Trust Regulation Change Update

[midtennchip]

I haven't seen this posted yet, but I have not been on the forum much lately. In any event, the proposed regulation changes regarding NFA trusts has been updated. Specifically, the "final action" target date has been posted. This is not a hard and fast date, but it does indicate that the BATFE is not moving quite as fast as some of us feared. Whether or not the date stays as June is anybody's guess.

http://www.reginfo.gov/public/do/eAgendaViewRule?pubId=201310&RIN=1140-AA43

[scoutfsu]

That date has been there quite a while.....besides not being a real date - no "00" in June :cool: .

[midtennchip]

That date has been there quite a while.....besides not being a real date - no "00" in June :cool: .

The "00" indicates the month of June (ie: an unspecified date in June). Yes, it has been there a little while.

[scoutfsu]

Roger.  So "06/00" equals "whenever we feel like enacting this bs in June?"  I've never seen the "00" used before.  Is that common?

[midtennchip]

Roger.  So "06/00" equals "whenever we feel like enacting this bs in June?"  I've never seen the "00" used before.  Is that common?

Generally, yes. It is common in the regulatory world. "Close enough for government work," I guess.

[Guest _M_]

Generally, yes. It is common in the regulatory world. "Close enough for government work," I guess.

Chip, will existing Trusts be grandfathered if they do enact this?

[Guest bjohnson338]

Chip, will existing Trusts be grandfathered if they do enact this?

Would like to know this as well so I can get one set up.

[John Wells]

Paperwork filed through trusts prior to the new rules going into effect should be fine.

[macville]

Do you have to have an NFA item to file a trust? If not, seems like it would be wise to go ahead and file a trust even if you aren't going to use it soon.

[LawEnforcementSalesTN]

No, drafting the trust comes first... I think you do (or you did) have transfer a single asset (ball point pin, dollar bill, etc. - anything) to initiate/activate... sorry, it's too cold and I can't remember proper nomenclature (you're basically bringing the trust to life so to speak) but you have the trust drafted before transfering your first NFA object.

 

However for any chance to be grandfathered you would have to had filed your form 4s and them be received prior to any rules becoming effective.... so creating the trust and doing nothing with it until after the new rules go into effect you'd definitely lose any chance of being grandfathered. 

 

I JUST got my 1st trust form 4 back for a customer SINCE all this rule mess started.  They had been coming in prior in 5-6 months... this particular item it was 11 months!!! (filed in Feb).  I'm not saying that's the norm but you can definitely see the impact the proposed changes have made with folks rushing to get stuff sent in hopes of being grandfathered.  This was manual filing too before the eforms.

 

I've got 3-4 eform 4s in flight now... have yet to get any of those back.  My eform 3s I've seen great success with those so I'm hopeful... one transfer in 10 days from filing to shipping item to another dealer.

Edited January 6, 2014 by LawEnforcementSalesTN

[JohnC]

Interesting.....

 

A little off topic but where the heck is the link to comment on the new background check crap?

 

http://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/2014/January/14-ag-002.html

 

I looked on regulations.gov and couldn't locate it for some reason. :shrug:

[LawEnforcementSalesTN]

Interesting.....

 

A little off topic but where the heck is the link to comment on the new background check crap?

 

http://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/2014/January/14-ag-002.html

 

I looked on regulations.gov and couldn't locate it for some reason. :shrug:

 

 

Saw this-> https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2014/01/07/2014-00039/definition-of-adjudicated-as-a-mental-defective-and-committed-to-a-mental-institution   it's the ATF's most recent article

[JohnC]

Saw this-> https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2014/01/07/2014-00039/definition-of-adjudicated-as-a-mental-defective-and-committed-to-a-mental-institution   it's the ATF's most recent article

 

So do you see any reasons to comment on this one?

 

Any loopholes in there where they might be able to screw folks over with who might of had a temp issue (like got a divorce, got depressed, took Zoloft for 3 months, and got over it later and are otherwise not on meds and completely normal)? Anything in there to screw over veterans?

 

The pdf: https://s3.amazonaws.com/public-inspection.federalregister.gov/2014-00039.pdf

[John Wells]

I'll read the rule change in it's entirety later today, but from the summary, it only would apply to persons who have been determined "mentally defective" by a court.  So according to the summary, having a prescription for an anti-depressant alone would not have any impact.

[JohnC]

I'll read the rule change in it's entirety later today, but from the summary, it only would apply to persons who have been determined "mentally defective" by a court.  So according to the summary, having a prescription for an anti-depressant alone would not have any impact.

 

Thanks, John!

 

Keep us posted on your findings!

[midtennchip]

Do you have to have an NFA item to file a trust? If not, seems like it would be wise to go ahead and file a trust even if you aren't going to use it soon.

Unfortunately, it does not work that way. It is not the timing of the creation of the trust that is important, it is the date of the filing of the Form 1 or Form 4. Each Form is evaluated individually, so getting the trust completed AND filing the Form 1 or Form 4 is what is important. If the proposed regulations actually go into effect, those Forms that were filed before the effective date may be grandfathered in (although there is no guarantee of that). In any event, if someone wants to set up a trust and submit a Form 1 or Form 4, getting started sooner rather than later is probably a good idea. Edited January 8, 2014 by midtennchip

[John Wells]

Thanks, John!

 

Keep us posted on your findings!

 

Okay,

 

Sorry for the delay.  I got a chance to read this in it's entirety this morning and I didn't find anything in the text that would limit anyone other than a person that has been ruled mentally defective by a court or has been committed to a mental health institution.  There is no mention of prescriptions for anti-depressants or anything like that.