electronic cigarette?

[mhmd]

Other than that they exist, I know nothing about them.  The last thread I saw on TGO was from two years ago.  Since I trust the information from here more than from google,  I would appreciate any first hand experiences that can be shared. 

 

Thank you in advance.

[whitewolf001]

I don't use them but have friends that do but in all honestly pretty much everyone I've seen that does, goes back to smoking regular smokes or smoke while they also have this little do-dad. I've used them and if you inhale too much it'll hit you, HARD. The only real benefit I see outta them is that they can be used in doors and in public places that smoking is otherwise prohibited.

[mhmd]

I agree completely.  Statistically speaking, Chantix  gives you the greatest probability of being smoke free at 6 months.  Still, I need info on the things.

Mark

[Spots]

I used a groupon thing and bought a $250 package from LA smoke for $30 last year. Its alright, but I still smoke. They don't have the taste of a cigarette, not really, and they just didn't work for me. The filters also don't last like they claim if your a heavy smoker especially.

[TripleDigitRide]

We have a TGO member who owns an electronic cigarette company in the Nashville area. I'm not sure if he wants to be outed, but maybe he will chime in when/if he comes across this thread.

[Guest TankerHC]

I can tell you quite a bit about Ecigs. I have been using them for about two years and have researched the crap out of them.

 

I also still smoke, but at times I will go 2 weeks straight without a cigarette, on average I am down at least 50-60% from cigarettes. And expect to be completely off of them in a few months.

 

There are different brands of the ecigs and a thousand different flavors. Dont waste money on the disposables, first you don't actually get what everyone is doing with the vapor thing. A good Ecig, and there are only really two companies manufacturers that have been in the business long enough to get it right, secondly, don't use ecigs, buy a vaporizer with replaceable tanks that are voltage adjustable. A good one can be had for about 60 bucks. The fluids also make a difference, the fluids you get from places like ebay and Amazon, no telling whats in them, they come from China, There are vapor shops opening all over, a friend of mine opened one in Indiana (His third) when he started 4 years ago he was making a hundred bucks a week, today, his shop stays full and it is expected by next year to be a 32 billion dollar annual business and he is making a big chunk of it.He opened a shop in one of the malls in Chattanooga, I am not sure which one but when I met with him in Indiana a few months ago he was headed down to inspect it. Those vapor shops mix their own flavors, you can get them that taste like any cigarette or anything you want, mixed how you want. I use regular nicotine as well as Banana Nut Bread, Chocolate Chip Cookie dough and some others. Don't laugh, its way better than a cigarette. 

 

Some facts on these things.

 

You get MORE or less, however you want to regulate it, smoke and nicotine than any cigarette. 

 

You can regulate your own nicotine. When you go to a shop to get them mixed, you can get different levels, 100% that would choke a 20 cigar a day smoker, 75%, 0%, whatever you want. These smoke shops let you try before you buy. You can smoke as much as you want for about 10 bucks a month. Without the smoke.

 

These fluids contain Propolyne Glycol. Most people take Propolyne Glycol every day, it's a food additive, Propolyne Glycol contains two alcohol molecules, it is used in all sorts of things, shampoo, skin conditioner, keeps fruit and vegetables fresh, antibacterial hand cleaner, shaving cream, real testing (Experiemental and antidotal) shows it to be completely non carcinogenic and the FDA has deemed it "Generally Safe" and doesn't need to be regulated. People claim "Its antifreeze!". Well it isn't, it's in antifreeze, it used to be Ethylene Glycol but Propolyne Glycol was found to be a cheaper, safer alternative. Testing by the FDA also shows that it also causes no internal or external tissue damage, not even irritation. Along with Prop Glycol there is Vegetable Glycerin, Water, flavoring and Nicotine.

 

The only place that this has been completely tested Scientifically is the Canadian equivalent of the labs of the CDC. Two test groups of monkeys, 6 in each room, 18 months, one room continuously breathed the vapor, one group filtered air. The post experiment autopsies showed no difference between the two groups. One of the test monkeys in the vapor group had skin irritation, the Canadians concluded that did not occur from the Vapor. 

 

If you are prescribed Nicotrol to quit smoking, you are basically getting the same thing as these ecigs and vaporizers. The difference is that Nicotrol requires a prescription, cost $55 per 6 day package vs 8 bucks a month for this. The only people trying to get it regulated are those who supply Nicotrol, even the Cigarette companies dont want them regulated because its an open market when they get into them. Propolyene Glycol is considered safe, water is considered safe, Nicotine is already so regulated if they went any further they would put the cigarette companies out of business, that is not going to happen. 

 

Chantix is exactly the same thing as Welbutrin. Buproprion, it's an anti depressant and it is a dangerous drug, which is why doctors use it as a last resort for smoking cessation. It is well known that it causes suicidal tendencies and thoughts and people carry it out. And it doesnt always work, I know, I tried it and it did nothing for me. 

 

They aren't smoking cessation devices, They are smoking "alternatives". They WILL help you quit smoking, they cannot be called smoking cessation devices or marketed that way because if they are, they become a medical device and are subject to regulation. Since they aren't called that, the Gov can keep their hands out. 

 

I can smoke in the house, there is no odor, I can smoke in the car with my wife (Who is a non smoker) and it doesn't bother her one bit, there is no odor and since its a vapor it dissipates almost as soon as you blow out the vapor (Smoke), so there is no smoke. I use it in car full of non smokers all the time, they don't even notice.

 

There are "Vaping" forums with more people on them than gun, bike and car forums combined. 

 

My smokers cough is gone, even though I still smoke, unless I forget my vaporizer, I went from a 2 1/2 to 3 pack a day smoker to 1/2 a pack a week. I started with 100% Nicotine, after a few months, 50% then 25% and am now at 1/8th. Ill be done with Nicotine altogether soon, I really dont even have a craving for a cigarette any longer. I used to be in and out the door every ten minutes smoking, now I might go out once or twice a day, if I am doing something 3 or 4 times a day unless I have my vaporizer with me then zero times a day. I can lay in bed and watch TV and use this. 

 

And when I am done with Nicotine, I can still smoke, this, and plan on it, because I like smoking, but all the tar, nicotine and all the other crap that comes with cigarettes, GONE, along with my morning smokers hack.

 

Here is one of mine, its the best one you can get. It has a voltage regulator, smoke (Puff) regulator so if I am hitting it too many times it will stop for 15 seconds,  can turn that on or off. The tanks are replaceable for 4 bucks, the batteries go forever, this one has wicks inside the tanks, the voltage regulator determines how large the amount of vapor comes out, I can smoke like I am puffing on 10 cigars at once down to less than a tine puff on a cigarette. Cost, $40.

 

The little bottle in the picture, can last me a month, 8 bucks, 100% level nicotene, tastes just like a strong cigarette. My wife loves it, she no longer has to smell me smelling like a cigarette when we go out with friends, she no longer smells cigarettes in the house (I don't smoke in the house, its from my clothes, hair and skin) or on my clothes (Unless I forget it), she no longer has to kiss a cigarette mouth (Which she hates), and I still get my nicotine hit so I'm not bouncing off walls on a nicotine withdrawal. 

 

Plus, I like all the different flavors, and there are a lot of them. I also like the fact I am weaning myself off of Nicotine and when I am done I can still smoke without all the BS from cigarettes.

 

Edited December 29, 2013 by TankerHC

[10-Ring]

A friend of mine got into them big a few months ago and it's become a hobby to him, he even builds them now.  I don't know a whole lot about them, my buddy, like Tanker, has said that if you are going to get one get a good one.  To second Tanker again there is no tar in the vapor.

[Guest Keal G Seo]

I like most of what Tanker said. Especially buying quality. The refillable ones sound like a hassle to me though...kinda like roll your own cigs. The disposables are over priced. But as with most things it is going to be cost vs effort. I got the Blue ecig a few years ago with the idea that I could quit with it. Nope. It did cut my use by a little more than half though. 1.5 packs/day to 10-15 cigs/day. Anyway, those are nice because you keep the batteries and just replace the "filters" that contain the liquid and vaporizer. Last time I ordered they came in like four different nicotine strengths. Flavor choice isn't as great as some of the other companies or even close to the refillable ones. To me though the menthol and tobacco flavors taste nothing like their counter parts. I enjoyed the "java" flavor the most. I think just the cig action (and nicotine) helps curb the urge to smoke a real one.

Biggest plus? Never had a business, doctor or hospital ask me to stop.

All and all, I'd say give a disposable a try. If you enjoy it or it works to curb your cravings in public settings, then order one you can either refill or replace the filters.

[Guest TankerHC]

I like most of what Tanker said. Especially buying quality. The refillable ones sound like a hassle to me though...kinda like roll your own cigs. The disposables are over priced. But as with most things it is going to be cost vs effort. I got the Blue ecig a few years ago with the idea that I could quit with it. Nope. It did cut my use by a little more than half though. 1.5 packs/day to 10-15 cigs/day. Anyway, those are nice because you keep the batteries and just replace the "filters" that contain the liquid and vaporizer. Last time I ordered they came in like four different nicotine strengths. Flavor choice isn't as great as some of the other companies or even close to the refillable ones. To me though the menthol and tobacco flavors taste nothing like their counter parts. I enjoyed the "java" flavor the most. I think just the cig action (and nicotine) helps curb the urge to smoke a real one.

Biggest plus? Never had a business, doctor or hospital ask me to stop.

All and all, I'd say give a disposable a try. If you enjoy it or it works to curb your cravings in public settings, then order one you can either refill or replace the filters.

 

I told my doctor what I was doing, she said good, keep doing it. I was scheduled a while back to begin smoking cessation classes, didnt need to. After I told them what I was doing and where I was at that point.

 

On the filling, takes me about 30 seconds, once every couple of weeks. Screw off the tanks. bottle on the edge, squeeze until its at the line, screw the tank back on, and its done, 30 seconds. Dont have to do it again for about two weeks unless I am using it heavily then maybe every 4 days. But I dont even do it that often, I keep 2 tanks ready, one is empty, screw it off, screw the other one on. Some of the cheapo tanks leak, shorts out the battery, I havent had one of the good ones leak yet and even the good ones some places you can get two for 10 bucks. 

 

IMHO, any smoker who wants to quit should at least give them a REAL try with a good vaporizor. Not the cheap junk they sell in gas stations or on ebay, there is a difference. Several cities have banned them in places where cigarettes arent allowed, all Liberal enclaves like NYC, LA etc. They couldn't come up with a valid reason so they threw out the "Its for the Children" argument. Because it might make kids want to smoke. The CDC wants it regulated, as does the WHO, to keep people from becoming addicted to Nicotine. I thought the reason to get people to stop smoking was Cigarettes cause cancer. Well there is an alternative that does not cause Cancer so "Its for the children". These people make me nauseous.Cigarette companies said the only reason these should be regulated is for quality, one of the Manufacturers who is now manufacturing vaporizers also manufactures Marlboro cigarettes, the Cigarette lobby is now backing the Vapor companies like Victory on stopping the NYC and LA bans. It may have something to do with the fact that Victory wasnt expected to make any money, went Public and their stock is now nearly 10 bucks a share. 

[Guest Lester Weevils]

I got one of those Lava-whatever hawiaan company sets with three rechargeable batts and a couple different kinds of interchangeable vapor heads.

The fluid that company sells was usa formulated, supposedly just prop glycol, glycerin and nicotine and flavorings, I just got the "tobacco" flavor and the menthol flavor.

Taste was passable, as I'm only interested in the nicotine anyway. The ecig modules were a little hard on the draw, more like a tight cigar than a cig. The fat modules where you push a button to fire em up, rather than a suction switch.

So anyway my only problem is that the propylene glycol, or glycerin, or something or other in the vapor gives me a sorer throat then basic shorts or marlboro reds or home rolled smokes from mild pipe tobacco. So I quit using the ecigs.

If I was to run across a good dose of nicotine vapor that doesn't make my throat raw, might try it again. Think I read that the chemicals might not be "toxic" but can dry your throat and mucous membranes, causing the sore throat for some.

[Guest TankerHC]

I got one of those Lava-whatever hawiaan company sets with three rechargeable batts and a couple different kinds of interchangeable vapor heads.

The fluid that company sells was usa formulated, supposedly just prop glycol, glycerin and nicotine and flavorings, I just got the "tobacco" flavor and the menthol flavor.

Taste was passable, as I'm only interested in the nicotine anyway. The ecig modules were a little hard on the draw, more like a tight cigar than a cig. The fat modules where you push a button to fire em up, rather than a suction switch.

So anyway my only problem is that the propylene glycol, or glycerin, or something or other in the vapor gives me a sorer throat then basic shorts or marlboro reds or home rolled smokes from mild pipe tobacco. So I quit using the ecigs.

If I was to run across a good dose of nicotine vapor that doesn't make my throat raw, might try it again. Think I read that the chemicals might not be "toxic" but can dry your throat and mucous membranes, causing the sore throat for some.

 

Go to a local shop, they can mix it for you, whatever you ask for, you can try it before you buy it in most places. Personally for me I haven't had that problem with the sore throat except once, and the stuff I had was so strong it was like eating cigarettes rather than smoking.  Mine is easier to draw on than a cigarette. Takes no effort at all.  

[Guest Keal G Seo]

Yeah I have heard this a lot actually. Just like when you started smoking cigs right? lol It takes some getting used to, especially if you are tokin large. Try taking smaller hits. While each hit wont deliver as much nicotine you can keep going until satisfied unlike having to light multiple cigs.

[Guest TankerHC]

I never had a problem smoking, started when I was 11 or 12, heck before that smoking was the cool thing to do. Even before I started smoking they had these candy cigarettes that you could get filter and non filter, made out of some kind of chalk candy that if you blew through them smoke (powder) would come out, They came 5 to a pack and the pack looked just like a pack of Marlboro's. Cigars made out of bubble gum. In the 70's I didnt know any adult who DIDNT smoke. Right across the street from the School they sold Cigarettes to 6th and 7th graders two for a quarter, we even had a smoking area, right on the corner, our HS had a smoking area and students would take passes and go smoke. But I did quit once for 8 years and went right back to it, only twice as bad. 

Edited December 29, 2013 by TankerHC

[Murgatroy]

I didn't read all of Tanker's posts, but I read enough to tell you that he knows what he is talking about.

 

I started using a vaporizer about four months ago. I quit smoking the day I did. I haven't touched a cigarette since. I am to the point where I only hit the vaporizer once every other day or so.

 

I use an Ego Twist battery and a Kanger eVod tank. I swear by them. Costs about $30 to play, not counting your juices, and $10 of juice will last a week.

 

There is a cat on the board that runs a shop in Nashville. I haven't done business with him, but he seems like a good cat. I have been ordering from Mountain Oak Vapors out of Cleveland, TN for a while now, they are one of the better known names in the game.

[mhmd]

Tanker thanks for your input.  Others, thank you for your input as well.  I didn't visit the smoking forums.  I'm sure there are some honest folks there.  Here, I see most of your names pop up on a regular/semi regular basis.  That makes me more receptive to your input than some forum I have never been to and not likely ever to visit again.

 

For a moment of digress, there are multiple risks with smoking.  Yes there are many chemicals in tobacco that are carcinogenic.  Nicotine probably isn't one of them. (unless you live in California, where life itself is known by the state of California to cause caner.) Chantix isn't an antidepressant.  Wellbutrin and then zyban certainly are.  Forgive me please, my OCD kicks in every so often.

 

So I did google these things and saw "Vapor King", "Blu","ProVari," etc.  Still, I don't know one brand from another.  I saw Blu and Lava mentioned but it didn't seem like you all thought much of them. Someone mentioned throat irritation but I would think that would be acclimated to using it kind of thing.  Is that wrong? 

 

Again, Thank you to all.

Mark

[Guest TankerHC]

Tanker thanks for your input.  Others, thank you for your input as well.  I didn't visit the smoking forums.  I'm sure there are some honest folks there.  Here, I see most of your names pop up on a regular/semi regular basis.  That makes me more receptive to your input than some forum I have never been to and not likely ever to visit again.

 

For a moment of digress, there are multiple risks with smoking.  Yes there are many chemicals in tobacco that are carcinogenic.  Nicotine probably isn't one of them. (unless you live in California, where life itself is known by the state of California to cause caner.) Chantix isn't an antidepressant.  Wellbutrin and then zyban certainly are.  Forgive me please, my OCD kicks in every so often.

 

So I did google these things and saw "Vapor King", "Blu","ProVari," etc.  Still, I don't know one brand from another.  I saw Blu and Lava mentioned but it didn't seem like you all thought much of them. Someone mentioned throat irritation but I would think that would be acclimated to using it kind of thing.  Is that wrong? 

 

Again, Thank you to all.

Mark

 

From the FDA

 

FDA notified healthcare professionals and patients that it has required the manufacturers of the smoking cessation aids varenicline (Chantix) and bupropion (Zyban and generics) to add new Boxed Warnings and develop patient Medication Guides highlighting the risk of serious neuropsychiatric symptoms in patients using these products. These symptoms include changes in behavior, hostility, agitation, depressed mood, suicidal thoughts and behavior, and attempted suicide. The added warnings are based on the continued review of postmarketing adverse event reports for varenicline and bupropion received by the FDA. These reports included those with a temporal relationship between the use of varenicline or bupropion and suicidal events and the occurrence of suicidal ideation and suicidal behavior in patients with no history of psychiatric disease.

Healthcare professionals should advise patients to stop taking varenicline or bupropion and contact a healthcare provider immediately if they experience agitation, depressed mood, and any changes in behavior that are not typical of nicotine withdrawal, or if they experience suicidal thoughts or behavior.

 

varenicline Clinical Trials. It is an anti depressant.

 

Condition: Depressed Disorder 

Intervention: Drug, fixed dose Varenicline

 

http://clinicaltrials.gov/show/NCT00525837

Edited December 29, 2013 by TankerHC

[Guest Lester Weevils]

The lava products were good quality as best I could tell. The gadgets still work after being put up a couple years. I got em out a couple of months ago, charged em up and occasionally toked on it for about a week. The draw was a little hard on the vaporizer units I got but they worked ok as best I can tell.

I got the impression that there are a couple of vaporizer designs that are interchangeable between many brands, maybe made the same place, or not, dunno. They have a little resistive heater that the fluid soaks down on. One design lets you manually drip a few drops of fluid into the thing then smoke awhile, kinda like loading a pipe and puffing on it awhile. Another type has little plastic tanks you can fill from a bigger bottle then plug them onto the vaporizer.

First time I puffed on the ecigs several weeks, but the throat soreness and dry cough kept getting worse. If it is a matter of acclimatization, then dunno how bad its gotta hurt before it gets better. Same reaction a couple months ago last time I tried. The old country doctor say, "if it hurts don't do that" :)

If I ever go by some store that formulates, I'll ask, "put in plenty of nicotine but leave off whatever hurts my throat." Dunno if the fella would know what to do. Presumably he wouldn't put in any chemical that would hurt my throat.

I tried that chantix stuff. Maybe it has been tested as an antidepressant, but as best I recall it works on the nicotine receptors in the brain, theoretically why it is good for smoking cessation.

I'm a libertarian who doesn't think any drug should be outlawed, but if they are gonna outlaw any drugs they should start with chantix. I consider myself a VERY psychologically stable person, and taking chantix was like descent into insanity. Took it about four weeks getting progressively more upset in ways I've never experienced before. And finally quit cold turkey and had the most awful withdrawal symptoms for about a week. I'd find myself doing cheyne-stokes breathing I was so screwed up. I was so messed up I don't remember my state of mind good enough to adequately describe it, except that it was bad.

If you try chantix, lock up your guns first, just in case something weird suddenly "seems like a good thing to do". :) Edited December 29, 2013 by Lester Weevils

[gregintenn]

They're hard to light, and taste like burning plastic! :puke:

[Guest sL1k]

I am 2 years smoke free because of ecigs.
I use the detonator variable voltage from mister e liquid and I use their liquids they taste amazing and they are the only company I know of that offers 32mg nicotine strength.
The other cool thing about their ecigs is that they use 14500 batteries which I have flashlights that take the same batteries. The batteries last me a day and a half and I just rotate them on the charger.
I use cartridges still they are the simplest to use and to me offer a better throat hit than tanks. They are cheap and dont leak.
The biggest advice I can give anyone is to go with a variable voltage ecig.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Here is the website for the kind I tried-- The model I used was "inferno".

http://www.volcanoecigs.com/

I had no complaints about the equipment or service from this company. Edited December 29, 2013 by Lester Weevils

[Guest TankerHC]

Hey, I think I need to point this out. I am not a Doctor and do not claim to be, however, if you need an operation and the ACA caused you to lose your insurance Im always up for learning something new.

 

When I replied to mark I already surmised a while back he was either a Doc or in the Medical profession. (mhMD), could have been wrong but didnt think so. So allow me to clarify on where my information on Chantix and Welbutrin came from. and apologize to Mark for trying to tell a Doctor a Doctors business. 

 

I took Buprorion to stop smoking, it did absolutely nothing. I waited for side effects, there were none and as far as it's anti depressent properties it would have done nothing for me because I was not depressed in the first place, I have only been depressed once in the last couple of years, that was on November 6, 2012 at 8 PM. When I signed up for smoking cessation classes I went to the first class. In those classes on the first class you go around and tell them why you smoke, they tell you the causes of smoking, how it takes at least three times for the average person to try and quit before success etc, etc. They discuss  various stop smoking methods, THE Doctor in the class, who was my Doctor I asked about Chantix, and I was told exactly this "They are exactly the same, antidepressents, if Welbutrin didnt help you stop smoking, Chantix wont either,they are dangerous drugs and you have to be monitored and they are used as a last resort. When I took it I was smoking more than 3 packs a day, while taking it I was still smoking 3 packs a day and after taking it I was STILL smoking 3 packs a day. Everyone I know who took it, is either still smoking, or stopped smoking on their own after taking it. Only one person, a relative who took it quit altogether while taking it, afterwards, went right back to cigarettes. Has now quit smoking on his own and has been quit for about 6 months and sends me at least one message a month with "Days quit". 

 

THAT is where my information came from, and THAT does not make me a Doctor. Which I actually didnt claim to be, but with the assumption that Mark was a Doctor, that was still pretty overbearing to post a link like that. And I know there is a reason why Doctors and Attorneys (Both of which I have used often, because I am not stupid enough to do their jobs for myself) dont just jump in dispensing Medical and Legal advice on Forums and Facebook and wherever, that is pretty obvious.

 

J

[ironsniper1]

My gf heard about some ecigs that are just flavored no nicotine and now she wants to try them no idea why as we don't smoke but thanks for all the info so far tanker and everyone else!

[NoBanStan]

I TL;DR'd this thread but my one and only piece of input is to do your homework on electronic cigs so you buy the one you like the first time....

 

I know at least 3-4 guys who bought one and liked it. then they upgraded, then they added parts, then they upgraded again... then it was atomizer, then cartomizer, then it was wattage and amps and etc. etc.

 

Before they realized it they had about $500 in parts and they CONSTANTLY fiddle with the thing.

 

Pick it up, take a hit... describe the 30 parts they have in the device, set it down, pick it up, unscrew something, change out a part, hit it again. unscrew, change a part, change the flavor,  hit it. Set it down, pick it up, twirl in fingers...... repeat.

[mhmd]

"Before they realized it they had about $500 in parts and they CONSTANTLY fiddle with the thing."

Are you talking about ecig or my AR build?

[mhmd]

Oh wait, couldn't be my AR build. I passed that $$ days ago