UPDATE: Less than impressed with my 700 accuracy.

[maroonandwhite]

As the title states I am kind of discouraged with the accuracy of my Remington 700 ADL. I realize the cheaper stock probably has something to do with this but I didn't think it would be this bad. I sighted it in at 1.25" high at 50 yards. No problem at all there. That meant it should be about 2.8" high at 100 yards. Again no problem there. It shot within 1/4-1/2" of the mark at both those distances. The problem was when I stretched out to 250. My first two shots were down/left of the bulls eye about 4" and up/right about 4". I let the wife shoot it after that (a pretty good shooter) and she didn't hit the paper either time. I then took one more shot at hit the bottom left outside ring of the target.

 

Feeling discouraged I fired again at the 100 yard mark and hit about 1" away from the first mark fired at 100. I was careful to not pull or flinch on all shots and was shooting from a lead sled.

 

I am hoping this can be corrected with different/better ammo as I am shooting the Remington Core Lokt 100 gr. I would just rather not dump a bunch of money into a stock and bedding right now in order to get it to shoot well if I can help it.

 

I am not opposed to trying to free float the barrel but from what I read online this is not a good idea with the flimsy plastic stock the ADL comes with.

 

Any suggestions?

Edited November 11, 2013 by maroonandwhite

[glock55]

I bought a 700 adl from dicks a while back. I never shot it stock as I intended to convert to a bdl. Bought a bell and Carlson stock and very happy with it. No bedding needed. Have since added timney trigger. Mine has the 26 inch heavy barrel. Very pleased with the results. Highly recommend bell and Carlson stock. Bought stock from red hawk rifles. Very good people to deal with and prices good.

[Hozzie]

I think I would start by replacing the stock as well. The ADL stocks are junk in my opinion.  For me it would be better if they just left them off.   I suspect it isn't the gun, but most likely in this order:

 

1: Stock

2: Loose Scope (although if this was the case, I think you would have been even further off)

3: Ammo

 

There a million different Rem 700 stocks.  Pick a decent on in your price range and I suspect that would help significantly.  I also have some Bell and Carlson and have been happy with them.  You may even find a wood takeoff from someone. 

Edited October 28, 2013 by Hozzie

[maroonandwhite]

I am really liking the look and the price of the Boyd's stocks. For $100 it may be worth a shot if I can't get it worked out with ammo.

 

Is there anything to "breaking in" a barrel? I have never done it on any of the other rifles I owned in the past and have just seen some others saying that may be the issue.

 

Also I may need to get some better scope rings. It came with leupold rifleman series mounts and rings which I though would be sufficient.

[Hozzie]

I am really liking the look and the price of the Boyd's stocks. For $100 it may be worth a shot if I can't get it worked out with ammo.

 

Is there anything to "breaking in" a barrel? I have never done it on any of the other rifles I owned in the past and have just seen some others saying that may be the issue.

 

Also I may need to get some better scope rings. It came with leupold rifleman series mounts and rings which I though would be sufficient.

 

You will get a million different answers on breaking in a barrel.  Some say yes, some say no.  I am in the middle category.  I usually do something like shoot 5, let cool, run a few patches, shoot 5 more, run a few patches.  I do that for about 20 rounds and call it close enough.  If it was a bench gun, I may do a more thorough process, but honestly, I don't think that will have much to do with it in this case.  What caliber is it?

[maroonandwhite]

It's a .243.

 

It's just odd because it shot pretty decent out to 100.

[Hozzie]

If you have or can get some other ammo to try, it is worth it.  I would make sure the scope is tightened down good as well just so there is no concern there.  If that doesn't help, then I think the only logical point of issue is the stock.  It could always just be a gun that doesn't shoot good, but that is a pretty big jump from 100 to 250.  I am guessing the stock is flexing and hitting the barrel at some point.

Edited October 28, 2013 by Hozzie

[maroonandwhite]

Yeah I was going to try 150 but by that time I had just got tired of all the walking haha. My cousin is going to help me with some hand loads so I know that part of the equation is right. After that I may drop $100 on a boyds stock and just use that to get me through the hunting season then maybe get is pillar bedded and glass bedded later on.

[GoneBallistic]

It should get more accurate as you shoot it. Generally as copper builds up in the bore, accuracy increases. I'm no expert, but I've heard this from some very reputable people.

 

I would definitely try some different ammo too. Maybe your rifle just doesn't like the weight/velocity combo of the ammo you're shooting.

 

Also, what kind of glass are you running?

Edited October 28, 2013 by GoneBallistic

[maroonandwhite]

I think in addition to trying hand loads I am going to break down an buy a box of the Winchester silver tips. They have always been pretty consistent for me in past rifles.

[GoneBallistic]

That's what I normally run in my 700 .243. I've heard people say the ballistic tip bullets shatter on impact but I've never had any problems with them on deer.

[gregintenn]

I would check to see that all the screws are tight; stock screws, scope mount and ring screws. I would also clean the barrel well, and adjust the trigger to get a decent pull. The 700 trigger can be adjusted to tolerable from intolerable as they come from the factory.

 

The ammo you are shooting has proven to be as accurate in the several rifles I've fired it in as any I can find, factory or handloaded. Each rifle is different, however, and you may find another brand or weight to be superior in your gun.

 

I've yet to shoot a 700 that didn't shoot well. That being said, I know they do exist.

 

One thing you may want to look at is the shooter. No one wants to think that is the case, but I find that I shoot much better some days than others for no apparent reason.

 

I'd also try a different scope before sinking a lot of money into other options.

 

Good luck with your rifle.

Edited October 28, 2013 by gregintenn

[TMF]

Is there anything to "breaking in" a barrel? I have never done it on any of the other rifles I owned in the past and have just seen some others saying that may be the issue.

Not like this. Yeah, there's a break in process, but I can promise you that has jack to do with a 4ish MOA group at 250m. There's something else going on here and you need to start eliminating potential causes. I would be very surprised if this had anything to do with the actual barrel.

[maroonandwhite]

I'll double check the action screws when I get home and maybe just remove it and re seat it all. I don't have anything to measure torque with so I am just guessing at it. I usually use the short end of the allen wrench and get it tight as I can turn the maybe a quarter turn more.

 

Greg it has the Xmark pro trigger but isn't the externally adjustable one. Should I mess with adjusting it? When I last has the action off it look adjustable but seemed that Remington had put epoxy over the screw.

[gregintenn]

I'll double check the action screws when I get home and maybe just remove it and re seat it all. I don't have anything to measure torque with so I am just guessing at it. I usually use the short end of the allen wrench and get it tight as I can turn the maybe a quarter turn more.

 

Greg it has the Xmark pro trigger but isn't the externally adjustable one. Should I mess with adjusting it? When I last has the action off it look adjustable but seemed that Remington had put epoxy over the screw.

Sorry, I was thinking of the regular 700 trigger. I have never seen an xmark pro trigger, and have no idea how they work.

[maroonandwhite]

Well the newer Xmark Pros have a single allen screw under the trigger for adjustment. The version I have is adjustable but only internally. I think the difference is in the range of adjustment. I believe mine can be adjusted down to dangerous levels whereas the user adjustable one can only go so far. Probably 2-25 lbs.

[jcluff]

I would check to see that all the screws are tight; stock screws, scope mount and ring screws. I would also clean the barrel well, and adjust the trigger to get a decent pull. The 700 trigger can be adjusted to tolerable from intolerable as they come from the factory.

The ammo you are shooting has proven to be as accurate in the several rifles I've fired it in as any I can find, factory or handloaded. Each rifle is different, however, and you may find another brand or weight to be superior in your gun.

I've yet to shoot a 700 that didn't shoot well. That being said, I know they do exist.

One thing you may want to look at is the shooter. No one wants to think that is the case, but I find that I shoot much better some days than others for no apparent reason.

I'd also try a different scope before sinking a lot of money into other options.

Good luck with your rifle.

This.

I have troubleshoot bad bullet placement a lot with a few different guns over the last year or so and have learned that 9 out of 10 times it's one of three things.

First most common for me has been poor rings on my scope or not having them fully tightened down. If there is just a little bit of wiggle, (very little) that can have a few MOA or more effect on bullet placement.

Second, barrel touching the stock or anything else. A poor stock with the resting of the gun near the front end of the stock will cause point of impact to change, usually on the vertical, but sometimes on the horizontal plane. Move you're support up as close as you can to the trigger guard to minimize this effect. It may be that your stock is bending and touching the barrel. As you get frustrated, your groups will open up even more, usually due to muscles pulling heavier on the gun and causing more surface contact with the barrel.

Third, heat. Less of an issue with bolt action, but as you shoot more, the head can cause the barrel to bend ever so slightly in one direction causing your point of impact to drift.

Usually, unless your bullets are not spinning properly, if a bullet is stable at 100 yards, it will likely stay stable at 200 or 300.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[maroonandwhite]

Well I just adjusted on the trigger and man was it worth it. I don't have a trigger pull gauge but it has to be around 2 pounds maybe a little less. I don't want it any lighter. I did all of the safety tests such as slamming the bolt, checking the safety, dropping it on end ,etc. this should take a lot of the shooter deficiency out of the equation for sure. It took longer to take the gun down than to make the adjustment. Edited October 28, 2013 by maroonandwhite

[maroonandwhite]

I ended up moving the pull weight up to 3 lbs just for safeties sake. I figured with cold hands and gloves on it would be a little safer for me and the wife.

 

My plan of action now is to get some Leupold Dual Dovetail bases and rings.

 

Also I sanded the little contact "pads" on the front of this stock down flush. I did not attempt to totally free float the barrel but I do think those pads were putting a little too much pressure on the barrel. It is still supporting the barrel now just not as much pressure.

 

Either way though I have also settled on a Boyd's thumb hole stock for it that I will pillar bed myself.

[DWARREN123]

Make sure it is not the ammo or optics first then stock if you are willing to throw money at it. Many times the problem is really simple or else very complex.

Hope you get running right.

[maroonandwhite]

Update! I got the new Boyd's stock put on which is free floated. I also added Leupold Dual Dovetail mounts and rings so the scope is good and sturdy. After sighting in and letting the barrel cool we were able to hit chemical jugs filled with water at 400 yards consistently! This was with the Core Loct ammo. I'm not sure which of those for sure but honestly I don't much care since it shoots well now. Thanks for all the advice.

[jcluff]

Glad to hear a new stock fixed it for you. A buddy of mine has a howa he put a bipod on and his shot groups seemed erratic. I recommended he pull that off and sand bag it close to the trigger guard. He went from 2-4 inch groups, usually with a lot of vertical spread, to just over 1 inch groups with standard fmj 150gr ammo. I am curious if your old stock just needed a little work to get it to fully free float or if it was just to weak to hold the barrel up off of it. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Edited November 12, 2013 by jcluff

[maroonandwhite]

The old stock was really flimsy plastic. I actually tried to free float it but once I removed enough material it wasn't stout enough to keep the barrel from hitting it just from gravity alone.

[deadeye111]

I have used business card stock under the recoil lug on Remington 700 thick enough to free float barrel to see if uneven pressure on barrel is part or all of the problem.

[KahrMan]

Update! I got the new Boyd's stock put on which is free floated. I also added Leupold Dual Dovetail mounts and rings so the scope is good and sturdy. After sighting in and letting the barrel cool we were able to hit chemical jugs filled with water at 400 yards consistently! This was with the Core Loct ammo. I'm not sure which of those for sure but honestly I don't much care since it shoots well now. Thanks for all the advice.

 

That is great to hear.  Boyds puts out a great stock.