The "Get Home" Gun

[Guest TNSovereignty]

Been reading the recent, lengthy post on cheap SHTF gun.  Interesting, but rarely does anyone define SHTF.  No perfect gun for all scenarios ... that's why we all have multiple firearms, right?

 

Here's a scenario I'm talking through w/ my son ... not "how to get out of Dodge", but how to get home if there's a cataclysmic event.  You can choose your catastrophe - natural or man-made - but let's say you're 20+ miles from home & the transportation network is down.  (I know, guess this kind of sounds EMP-ish.)  You live in rural TN so you just want to get home to your family, your root cellar, and to safeguard your barn/livestock from looting knuckleheads.  What long-gun do you want with you to hike home with ... scenario includes NOT hiking the roadways, and carrying a separate backpack crammed with other "get home" stuff ... we call it a "bug-home" bag.

 

The long-gun wouldn't be to take squirrels & woodchucks ... it would be an anti-personnel weapon.  The long gun would be accompanied by a .45 sidearm.  We've thought of everything from 12 ga to 7.62.  Your thoughts?

[GlockSpock]

20 miles eh?

 

http://tinyurl.com/kkaykm

[Spots]

I actually carry a setup like this in the truck. I have a get home bag, a 1911, and an AR with a 7 mag combat load. An AR is modular, light and easy to learn on. Mine is 5.56 and is currently and m4 style setup. Moving fast and light is gonna be favorable, and ammo is much lighter than .308, plus the gun is light and fast.

Tapatalk ate my spelling.

[GoneBallistic]

AR in 300 Blackout. For all the reasons Spots listed above. The ammo is a little heavier, but the increased "knock-down" power is worth it IMO. I prefer heavier subsonic loads but you could carry lighter supersonic ammo and not be a whole lot heavier than a 5.56.

[Guest kylexander]

I agree with the AR suggestions. This is a very different scenario from what I normally think about. It is really a short term situation. You need to get home, not hunt for food or endure the elements for over a day. I personally would probably prefer .308 in an AK action, but an AR would be more accurate and probably a little lighter. If you are hoofing it 20 miles and trying to move quickly, the decreased weight of a lighter round and weapon would probably work in your favor. I feel like nearly any rifle would work for this scenario.

[Jonnin]

AR pistol.  Light, small enough to conceal sorta (not in your buttcrack but you can hide it in a briefcase, backpack, etc), high cap (AR mags!), ammo isnt too heavy or bulky, accurate and deadly out to 200 or so yards, and legal on your permit should you get caught with it. 

 

An alternative would be a 9mm carbine like the kel-tec 2000 9mm or 40.   It folds up small and with extra barrel length over a pistol, it gets some decent power out of a pistol round.  I would rather have the 223 but this type of weapon has many pros --- possibly same mags as your pistol, same ammo, etc.

[BryanP]

An alternative would be a 9mm carbine like the kel-tec 2000 9mm or 40.   It folds up small and with extra barrel length over a pistol, it gets some decent power out of a pistol round.  I would rather have the 223 but this type of weapon has many pros --- possibly same mags as your pistol, same ammo, etc.

 

This would be a good argument for a Keltec SU16C. 

 

Honestly, I'd probably just carry a full sized .357 revolver (GP100 etc..) and use the saved weight for some extra ammo.

[Guest TNSovereignty]

Thanks for all the quick comebacks.  Your advice is appreciated ... the AR hadn't really been at the top of the list, primarily because I was thinking a non-battle rifle might be less likely to draw attention.  Another thought we had, and didn't previously post, is that this would be a stay-in-the-trunk gun.  From your insights & our experience (we have ARs in the safe), these rifles carry well & we're used to them, so maybe we need to reconsider this as the primary tool.  Just need to work on my comfort level carrying what many - maybe even LE officers - consider "assault weapon."  If my son is pulled over for some reason & some probable cause is drummed up to search the trunk, some overzealous LEO might consider him a terrorist - he fits the profile ... tea party member, Christian, a fan of R.E. Lee, white male.  Is this paranoid?

 

Other thoughts we had included the Mosin (a pain to carry & heavy ammo) to our .357 lever gun.  The latter could be coupled w/ a .357 revolver instead of the .45.  

 

I hadn't looked in to the Kel-Tec 2000 ... I'll research that.  Don't even know what they look like.

[jcluff]

Glock 22 and keltec sub2000 in the bag. G23 or 27 as ccw. 6 or more extra high capacity magazines. This will likely be my first setup. Eventually, I will have an AR Pistol in 300blk for this purpose with about 6 loaded magazines and a few ammo pouches to put on a belt in a bad situation that I need to hurry home through.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[Guest TNSovereignty]

Honestly, I'd probably just carry a full sized .357 revolver (GP100 etc..) and use the saved weight for some extra ammo.

OK ... I'm kind of thinking along these lines as a possibility too.  We have a GP100 w/ 4" barrel.  We're good with it out to 40 yards or so.  That's great for most anti-personnel situations.  But I've always read from real-world warriors that if you have a choice the rifle always trumps the handgun.  

 

I know there's no perfect answer.  Appreciate the thoughts ... I'm not shooting any of them down (as I've seen in a similar post!)

[Guest TNSovereignty]

20 miles eh?

He travels 15-60 miles away from home on any given day.  So the extremity is 60 miles; usually no more than 20.  Could be a multiple-day hike in worst case situation.

[Jonnin]

That is why I said AR pistol, to avoid being hammered if you are caught with it in the trunk.  A PISTOL in the trunk with a HCP should go a LONG way toward shutting down any excited LEOs, esp if you play nice when they start asking questions.   The carbines and rifles are NOT legal on a HCP and would be a little harder to dismiss.  Still legal to own, but you would want to transport those unloaded rather than ready to go, just in case.  In the trunk, unloaded, in a state like TN, if you keep your attitude positive and friendly you won't get burned for a rifle either.

 

Mosin??  I love these old guns, but I would not care to walk even a mile with one.   On the bright side, you could get steel core ammo for it in case you encounter a hostile tank on your walk home.  

 

I do not consider any "combat" scenario where a revolver is sufficient to be a true SHTF scenario.   Depending on where you are, it could be all you need.  I was going for total chaos, looting, society breaks down firepower.  Realistically, a handgun is all you probably would need, I agree, just depends on what sort of awful scenario you are dreaming about vs running out of gas and having to walk 10 miles home due to a cell phone issue.

 

Do take a look at all of kel-tec's long arms.  They have some interesting hardware, unlike most anything else on the market, they like to design stuff.

Edited November 13, 2013 by Jonnin

[BryanP]

OK ... I'm kind of thinking along these lines as a possibility too.  We have a GP100 w/ 4" barrel.  We're good with it out to 40 yards or so.  That's great for most anti-personnel situations.  But I've always read from real-world warriors that if you have a choice the rifle always trumps the handgun.  

 

I know there's no perfect answer.  Appreciate the thoughts ... I'm not shooting any of them down (as I've seen in a similar post!)

 

Long gun trumps handgun, it's true.  But you're not on some offensive mission.  Your goal is to hike to safety.  Weight is a big deal in that situation.  Also remaining inconspicuous,  The handgun comes out ahead on both of those fronts.  Even a big handgun is easier to conceal if needed.

[GoneBallistic]

Since you mentioned it would be accompanied by a .45 handgun, a Kriss carbine and a Glock .45 would be perfect IMO. Same ammo AND same magazines...

[peejman]

Long gun trumps handgun, it's true.  But you're not on some offensive mission.  Your goal is to hike to safety.  Weight is a big deal in that situation.  Also remaining inconspicuous,  The handgun comes out ahead on both of those fronts.  Even a big handgun is easier to conceal if needed.

 

 

This.  In that sort of situation stealth and/or simply being inconspicuous would be very important IMO.  20 miles is a long way for most people to hike.  It's doable in a day if you're used to it and the terrain is moderate, but bushwhacking 20 miles across the hills is way different from walking down the street.   

Edited November 13, 2013 by peejman

[Lowpower]

S&W Model 29,  8 3/8" barrel. Can be concealed and un-noticed but can reach out and touch some...err....thing.

Doesn't really need a red dot or scope but you can get a shoulder holster to hold the gun and those accessories if you want one. 

6 speed loaders can even be carried in your pockets.

 

p.s.-don't forget water.....

 

Lp

 

Now I forgot to mention. If it really hits and your life is in jeopardy, one shot and you may own that AR everyone's chatting about.

Edited November 13, 2013 by Lowpower

[enfield]

I carry an AR and a significant handgun on all road trips outside the local area.  With spare ammo & mags as required.

 

A nice thing about the AR carbine is its size and the nondescript carry cases you can get for it.  Simplifies transfers into/out of motel rooms.  I just can't blend in the same way with an FAL.  :D

[Joseg]

This.  In that sort of situation stealth and/or simply being inconspicuous would be very important IMO.  20 miles is a long way for most people to hike.  It's doable in a day if you're used to it and the terrain is moderate, but bushwhacking 20 miles across the hills is way different from walking down the street.   

 

 

20 miles up hills, unless you are a Sherpa, that is going to kick your butt. Even when I was in panama, we usually avoided the hills unless we had to.. Route recon is useful here.. 

 

Been wondering about the AR in the trunk on a daily. how would you secure it? Same goes for an AR pistol?  I'm about to lose my truck for an smaller SUV, so I do have the ability to hide/secure/etc in it.. 

[Guest kylexander]

I believe it was Clint Smith who said something to the effect of handguns only really serving to help one fight his way to his long gun. So as for the handgun only suggestion, I think it might be prudent to also carry a rifle in your bug-in kit. The combo is without a doubt a good idea. The idea of a .357 lever gun and a revolver is even better.

[tennessee01tacoma]

Ar in the trunk, ammo in the passengers compartment. From my uunderstanding that would keep you legal in a traffic stop. An 18" shotgun wouldn't be a horrible choice you could defend yourself and take game for food. With wood stocks it wouldn't look militaristic.

[Guest kylexander]

I was told by an LEO years ago that I could store my AK anywhere in the cab as long as the ammunition was stored in a seperate compartment with the ability to lock it.

[jcluff]

Considering the legalities involved and the desire to keep the gun easily transportable, I may have to go with the AR pistol first. That keeps me legal, even after i have exited the most threatening areas but am still on foot and may be entering an area where order of law still exists but where LEOs might be a little jumpy and likely to arrest someone they see carrying a loaded rifle. I was planning on building my newest lower into one anyways, just figured it would take me 6+ months before it was ready. That will likely have to change. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Edited November 13, 2013 by jcluff

[GoneBallistic]

So even if you have a HCP you can't carry a loaded long gun in your vehicle?

[tennessee01tacoma]

So even if you have a HCP you can't carry a loaded long gun in your vehicle?

Magazine can be loaded chamber must be empty.

[Jonnin]

I was told by an LEO years ago that I could store my AK anywhere in the cab as long as the ammunition was stored in a seperate compartment with the ability to lock it.

 

This meets the letter of the federal interstate travel rules I believe, yes.  Though I think some states you would be wise to have the AK in a locked gun box as well just to be 100% sure of the NYPD or similar "guns=criminals" type institutions. 

 

 

 

So even if you have a HCP you can't carry a loaded long gun in your vehicle?

 

The unloaded chamber rule makes sense because a number of rifles are not safe when dropped (see hunting safety, 101) and therefore not safe in an auto accident or other scenarios.  Empty chamber is a good rule, IMHO.   While semi-autos are usually safe, its a simple blanket rule rather than make 20 exceptions to it. 

Edited November 13, 2013 by Jonnin