Stranger on Property

[Erik88]

The one thing that hasn't been suggested yet would be to ask your wife, "If something like this happens again and the person is acting suspicious, what are you going to do if I'm not here?"

 

It's her job to protect the kids too. When I have posed similar questions to some of my women friends, I just get a deer-in-the-headlights stare. The world is a dangerous place. Ignoring that fact is comforting right up until it bites you.

 

You need to get her to think about security and help her come up with the best options for various situations... handgun, pepper spray on the keychain, cell phone on her person when in the yard, neighbor's number on speed dial, whatever works for her. 

 

Exactly this. Putting up signs(do you really think that's going to do anything, think about no guns allowed signs) and cameras won't do squat. 

 

You wife needs to consider what she would have done had this person actually been a threat. 

[gregintenn]

Do what a neighbor did when I was younger. Fence your yard (overkill). He didnt like me cutting thru the outskirts of his property for me to get home. I LIVED right behind this asshole. I got my revenge later when his grandkids? came to use our slop after it had snowed. Told them to vacate the premises or I would call the police for trespassing. He looked at me and I gave them the most well deserved bird. 

 

 

Everyone has good neighbors. It's always the ####ty ones that stand out.

I don't know what a "slop" is, but I believe the best way to have good neighbors is to make an effort to be one.

[wileecoyote]

[quote name="Erik88" post="1129479" timestamp="1395711794"]Exactly this. Putting up signs(do you really think that's going to do anything, think about no guns allowed signs) and cameras won't do squat. You wife needs to consider what she would have done had this person actually been a threat. [/quote] Great advice on preparing the wife and family members. Signs do make everyone aware of your property lines (including you) if the boundaries are not fenced or otherwise obvious, plus they send a message that you don't want casual visitors dropping by, and they make it a lot easier for you to prosecute if someone trespasses or causes other problems. Video cameras can be a great deterrent if they are visible, especially to the novice criminals or those looking for an easy score (the vast majority). They are also great for allowing you to keep an eye on things when you can't be there in person, and they can alert you proactively before anything bad has a chance to occur. And should a break in, violent crime, or other serious situation occur, you will have invaluable evidence to catch and incarcerate the bastards. You won't appreciate the value of these until you have them, and if something bad goes down without video then you'd give anything to go back in time to change your mind. In fact it wasn't long ago that I had someone break into my reloading shack and go through my supplies including various explosive compounds and other valuable items, but the security measures allowed me to catch and deal with that clown promptly. Here is a short video snippet from the surveillance setup: http://tinyurl.com/m3evx5

[sigmtnman]

lol. nice one.

[Peace]

The one thing that hasn't been suggested yet would be to ask your wife, "If something like this happens again and the person is acting suspicious, what are you going to do if I'm not here?"

 

It's her job to protect the kids too. When I have posed similar questions to some of my women friends, I just get a deer-in-the-headlights stare. The world is a dangerous place. Ignoring that fact is comforting right up until it bites you.

 

You need to get her to think about security and help her come up with the best options for various situations... handgun, pepper spray on the keychain, cell phone on her person when in the yard, neighbor's number on speed dial, whatever works for her. 

Grrreat question.  We talked through that when this happened.  She is pretty good about situational awareness - which, admittedly, was down on Sunday.  She also knows that securing the kids and a safe retreat are her only duties.  She was a D1 college athlete, and if anybody ever makes contact with her, I feel sorry for them.  

[Luke E.]

Not black, no pistol grip. Pass. :up:

 

 What about a bayonet lug? don't forget the nasty demonic bayonet lug.

[Rowdy]

Just be aware that if you don't have signs up a person isn't trespassing until you tell them to leave and they don't. So the moral of the story is: put the signs up today.

[Peace]

Just be aware that if you don't have signs up a person isn't trespassing until you tell them to leave and they don't. So the moral of the story is: put the signs up today.

exactly why I put signs up.

[TMF]

[quote name="gregintenn" post="1129325" timestamp="1395693525"]I didn't intend to be derogatory, and you have no need to justify nor debate it with me. I will say that I'm glad I'm not in your position that makes you feel the need for all the stuff you posted. I hope your situation improves quickly. I would be looking for a way out of whatever predicament you've found yourself in.[/quote] Dude, a person isn't nuts or irrational for taking precautions to keep their wife and kids safe. I have a neighbor who has made threats toward my wife and was charged on a related crime. I've had to take active and passive measures to prevent his contact with my family. Some may think those measures are paranoid, but dammit, folks have wives and kids to worry about. The measures I've taken have made us comfortable enough that we haven't up and moved our home, which is something a free American shouldn't have to do. So I get the impression that you're mocking this guy for having so many measures in place. I'm glad that you don't have to deal with that type of nonsense, but the truth is there are crappy people out there whether or not you pine for the days of Mayberry. Being a good neighbor doesn't make crappy neighbors or bums suddenly safe for your wife and kids to be around. That is just naive. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[glowdotGlock]

A little off the wall but if the creek is close to your house you could put a wireless driveway motion detector across it. If you believe that the creek may be were someone would walk up from. It gives you a narrower point rather than having someone just walking into a field. Put it just high enough where if a human walked by and disturbed the "line" across the creek you would know it in the house and go confront the trespasser. Kinda odd I know but just throwing it out there. Edited March 25, 2014 by glowdotGlock

[Bassoneer]

As for protective watch dogs, we have two Doberman Pinschers and they are great.  They play with each other (pretty rowdy) and they are big babies with us.  But if anybody goes down the street (or Heaven forbid, come to the door) they go crazy barking.  They just have a very protective instinct.  And they sort of feed off each other...if one starts barking the other one goes off also.  We also have two Chihuahuas and they jump in the mix also (they are the ones who are most likely to bite :)).  

 

Also, I agree with posting the no trespassing signs...Best wishes, B

Edited March 25, 2014 by Bassoneer

[leroy]

Peace.... I understand the concern for wife and kids due to a "stanger" walkin up on the family... I also understand the concerns of others who have bad neighbors and bad situations... All that bein said; i tend to take the "watch and be ready" approach... I think the precautions ya need to take are related to where you are (...what's the neighborhood, urban or rural...), who are the people (...transients or neighbors...), and what the "protectors" (...your wife...) are willing to do to defend things if something terrible (...God forbid...) should happen...

 

My personal approach is the "...friendly but watchful..." approach; but im at home most all the time... If i see a new face, i make a point to visit a bit and find out who folks are... That sends a couple of messages; the most important of which is that "...im watchin...", and "...im studyin your face and features...".   Those who are petty thieves dont like that... I doubt that does much for "...stone cold killas..."; but, again, nothin does but gunpowder and lead (...which i always keep handy...)...  

 

The sad truth is that we live in dangerous times; and everybody is edgy; so that complicates our dealings with others...   The truth of the matter is that if you are absent from the home; the only protection that can be provided has to be provided by the wife or other able bodied adult or young person... If they choose to be armed, that's a great thing and the best thing possible in my estimation... If they dont, God alone, is the only protection... I hate to say it that way; but it's the genuine truth... The truth is that i would never leave kids playing outside my direct line of sight and i would never not be armed; but that's just me... The only thing that "technology" can do for ya, is to let ya know when someone is commin.... If he (...she or it....) is the Grim Reaper, ya better be ready for what's next; and that's what the adults or other older kids watchin the little kids need to prepare for...

 

I know that we all want to do what we can to protect our loved ones and that's what we are supposed to do as responsible adults; but the truth is that if ya aint there, it has to be done by "others"... To my way of thinkin, the best "others" are two big dogs, the "armed and ready to shoot" wife or older sibling, or other family members (...your mean father-in-law or dear ole dad comes to mind if they are able or still around...)...

 

Like several here have opined; this is probably a "nothin but chance meeting", and, as such; should be considered just that... I tend to be a bit suspicious, so im always watchful...

 

I'll close this little essay by way of sayin by remindin everybody that "...you are the only being that can really protect you..."... I would advise calm, quite, watchful, reasoned responses to all these little encounters... It's kinda like baby bear's porrage; "...not too cold, not too hot, just right..."... That way, no body gets hurt and everything stays reasonable...

 

Signs, fences, and surveillance tools are just that, they are tools; they do nothing to deter anyone who is bent on doin ya harm... Only determination not to be a victim and the ability to burn powder stops the harm once the mayhem is decided on...

 

Here's joinin you and others in the the hope (...and fervent prayer...) that this is a simple chance encounter by a harmless wayfaring pilgrim...

 

watchin leroy

[gregintenn]

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Edited March 25, 2014 by gregintenn

[Guest Ol BW]

I have not read through the entire 10 pages of replies so excuse me if this has been said before. Obviously the guy knew he was in the wrong and knew he was up to no good by the way you described his hasty retreat. He could have ment no immediate harm but checking things out for future pillage by himself or associate. Here (Rural NWTN) things you have to watch for besides poachers and joyriders are the meth cookers/dope growers, the staked out burglar, and the abductor/rapist. From what I understand, if many of you don't know you need to realize that you are responsible for what happens on your property wether you do it or someone else does. When they find a meth lab or a bunch of pot growing you can bet the landowner will be held responsible until proven otherwise. Someone break their leg on your property? Guess who is liable? Kid rides a four-wheeler across your property and runs into that new fence you are putting up and gets killed? Try and wade through that situation. Prove that you weren't setting up a booby trap cause you knew he came thru there and you had a "confrontation" with him previously about crossing there. (Probably cause you knew you were putting up a fence there...PROVE IT!) We lost poor Holly Bobo to a person that came thru the woods into her back yard and took her. Like most of y'all, I know my neighbors and they all know better! Maybe that's the difference in having row-crops. Neighbors don't step on neighbors crops. I trespassed once as a kid and Daddy told me that was a good way to get shot. That was all I needed to hear! BW

[TMF]

[quote name="Ol BW" post="1129753" timestamp="1395772975"]We lost poor Holly Bobo to a person that came thru the woods into her back yard and took her.[/quote] Clearly that was because she wasnt being a good neighbor. If she'd just smiled and waved at every seedy character she came across then they never would have had the inclination to do her harm. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Guest Ol BW]

Actually it was the other way around. They just charged a guy with her abduction and murder. Apparently he had approached her at a talent show, would not leave her alone and her family had to run him off. He got close to her in her yard because she was being nice. BW

[Dennis1209]

Generally speaking, water sheds and creeks are not privately owned and even have easements. Normally they are public property and regulated / controlled by the state but not sure about Tennessee.

[gregintenn]

Generally speaking, water sheds and creeks are not privately owned and even have easements. Normally they are public property and regulated / controlled by the state but not sure about Tennessee.

I believe that only applies to navigable waters and things such as Corps of Engineers property here in Tennessee.

[UncleJak]

[quote name="gregintenn" post="1129803" timestamp="1395780250"]I believe that only applies to navigable waters and things such as Corps of Engineers property here in Tennessee.[/quote]I think it encompasses more than that. My interpretation is that any water that flows through. No ponds, lakes, or ends of creeks....but anything else. That's just how I saw it....I may be way off base. Sent barefoot from the hills of Tennessee

[Peace]

I think it encompasses more than that. My interpretation is that any water that flows through. No ponds, lakes, or ends of creeks....but anything else. That's just how I saw it....I may be way off base. Sent barefoot from the hills of Tennessee

 

In TN, the water has to be navigable for the public to have right-of-use.  I would elaborate, but it is better compiled by others...

 

http://www.americanwhitewater.org/content/Wiki/access:tn

 

Now, the Attorney General and I have differing opinions on the property rights of a stream/stream bed being indeterminate until a jury has ruled one way or the other.... with that said, here is the AG's take from 2011.

 

http://www.tn.gov/attorneygeneral/op/2011/op11-75.pdf

 

The afformentioned creek in this thread would not be legally or normally navigable by anything but a child's toy boat ...and then only during a flash flood.  

[leroy]

All:   Check this out... See below....

 

Extent of Public Rights in Navigable and Non-Navigable Rivers

Navigable streams cannot be owned privately. Navigable streams natural and primary uses by the public are for navigation, commerce, hunting and fishing.16) In addition to the right of navigation of streams, the public has the right of ownership of lands under the waters, as these lands cannot be owned privately.17) The riparian owners of land on a stream that is navigable in the technical sense have title to the ordinary low watermark only, and not to the center of the stream. If a stream is only navigable in the ordinary sense, “the ownership of the bed of the stream is in the riparian proprietors, and the public have an easement therein for purposes of transportation and commercial intercourse.”18) If a stream is so “shallow as to be unfit for transportation and commerce,” and is not navigable in even the ordinary sense, the rights to the property and use of the stream are “wholly and absolutely in the owners of the adjoining land.”19)

 

I lifted it from here:  http://www.waldensridgewhitewater.com/accessrights.htm

 

Notice the bold italic underlined portion....

 

leroy

[Guest Ol BW]

There are watershed projects that are on private property and as such have private access. The easement portion comes into question when you're talking about building on or near the watershed within the borders of the easement. Part of the agreement is that you will not build or otherwise change anything within the easement that would change the design of the watershed. I used to work for USDA-NRCS intermittently and inspected the building of such watersheds. There was one person who had built a house in the easement portion and it was moved on their dime. The public cannot access such watersheds without permission from the landowner, or if an agreement has been reached between TN, the landowner and USDA. There are public watersheds in TN such as Gibson Lake, Carroll Lake, Indian Creek/Reelfoot Watershed system in Obion Co., Lake Graham, Garret Lake, and I imagine most of the TWRA fishing lakes listed in the fishing regulations are built this way. BW Edited March 25, 2014 by Ol BW

[gregintenn]

I think it encompasses more than that. My interpretation is that any water that flows through. No ponds, lakes, or ends of creeks....but anything else. That's just how I saw it....I may be way off base. Sent barefoot from the hills of Tennessee

You are correct in that the water that flows through is deemed to be "waters of the state". That doesn't mean one has permission to walk the private property on which it flows.

[UncleJak]

[quote name="gregintenn" post="1129841" timestamp="1395784625"]You are correct in that the water that flows through is deemed to be "waters of the state". That doesn't mean one has permission to walk the private property on which it flows.[/quote] I agree. Sent barefoot from the hills of Tennessee

[Clod Stomper]

Thanks folks, I needed a good laugh this morning.  :)

 

 

To the OP... I'd do exactly what you did, put up some signs and maybe get a game camera just to see what's really going on.  I'd see what's on the camera before installing razor wire, high voltage fencing, and landmines.  I'd also figure out a way to get the dog down there when she's alone with the kids. If your wife doesn't have her HCP already, this might provide a little motivation for her to get it.

 

 

If she's on private property, she doesn't need one.  Just make sure she knows how to use it safely and effectively.

 

And yes, take the dog.

 

Will

Edited March 26, 2014 by Clod Stomper