raising cattle?

[broylz]

i remember buying a half cow for almost half the price as what im currently seeing today just a couple years ago. that got me thinking about raising a cow or two. my issue now is that i live in town but i have my horses boarded in a 25 acre pasture by themselves a few miles away and am unsure if i could talk the owner into letting me keep a cow or two with my horses... that said, i do plan on buying 10-25 acres in the next couple or three years so this could end up mostly research.

 

is there anything that says i have to raise cattle in multiples? do they do better that way? would a cow or two with my horses cause any problems? im not a total city boy so i think i may be asking questions that are too simple but why not...

 

whats the average age and weight of beef cattle when raised and butchered?

 

would they do ok on the same grass pasture that keeps my horses fat with no grain? i know they are natural grazing animals but i do see a lot of different grain fed vs grass fed beef adds and don't know enough about the difference.

[enfield]

The last few calves I've bought were butchered at 700-1200 lbs.  You get bigger and better steaks out of the bigger steers.  Beef from the smaller ones is good, but there's no fat.

[Wiljo05]

Pasture is fine, but a month before slaughter you def want to go all grain. It increases fat and marbling in the muscle. If the number of animals exceed what the pasture can support, you have to buy hay. Most horses are finicky and won't eat or don't like to any way, your run if the mill mixed grass hay. They will prefer alfalfa or Bermuda, and while the cows will love it, it's gonna be expensive to support them on "horse" hay

[Guest dmarcin]

We raised cows and horses together for years with out a problem. The key is good water source and most important good fences. We fed the horses the same hay the cows ate, although we did feed the horses some grain every Now and then. Cows will manage by themselves but you need to check on the horses daily. Once again good fences are a must? It is advisable to grain feed the cows you plan to butcher to improve the meet. That being said grass only fed beef is really good also.

[TerryW]

Good fences are a good idea but we don't have much problem with an stock wanting to wander if they have plenty of food.  We also feed grain for good beef and because it'll help get the poo plies to go away too.  The birds come an pick through the poo for the undigested grain.  The poo is then scattered by the birds and goes away much faster. Our pastures looked really clean for the amount of livestock we had.

[TMF]

Good fences are a good idea but we don't have much problem with an stock wanting to wander if they have plenty of food. We also feed grain for good beef and because it'll help get the poo plies to go away too. The birds come an pick through the poo for the undigested grain. The poo is then scattered by the birds and goes away much faster. Our pastures looked really clean for the amount of livestock we had.

Before 15 years ago when my family started breeding in butt heads ours were terrible about tearing up old fencing with their horns to get to the greener grass on the other side. No matter where we'd put 'em, they'd always want what was on the other side of the fence. Every so often they'd bust a hole in the fence and get out. Now none of them have horns, so no breakouts.

[TerryW]

TMF Oh, that's not good.  We really didn't have much problem at all.  We did have a mare that always wanted on the other side of the fence.  We took her to sale barn after she, with her colt escaped and stayed in the road the whole time she was out. 

[Guest tdoccrossvilletn]

[quote name="broylz" post="1039935" timestamp="1380275262"] i remember buying a half cow for almost half the price as what im currently seeing today just a couple years ago. that got me thinking about raising a cow or two. my issue now is that i live in town but i have my horses boarded in a 25 acre pasture by themselves a few miles away and am unsure if i could talk the owner into letting me keep a cow or two with my horses... that said, i do plan on buying 10-25 acres in the next couple or three years so this could end up mostly research. is there anything that says i have to raise cattle in multiples? do they do better that way? would a cow or two with my horses cause any problems? im not a total city boy so i think i may be asking questions that are too simple but why not... whats the average age and weight of beef cattle when raised and butchered? would they do ok on the same grass pasture that keeps my horses fat with no grain? i know they are natural grazing animals but i do see a lot of different grain fed vs grass fed beef adds and don't know enough about the difference.[/quote] Horses and cattle require different minerals. Also Alfalfa hay that's okay for horses should not be feed to cattle in quantity because it can cause them to bloat. Two cows in heat will try and ride each other, the horses, and you if there aren't multiple cows. Take this advice from someone like me that helped his dad on a 70 acre 35 head cattle farm. We sell 17 freezer beefs a year at 1.48 a pound live weight. Its dress between 60-64% average dressing is 50-55%. The general rule for pastures is one cow calf pair per acre and a half. That's usually what they can sustain. Vaccinate and worm them every 6 months. If you don't they will eventually get sick and die. Keep them out of the mud as much as possible they can develop foot rot. We keep the freezer beefs up and feed them Bermuda hay and 50% cracked corn 50% corn gluten feed for about 60-90 days. They usually are slaughtered at around 11 months old and weigh 1000-1200 pounds. We don't use antibiotics on the freezer beefs but do vaccinate and worm them. This keeps them from getting sick so antibiotics don't have to be used. We also dont use growth hormones. Like horses cattle are prone to founder if they are fed to much protein. Our mineral mix and feed ration were developed by dr Warren Gill for tn cattle. He used to be the animal nutritionist at UT. We raise embryo calves and breeding stock we have expensive cattle that perform well. We select bulls with carcass traits. Our animals are also very gentle. This equates to more tender meat. Tn cattle business magazine did a featured farm article on us in reference to our operation, the docility of our cattle and how it equates to the business of selling freezer beef. So I'm not just some feller that read about raising cattle in the internet I've got first hand knowledge and experience. You will need some sort of place to pen the cattle and load them. Also to vaccinate and worm them. You can get some posts and a head catcher pretty cheap. Its what we used until we could afford a sweep shoot with squeeze chute and automatic head gate. Also if you take and complete the tn master beef producer and beef quality assurance course the state will do a 50% cost share on genetics, and equipment like waterers, chutes, corals, even hay barns. We have a heifer right now being shown today at the kansas.city royale next month at Loiusville and then in January at Denver. We do know our stuff when it comes to cattle. I think in your case you should get 700-800 pound steers. Leave them on pasture, feed them good hay, and start grain feeding them about 90 days prior to slaughter. DO NOT DO NOT DO NOT BUY ANYTHING FROM THE SALE BARN. THAT'S WHERE EVERYONE TAKES THEIR CULLS. YOU WILL WIND UP WITH SICKNESS OR WITH ISSUES. Personally, if it were me id go with a continental breed crossed with Angus. This will give you higher dressing percentage than regular straight bred Angus without sacrificing meat quality. My picks in order according to best and least are as follows SalersxAngus cross Salers are big framed and the highest marbling continental breed out there and are very gentle. They got a bad rep back in the seventies but the meanness has been culled out of them. CharloisxAngus Charlois are the second highest marbling continental breed. Gelbvieh X Angus LimousinXAngus Sent from my mind using ninja telepathy. Edited October 26, 2013 by tdoccrossvilletn

[TMF]

TMF Oh, that's not good. We really didn't have much problem at all. We did have a mare that always wanted on the other side of the fence. We took her to sale barn after she, with her colt escaped and stayed in the road the whole time she was out.

It was funny to see the "grass is always greener" behavior. We have a 6-7 acre barnyard adjacent to the front yard of the house. We use the barnyard for a nursery for mom and calf for a few months. While in the barnyard you'll see mom sticking her snout through the holes in the fence to get at the grass in the front yard. About once a week we let them into the front yard to mow the grass down and you'll see them back at the fence after a few hours trying to get at the grass on the barnyard side of the fence. I figured that's where the "grass is always greener" saying came from.

[Guest tdoccrossvilletn]

We raised cows and horses together for years with out a problem. The key is good water source and most important good fences. We fed the horses the same hay the cows ate, although we did feed the horses some grain every Now and then. Cows will manage by themselves but you need to check on the horses daily. Once again good fences are a must? It is advisable to grain feed the cows you plan to butcher to improve the meet. That being said grass only fed beef is really good also.

Incorrect

Calving cows need to be checked twice a day for problems. Steers out on pasture once a day would probably suffice.

Sent from my mind using ninja telepathy.

[Guest tdoccrossvilletn]

The best way to get good gaining steers or cattle is the following. 1. Docility, the gentler and more calm the animal the better the beef. Its a proven non disputable fact. 2. Get calves from bulls that have been ultrasounded for carcass traits. For example our bulls all had over 17 inch ribeye areas at a year old. 3. You want calves that gain weight fast. Thus, pick some out of a bull that's been on feed test and performed well. All of our bulls gained over 4 pounds per day on test. Thus is translated to their offspring. Sent from my mind using ninja telepathy. Edited October 26, 2013 by tdoccrossvilletn

[Jonnin]

The best way to get good gaining steers or cattle is the following.

1. Docility, the gentler and more calm the animal the better the beef. Its a proven non disputable fact.

 

i wonder if that is why the legendary japanese beef cattle are kept drunk.... ?

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Old gramps in central AL was retired by the time I came along, kept maybe a dozen cattle, didn't raise any corn or dirt crops any more, but he would mow hay every fall and have it baled or turned into some kind of feed to feed the cattle in cold months.

I don't recall him working a lot of hours keeping up the cows, but he would spend some time each and every day keeping them up. Can't recall details, but maybe an hour at the crack of dawn then some other activities in the afternoon or evening. Then occasionally load one up in his falling-apart ancient truck to drive to montgomery and sell for spending money.

Dunno nothin about it, but if that was typical it would seem a hassle to keep cows somewhere one doesn't live, and commute twice a day for the few minutes of morning and evening upkeep? Especially saturdays and sundays? Edited October 26, 2013 by Lester Weevils

[Guest tdoccrossvilletn]

[quote name="Jonnin" post="1054140" timestamp="1382798778"] i wonder if that is why the legendary japanese beef cattle are kept drunk.... ?[/quote] Probably so although I think wagyu are natrually docile cattle. Plus beer is cheaper than grain. Hell they also have massage parties for them where they massage the carcass. Sent from my mind using ninja telepathy. Edited October 26, 2013 by tdoccrossvilletn

[Guest tdoccrossvilletn]

Not to hijack the thread but on a side note I know I mentioned earlier we had a heifer showing at Kansas City Yesterday. Well she won her division. This is good for a small fish in a big pond. Its one of largest livestock shows in America. Next up is North American Livestock.Exposition in Louisville Kentucky which is even bigger than Kansas City.

Sent from my mind using ninja telepathy.

[Guest tdoccrossvilletn]

[quote name="Lester Weevils" post="1054174" timestamp="1382803393"] Old gramps in central AL was retired by the time I came along, kept maybe a dozen cattle, didn't raise any corn or dirt crops any more, but he would mow hay every fall and have it baled or turned into some kind of feed to feed the cattle in cold months. I don't recall him working a lot of hours keeping up the cows, but he would spend some time each and every day keeping them up. Can't recall details, but maybe an hour at the crack of dawn then some other activities in the afternoon or evening. Then occasionally load one up in his falling-apart ancient truck to drive to montgomery and sell for spending money. Dunno nothin about it, but if that was typical it would seem a hassle to keep cows somewhere one doesn't live, and commute twice a day for the few minutes of morning and evening upkeep? Especially saturdays and sundays?[/quote] Our farm is four miles away from my parents home. That's not to terribly far. Sent from my mind using ninja telepathy. Edited October 27, 2013 by tdoccrossvilletn

[Guest Riciticky]

I don't know anything about cattle. After reading this thread, I found out that I know less than I thought I did. Good luck with your project.

[Guest tdoccrossvilletn]

I don't know anything about cattle. After reading this thread, I found out that I know less than I thought I did. Good luck with your project.

On some stuff I'm a walking encyclopedia. On other things I'm totally clue less.

Sent from my mind using ninja telepathy.

[Luke E.]

I grew up on a dairy farm more or less and what ol' TD has said it pretty true.... If you don't mind spending top dollar and quitting your job to devote all your time to taking care of them and making sure they stay calm... all this in the name of saving some money and getting decent beef.. right? Not that way you won't. I have no doubt that they are producing good meat but sheesh. Every cow I ever had anything to do with that I ate was a Jersey steer that was castrated young and left to graze for the most part and switched to grain as it neared end. It may not have been acceptable meat for a restaurant that charges $100+ for a steak but it usually beat out anything you could buy in a grocery store. My point is, don't let all this stuff above scare anyone away from raising a cow for beef, do a little homework if you want but best advice it to find someone local that raises some and ask questions because most will be happy to steer you in the right direction. It's pretty rewarding although I haven't done so in some years but we've been talking about it lately. 

 

 One thing I completely agree with TDC on is staying away from the sale barn for cattle you plan to eat. The guys that buy, sell and trade there know exactly what they are doing where as most folks don't so just find a farmer and buy a calf or young steer.