammo). The gunsmith could not get the hammer to fall after those 2 slam fires, and I have not been able to get the hammer to fall either. 

I am just trying to avoid a dangerous situation and fix a problem if one exists. I have shot several 1911s before, but this is the first one I have owned and I have/had a lot to learn about the platform.

[TNMTBik3r]

Ok, found a post online that says this is a series 80 and that the plunger is stuck. Pulling back on the extractor should release it - however in my case that is not happening and I cannot get the extractor to release and come out of the slide. Looks like we may be close to figuring this out.

[Joe357]

If it is a series 80, which I think it is there should be a lever on the frame that comes up when you pull the trigger as well as the plunger on the slide. The plunger is spring held to push it out.

[Wiljo05]

Ok, found a post online that says this is a series 80 and that the plunger is stuck. Pulling back on the extractor should release it - however in my case that is not happening and I cannot get the extractor to release and come out of the slide. Looks like we may be close to figuring this out.

Right wrong or indifferent the trick I use to together the extractor out is this:
Remove the firing pin retainer, spring, and firing pin.
Tap the ejector from the breech face to make it protrude out the back of the slide just a bit.
Use pliers that have the jaws taped to grab the extractor, turn it 90 degrees and pull.

I used this to ensure the tooth of the extractor clears the breech face. Makes it much easier for me.

Note: this is on my 9mm 1911's, and would assume but unsure that the extractors are similar in shape(although I believe the 9mm protrudes a little more onto the breech face)

[TNMTBik3r]

If it is a series 80, which I think it is there should be a lever on the frame that comes up when you pull the trigger as well as the plunger on the slide. The plunger is spring held to push it out.

 

Yep, I am slowly figuring this out. The plunger is stuck in the up (depressed) position, and moving the extractor around is not releasing it. Just read a couple of other posts online, am going to try and soak some break free or similar into the firing pin channel and plunger. If that doesn't work I am thinking I will contact Para and send it in for warranty repair, let them check everything.

[Dolomite_supafly]

Yeah. Looks like the plunger spring is missing. Someone probably took the slide apart and didn't realize there should be a spring there. Moving the firing pin in and out should release the plunger. It is possible firing pin spring pressure is holding if down.

I am somewhat familiar but not intimately with 80 series guns. I am thinking maybe the firing pin was forward and the plunger locked it forward for a couple of rounds.

What you need to do is order the plunger spring for a series 80 1911.

As far as how to get the infer to move I would start by removing the firing pin. That does lock the plunger in place if my memory serves me right. I think I had to slowly release the firing pin and the plunger dropped free. Not sure if it will if the spring is missing.

If you want I can PM my number and I can try to talk you through it.

[Joe357]

Also, just an FYI, you should not use the slide stop as a slide release, it is putting undo wear on it. Just pull the slide back a little and let it go to release the slide.

[TNMTBik3r]

The firing pin is out, it falls right out, so the plunger is not affecting it.

 

Dolomite, I think you may be on the right track with someone took the slide apart and lost the spring (or maybe it is just jammed in there). I bought this new at a local shop with a good reputation but who knows what they checked/did. Yesterday/today is as detailed as I have ever gone with a 1911, certainly a good learning experience.

 

It is a sweet shooting pistol (for the little time I have had it), but think my best bet may be to use the warranty and get it fully checked out. Hopefully any changes/repairs do not negatively affect it...

Edited June 4, 2014 by jonathon1289

[Joe357]

The reason the plunger isn't affecting it is because it is in the up position which releases the firing pin. Try putting a thin punch in the firing pin hole and see if you can push the plunger out or try hitting the slide a few times in your hand to release it.

[TNMTBik3r]

The reason the plunger isn't affecting it is because it is in the up position which releases the firing pin. Try putting a thin punch in the firing pin hole and see if you can push the plunger out or try hitting the slide a few times in your hand to release it.

Tried that with no luck. I am going to soak it for a bit and then try to knock it free tomorrow night. If that fails I will call Para on Thursday.

Thanks to everyone who has participated and helped get to this point in finding/resolving the issue!

[Dolomite_supafly]

Try hitting the bottom of the slide against something hard. Not hard enough to damage it. If you have a rubber mallet you can hit the bottom of the slide.

Another option is to stick it in the oven at the lowest setting, the heat might help loosen it. Edited June 4, 2014 by Dolomite_supafly

[van37725]

OK, check if the firing pin sticks in the foreward position. This is an 80's series pistol, it has a firing pin block, unless the trigger is in the rearward position the firing pin is blocked. Check the free travel of the firing pin through the firing pin stop, check if the firing pin stop is overly loose and may have dropped down trapping the firing pin in the foreward position,. there are many reasons for this malfunction, all minor. First call Para and tell them what's going on, the pistol is under warranty!

Van

[TNMTBik3r]

Trying to free the plunger with a cleaner, dental pick, small screwdriver, and smacking the bottom have not worked. It is jammed and I cannot pry it free.

 

I am assuming this stuck firing pin block is the root cause of the slam fires - the firing pin moves freely with the plunger stuck so the pin could have moved and struck the primer on the 2 rounds. May have been a combination of a high primer or something else, but regardless this stuck plunger is a problem that needs fixed.

 

I am calling Para in the morning to setup the return and get this fully checked out and repaired under warranty. Again, thanks to everyone who assisted in this thread. I will update with details on what Para says when the warranty work is processed and the pistol returned.

[TNMTBik3r]

Pistol arrived back from Para today. Work order says they installed the safety plunger - thought it would be repaired/replaced, may just be the wording but makes me wonder if something wasn't done right from the factory or the LGS was messing with stuff.
Work order also says they replaced the barrel (WTF!?), adjusted the frame, trigger, extractor.
Can't wait to get out and shoot it now.

[van37725]

Your Para is an 80 series pistol, it has a firing pin block that cannot be bipassed unless the trigger is in the rearward position. When reassembling it, could you have left the firing pin in the foreward position after inserting the firing pin stop? Also, some of the Para's had a tendency to have the firing pin stick in the foreward position if fired on an empty chamber. Take the slide off, depress the firing pin safety, push the firing pin all the way in, release the firing pin. If it didn't stick you're good to go on that issue.

Van

[van37725]

Sorry didn't read all of the thread.

Van