Justifiable need

[Guest Cazador]

In the states like New Jersey where a person wanting ccw has to prove a justifiable need most are denied. I wonder how many people just give up after the local law denies them. I think that those business people that have applied due to transporting large sums of money should start calling their local law enforcement for an escort while transporting money. If they start putting the pressure on them to serve and protect after a while they may start to cave in.

[Tulsajohn]

I live here in NJ, it's been a huge discussion for the last few years. A lot of people do not even try because they know they will be denied. Then every time (forever) you apply for more handgun permit you have to check that you were denied in the past. A lot of people are hopefully that something will change soon. It's kind of stupid being that most of the nj gun owners that want to carry have non resident permits from other states like Florida , Utah and Connecticut. So Other states like Tennessee think were good to carry there, but not our home state we reside in. Go figure

[Dustbuster]

NJ is a communist state always will be cause the voters allowed it to get that way. I have family that moved there for work. They would have been better off training afghanis to be cops. At least you get paid good to deal w ignorance.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2 of course it ate my spelling.

[Oh Shoot]

Seems like a relatively strong possibility that the recent California decision on "may issue" could well become codified by SCOTUS to apply to all the states. 

 

- OS

[Guest Cazador]

If a hundred business owners in every large city would start calling the police and request an escort because they are going to the bank for a deposit or to pick up funds for daily business it may have an effect. They want show cause give it to them. If they deny it sue them for failing to provide service to tax paying citizens. With all the frivolous law suits out there surely some lawyer will risk a few hours for a big pay off. With the policies they set up they have created the danger. a law abiding business owner can not feel safe transporting his payroll because only the criminals are armed. Once enough of the city funds are spent on defending the law suits maybe some pressure from the city councils on law enforcement will stop the denials. Who knows? worth a try though.

[Guest PapaB]

If a hundred business owners in every large city would start calling the police and request an escort because they are going to the bank for a deposit or to pick up funds for daily business it may have an effect. They want show cause give it to them. If they deny it sue them for failing to provide service to tax paying citizens. With all the frivolous law suits out there surely some lawyer will risk a few hours for a big pay off. With the policies they set up they have created the danger. a law abiding business owner can not feel safe transporting his payroll because only the criminals are armed. Once enough of the city funds are spent on defending the law suits maybe some pressure from the city councils on law enforcement will stop the denials. Who knows? worth a try though.

 

Sure it would have an effect. The police would warn business owners to stop calling or face charges for interfering with police business. Courts have ruled that LE has no duty to protect individuals.

[RobertNashville]

I have come to the conclusion think that the best way to treat states like NY, CT, NJ and the like who want to enact draconian and unconstitutional firearm regulations is for good men and women to vote with their feet.  There are other places to live (and I would submit, better places to live)...let these states that continue to do stupid things such as enact these gun laws and continue out of control spending to sink into the cesspool they are creating for themselves.

 

If enough people and businesses left these states might just get a clue and it they didn't then at lest the good people wouldn't be there to suffer with the idiots.

Edited February 20, 2014 by RobertNashville

[A.J. Holst]

Voting is supposed to be the answer, but let's look at NYC or Chicago

 

The population density in and around the city believe the answer is "no guns" and vote for officials who beat the drum and distribute free bread.

 

Ask someone from rural NY or IL and ask them how they feel about majority rule affecting their 2A rights.

 

I have heard many times that PDs are less gun friendly while SDs appreciate and see the value of having law-abding citizens armed and taking the responsibility for self-protection.

[ncldwell]

Friends in NJ tell me that to obtain a permit the applicant must demonstrate "urgent need" to possess the firearm for self protection.  The person must show evidence of threats or previous attempts to take their life.  They are not aware of anyone that has successfully obtained one and most don't even try.  Even if a permit is obtained it is only good for two years and the same criteria must be met for renewal.  I don't imagine many renewals are successful either.

[RobertNashville]

Voting is supposed to be the answer, but let's look at NYC or Chicago

 

The population density in and around the city believe the answer is "no guns" and vote for officials who beat the drum and distribute free bread.

 

Ask someone from rural NY or IL and ask them how they feel about majority rule affecting their 2A rights.

 

I have heard many times that PDs are less gun friendly while SDs appreciate and see the value of having law-abding citizens armed and taking the responsibility for self-protection.

Seems like all the more reason for people who don't want to be subject to the "city dwellers" to find a more hospitable (to their views) state to live in. ;)

[Dolomite_supafly]

But this can't be true because Chris Christie, who was claimed to be the next Republican savior, is the governor there. When he first hit the spotlight he was supposed to be the conservative's conservative and we see how he has turned. He is more liberal than most who have a "D" next to their name on the ballot.

 

While we are at it lets talk Cruz. Seems like he has fallen awfully quiet as of late. I suspect he will fall in line with the rest and probably in record time too. The brightest stars burn out the quickest.

 

They all will eventually turn like zombies. They go to Washington and are wanting to do good for the country. Then the representatives that are already there bite infect them with promises of getting rich. Then those representatives that once wanted the best for the country turn like all those before them. It is a never ending cycle and will be never ending until every person going to Washington realizes they have one term then it is back to work.

 

 

Seems like all the more reason for people who don't want to be subject to the "city dwellers" to find a more hospitable (to their views) state to live in. ;)

 

Problem is most, not all, bring all their liberal views with them. They do not become diehard conservatives. They try to take the conservative states and turn them into the liberal states right before those liberal states when too far. I say let them wallow in the filth they created. If they want to live in a better place then they should make their own bed and not mess up mine.

[TnShooter83]

It is a never ending cycle and will be never ending until every person going to Washington realizes they have one term then it is back to work.

 

 

Unfortunately it would take longer than one term to figure out how to change things for the better.

I think that if one were to take a job as any politician in D.C. It would likely be the last job they ever have as it would take the rest of their life to turn things around.

And that would only happen if you have what? Over %50 in office agree with you?

[Guest PapaB]

Seems like all the more reason for people who don't want to be subject to the "city dwellers" to find a more hospitable (to their views) state to live in. ;)

 

That would be my solution for my family but it's not realistic for everyone. If you're on land your family has owned for generations, or you simply have never lived anywhere else, you're more likely to fight for your rights than to run. In CA as an example, 10 counties in the north are trying to seceed from the State because Sacramento doesn't represent their views. Those people could vote with their feet but they should also have other options in enjoying life, liberty and the pursuit of hapiness.

[RobertNashville]

But this can't be true because Chris Christie, who was claimed to be the next Republican savior, is the governor there. When he first hit the spotlight he was supposed to be the conservative's conservative and we see how he has turned. He is more liberal than most who have a "D" next to their name on the ballot.

 

While we are at it lets talk Cruz. Seems like he has fallen awfully quiet as of late. I suspect he will fall in line with the rest and probably in record time too. The brightest stars burn out the quickest.

 

They all will eventually turn like zombies. They go to Washington and are wanting to do good for the country. Then the representatives that are already there bite infect them with promises of getting rich. Then those representatives that once wanted the best for the country turn like all those before them. It is a never ending cycle and will be never ending until every person going to Washington realizes they have one term then it is back to work.

 

 

 

Problem is most, not all, bring all their liberal views with them. They do not become diehard conservatives. They try to take the conservative states and turn them into the liberal states right before those liberal states when too far. I say let them wallow in the filth they created. If they want to live in a better place then they should make their own bed and not mess up mine.

I'm not talking about those with liberal views moving and why would they move?  If the state they are living in is being governed IAW what they believe it they should be very happy to stay.  I'm talking about those moving who are at odds with the progressive (meaning socialism) way of governing - those are the folks who at some point may find the best answer in a state that better matches their views.

 

As to Christie...he hasn't "turned"...is is what he's always been. A lot of folks, me included, liked some of what we heard of and from him initially.  But, as we found out more about him we learned that he is just another liberal/progressive/big government politician who happens to wear a "Republican" label. That's what is supposed to happen isn't it? Potential candidates/candidates come on the scene and voters who care examine them...learn about their convictions...record and decide whether they are worthy of our vote! If Christie does get the Republican nomination I won't be voting for him because of what I've learned of him...who I might vote fore is very much up in the air at the moment.

[RobertNashville]

That would be my solution for my family but it's not realistic for everyone. If you're on land your family has owned for generations, or you simply have never lived anywhere else, you're more likely to fight for your rights than to run. In CA as an example, 10 counties in the north are trying to seceed from the State because Sacramento doesn't represent their views. Those people could vote with their feet but they should also have other options in enjoying life, liberty and the pursuit of hapiness.

Well, we all have to make our choices don't we...pick our battles...chose when to walk away.  I suppose where I'm coming from is that I don't know that the worst states (CA, NY, etc.) are salvageable...I think they may be too far gone to save and if they are, I wouldn't want to be living there when it gets really bad (as I think it will).

[jacob]

[quote name="RobertNashville" post="1113849" timestamp="1392911132"]I have come to the conclusion think that the best way to treat states like NY, CT, NJ and the like who want to enact draconian and unconstitutional firearm regulations is for good men and women to vote with their feet. There are other places to live (and I would submit, better places to live)...let these states that continue to do stupid things such as enact these gun laws and continue out of control spending to sink into the cesspool they are creating for themselves. If enough people and businesses left these states might just get a clue and it they didn't then at lest the good people wouldn't be there to suffer with the idiots.[/quote] Why is moving the answer? I keep hearing this talked as a solution akin to putting a band aid on a gushing wound. It's not going to fix the problem and most people don't have the means to relocate and still provide adequately for their families or themselves. The solution is for people to stand up and fight for what they believe in, instead of tucking tail and running. Guess what? Those statists will follow right behind to those "conservative" states and pour their govt dependant filth right on into the water there as well. What do you do then? Run somewhere else to hide? People not voting their beliefs and settling for 2nd best because it ain't the other guy is why this republic is in the mess it is now. If you guys think putting a Republican in the Oval Office is going to give us a chance you are dead wrong. Like Dolomite said, these bright stars of the party always seem to fall in line at some point. I honestly believe we have already passed the tipping point as there are too many people depending on govt for food, shelter, phones, and now insurance. Why should they work when they can spend their time doing what they love instead of working because it's a necessary evil in life? I can't offer a solution for how to fix this problem unfortunately as expressing distaste for an elected official with your vote is becoming increasingly ineffective. I guess only time will give us the answer