Office Defense

[ZenDog]

I am a psychologist. I work with mentally ill people. I cannot always determine who I work with.

 

One of my colleagues was shot in the face by an angry customer (adverse child custody decision in a divorce). I want to protect myself in the event that someone comes after me. I doubt it will ever happen, but hey... One never knows.

 

I am hoping some of y'all can help me brainstorm some ideas for office defense. 

 

I sit in a nice recliner when I work, My client is about 3 feet away. I am wanting to have some sort of concealed way to access a handgun instantly from my recliner. In my experience, carrying on the body slows weapon accessibility while seated. I might be wrong, but I think there are faster ways to protect oneself in an office.

 

Thoughts? Experience? Ingenious ideas?

 

BTW, I am glad to be back here on this board. I have not posted on TGO for a few years. Life happens.

 

[TripleDigitRide]

Does your recliner have a pocket/pouch on the side? If not, maybe replace the recliner with one that does. I've also seen some with an armrest that folds up for keeping remotes and such.

Edited November 12, 2013 by TripleDigitRide

[East_TN_Patriot]

Perhaps some sort of shoulder holster that you can wear under a dress shirt assuming it's a button-down?  I'd hate to keep it off of my body in case I had to run to my desk or to the receptionist's desk and then have the crap hit the fan.

[dawgdoc]

If I were in your position, I would hate to leave a gun anywhere but in my constant control.  I can just imagine the potential tragedy (and bad press) if an unstable individual managed to find a gun anywhere in your office.  One possible scenario: an angry individual kicks over the chair, and the gun spills out. 

 

If wearing on the body is not feasible, what about one of those concealed carry day planners?  You could always have it in your hand, yet it would look like part of your normal office stuff.  I might feel slightly more comfortable setting down the day planner thing on a side table within easy reach because I could always pick it up if I had to move to another location.

 

If you are a pants and suspender type of person, you could carry a gun on your body and a second one in the day planner.  

[homeagain]

Additional to weapon access you may also consider keeping a barrier handy. In addition to two weapons (one on my person and one stored but accessible) I keep a briefcase handy with a threat level 2 vest folded double as a 'grab-n-go' ballistic barrier.

[c.a.willard]

I'm a big fan of on your person.  day planners, brief cases etc aren't really any faster to draw from than a waste holster and take your mind off of moving, the big thing is being able to move and draw quickly.  The close range that you are describing is all about buying time, milliseconds count.  The more time you can buy yourself the better.  A good start is ensuring that you have a chair that you can get out of quickly, preferably faster than the other guy/gal.  With this being the case i would consider the possibility of switching out your clients to one that slows their ability to get up quickly.  With you being a psychologist i am assuming your familiar with the subtle clues that someone is about to attack.  Another thing to consider is the kind of angle you are at to the client.  I understand you cant go to crazy with angles, otherwise it's off putting to the client, but making things more of an oblique as opposed to more square will make the person have to move more to get a good hit. the average mans arm length is around 32-34 inches, with you being at 3 foot from the client you are in effect immediately within arms reach.  Learn to use this to your benefit and position your body accordingly.  If your right handed keep your left side slightly closer to the client, this allows you to use that left arm to exercise some level of control to include deflection of the bad guys firearm.   Understand there is a possibility beforehand that with a gunfight this close you are likely to be shot, being shot does not equal being killed.  if you can even just deflect the bad guy to a non vital area it still keeps you in the fight.  I would highly suggest avoiding getting shot, but the reality is that your mindset must be prepared for that possibility.  There is obviously much more to winning a fight at close range than the little i have posted, but it is late and i need to sleep.. 

 

Last bit of advise, Suarez International  offers a zero to five feet gun fighting class that i have heard nothing but praise for.  I have not taken it myself it is on my list of classes i need to save up for.  If your interested in their course i would PM Cruel Hand Luke and inquire about availability and course locations.

[peejman]

Given that you'll be seated, the shoulder holster seems like the best option.  Just be careful with muzzle discipline, and practice drawing and re-holstering a lot. 

 

Be very thoughtful about where and how you sit in relation to the client. 

 

I like the ballistic vest inside a briefcase idea.

 

How about an ejector seat for you clients?

[Dane]

At that distance a gun may not be your best initial defence.


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[Joseg]

Taser or get a day planner and insert some sort of heavy metal that you can you use to swing with to create some breathing room. baton?  at that close range, whatever you get it needs to be easily deployable.. 

[tnguy]

Not going to be much time at that distance. I would think step 1 is to have adequate medical supplies on hand and make sure that at least one or two people in the office are trained in first aid. This is probably a good idea in any event.

I like the ideas for barriers. I'm sure someone probably makes desks with flip-up ones or maybe a desk pad with a sheet of steel embedded.

As to a weapon, I'm not sure. On you person seems likely the best bet. It increases access time but it will always be with you. Say if you were in the bathroom or elsewhere in the building and the shooting started... Some of this will be dependent on the layout of your offices and other factors. Of course, nobody says you have to have just one.

Peejman's suggestion of an ejector seat is clearly ridiculous. A button under the desk that opens a trapdoor to a pit of sharks is a much better idea. Edited November 12, 2013 by tnguy

[hipower]

...

Peejman's suggestion of an ejector seat is clearly ridiculous. A button under the desk that opens a trapdoor to a pit of sharks is a much better idea.

Ejector seats? Trapdoors? Come on guys. That's so 90's.

The "Chief" had the best idea. A bulletproof "Cone of Silence" dropping from the ceiling is best.

[thundersnow]

Think bigger picture in terms of containment and access. Be able to keep people safe that don't need to be involved. Making sure you have a fluid plan for your own defense will get you a lot farther. Make sure everyone in your office knows the plan!

In this case with close quarters a gun on your person would be a great second option . If you were creative enough you could mount a taser inside the chair that fires at a would be attacker.

Also consider positioning the furniture in your office so there isn't a direct path to you( they have to walk around something first). Bulletproof Sheetrock can be mounted to the underside of a coffee table very easily. Create cover that is easily accessible.

Others have mentioned the close range gun fighting course. This has been on my todo list for a while!

[Jonnin]

Take notes about the customer in your planner.

 

http://www.nrastore.com/nrastore/ProductDetail.aspx?p=SA+22207&ct=e 

 

One example of such.  I have one, and it has room for a few pages of stuff and generally could sit in your lap as part of the "look".

 

You could also manage a small pistol in a variety of places, under the arm, jacket hidden pocket, or even somehow concealed IN the recliner itself if you are OK with it being "loose" in the room, but if you had to go to the can or something could be a worry.

Edited November 12, 2013 by Jonnin

[JayC]

Not knowing your style of dress...  it's hard to tell you exactly what I'd do...  but I would keep the firearm on your person, not in/on a chair, desk, etc.

[Oh Shoot]

Given that you'll be seated, the shoulder holster seems like the best option. 

 

Shoulder holsters always sound good on paper, but unless you're gonna keep a buttoned up sport coat on all the time, you're gonna see it, will be noticeable even then to astute observer.  Shoulder holsters are at their most cumbersome sitting down.

 

Vertical and horiz models each have their pluses and minuses, but I just don't see that as viable.

 

I'd probably just opt for a pocket pistol, and be thinking more about tactics of getting to your feet in a hurry to deploy it.

 

- OS

[McGarrett]

Welcome back to the forums.

 

Tough spot you are in ZenDog. If your style of dress permits it I think carrying concealed on the body would be best all around for your situation. I keep my SP101 in my desk drawer but I have the L shaped desk between me and the other person so it is a little different scenario. I do not get a lot of visitors in my office generally anyway and as far as I know they are not mentally ill. I would not feel good about having a handgun hidden in the recliner, seems too unsecure and at the same time hard to access quickly depending on how it is hidden. 

 

The briefcase shield is a good idea no matter how you decide to carry or store the handgun.

 

Not sure if I would want to sit in the hotseat across from Thundersnow's recliner mounted taser, shock therapy anyone, just kidding.

 

Do you normally wear a suit or sport jacket? If you do then you may need to search for your ideal carry weapon and holster and just make it part of your daily dress. I have a shoulder holster rig but I very seldom wear a jacket all day so I don't wear it often. Ankle carry is also suited to sitting down so that might be another option, not the best but something to think about. I tend to pocket carry or iwb when carrying during work. The next best idea is the day planner because you can keep it with you and it does not look out of place.

 

+1 for the close quarters handgun training and also having a coordinated plan with your other office staff.

Edited November 12, 2013 by McGarrett

[safeandsecure]

Cross-draw holster?  Have one that works well that I wear while driving ... ... assume it would work well while seated in the office.  'Course, that would mean a suit or jacket if it needed to be covered.  I also wear a shoulder-holster occasionally.  It does take practice and discipline, but is a viable option (again, assuming a suit or jacket is worn).

 

Baton or other suitable close-quarters weapon also seems viable, again, with training and practice.

 

As others have noted, I do not envy your position ...

[ZenDog]

Thanks y'all- there is a lot of food for thought here. I appreciate the time you took to offer your recommendations. I'll keep you posted.

[tnhawk]

Depending on your choice of weapon, an ankle holster might work.

[Oh Shoot]

Depending on your choice of weapon, an ankle holster might work.

 

Another method that always sounds good on paper. :)

 

In practice though, sitting without pant legs riding up,  crossing legs, all while facing someone directly, not so much IMO.

 

Simply tuckable IWB holster always sounds good too, might work with small gun, but again, you have to be rather careful. I experimented with tucking, found could maybe work with mousegun, but nothing much bigger. And slow to get to also.

 

I'm still thinking pocket pistol, with mental prep for a touch of Krav Maga type initial response to give you time to get to it. :)

 

- OS

Edited November 13, 2013 by Oh Shoot

[Dane]

Another method that always sounds good on paper. :)

Simply tuckable IWB holster always sounds good too, might work with small gun, but again, you have to be rather careful. I experimented with tucking, found could maybe work with mousegun, but nothing much bigger. And slow to get to also.
- OS

I can easily hide a glock 26 in a tuckable holster. I am moving all day as well and never been spotted. It does take some practice with dress style and sizing.


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[Spurholder]

On body carry > off body carry, regardless of the situation.

 

For me, AIWB works well - even when seated - with my Glock 19.

[crashgordan]

whatever location you choose to carry in, at this range i would assume one of your arms or hands may be busy holding off your attacker while your other is unholstering a weapon. With that in mind, i have a few thoughts to add to the many excellent thoughts posted here.

as others have noted, an extreme close contact fighting class is a must.

IMHO if i was in your same circumstance, i would NOT be selecting a semi auto pistol. i would choose something along the lines of the ruger LCR in .357
the choice is because of the extreme close contact, the possibility of ANY malfunction must be removed from the equation and only a revolver can reduce that possibility.

the LCR is ultimate point and click. repeat until the threat is stopped. no safety, minimal externally moving parts, no problem.
it is small and easy to conceal.
A revolver will operate in any position, and even if being grappled for (a semi can fire one round and stopped if the slide if being controlled or held. I've done it)
A revolver can also operate when aggressively pushed into the threat. there is no risk of an out of battery failure to fire or failure to feed. This risk is real with any semi auto handgun, even the XD with the standoff device.
The LCR is hammerless allowing it to be fired from deep cover, from a suit jacket pocket or anywhere without risk of clothing or other interference.
the fact that it is hammerless also adds an aspect of decreased legal exposure as is well documented.
A revolver has no safety to manipulate or in any way possible to be set if being grappled with.
in an extreme case where one is physically fighting to retain control of the weapon, a revolver (the entire pistol) can be gripped with both hands and fired. unlike a semi which can only be gripped with one hand with the other hand cupping the strong hand. again, when hands on grappling for control of a semi, the possibility of the semi being held out of battery or out of function is real. To be fair, It is possible to hold the cylinder of a revolver and render it temporarily inoperable.
A revolver loaded with something along the lines of the Hornady Critical Defense round, i would bet my life on it. even the LCR .38

just my thoughts.

and i would consider ankle carry depending on how you sit and cross your legs, etc.
or 5.11 makes an undershirt with a carry holster on the side under the arm. This is very deep carry however and would likely be far to difficulty to access.

tucking a revolver deep into the side cushion of your chair is also an option. in a slip out holster of course.

a lot depends on your body shape and size as well. a lot of unknowns here.

I agree with others, have a conversation with Cruel Hand Luke and get in the class and he may even have some perspective on location of carry or off body options in your office.

best of luck to you and keep us posted.

(i welcome any critical review on my thoughts here, and am open to thoughtful discourse) Edited November 13, 2013 by crashgordan

[chances R]

Not knowing your style of dress...  it's hard to tell you exactly what I'd do...  but I would keep the firearm on your person, not in/on a chair, desk, etc.

This and contact Randy @ Suarez as previously stated.

[tnguy]

the LCR is ultimate point and click. repeat until the threat is stopped. no safety, no externally moving parts, no problem.
it is small and easy to conceal.
A revolver will operate in any position, and even if being grappled for (a semi can fire one round and stopped if the slide if being controlled or held. I've done it)

I just pulled my wife's LCR and if the cylinder is restrained, it will not fire at all. As the rotation is part of the firing, the trigger won't even move back. All my semis will fire at least once.

Not that I'm saying one over the other. Just setting facts straight.