Zimmerman Trial: Verdict Reached!

[TripleDigitRide]

Hey, we're all assuming around here. If someone has a difficult time basing their opinions on the law, common sense and logic, I can't help but question their ability to raise children and own guns. My opinion is no more or less personal than your opinion is of Zimmerman. He just happens to not be here to read what some of you are assuming about him.

You're right, he isn't. If he were I'd have no problem explaining to him where he went wrong and would love for him to fill in the knowledge gaps that were not cleared up in the trial. But he isn't here.



I am here though and so are you. You just made an accusation on how I raise my kids simply because I believe Zimmerman went looking for trouble. That is a personal attack from you to me for no other reason than having a different opinion to you. It is so incredibly transparent to anyone reading your statement. I can tell you that you are wrong on how I raise my children and I am disgusted that you would stoop to such a low. Absolutely disgusted.

It wasn't a personal attack at all. I was attempting to prove just how ridiculous one's opinion can sometimes be. I guess it worked. I'm sure you're a fine parent.

[KKing]

Some of you blow my mind. Please let me get this straight, because Zimmerman exited his vehicle, he deserved (and should have taken without using his firearm) to get his head bashed against concrete until his brains spilled out?



It sure sounds like some here don't have a very strong conviction to preserve life, only about taking life. By that standard, why do you carry a firearm? Do you think it's always going to be someone of legal age, stronger, and bigger that will put you in fear for your life and they will always have a weapon of some sort? Please, help me understand.



I carry a firearm knowing full well I may have to take someone's life some day. They may be "unarmed", they may be underage. But, if they put me in imminent fear of my life, I will be forced to take theirs.

The problem is that folks like yourself will read words but only interpret what you want to believe, not the intent of the author. No one can help you with that problem except for yourself.



Did Zimmerman deserve to get his head smashed in for getting out of his truck? The statement you made suggests I think it was a punitive action by using the word "deserve". No, of course he doesn't "deserve" that at all. Just like someone who BASE jumps off a cliff doesn't deserve to smack into the side of the mountain and die in a terrible heap on impact, but that is a very likely outcome when you engage in such activities, and I'm not going to feel bad for them.



Does someone "deserve" to get AIDS because they shared a needle while injecting themselves with heroin? No, but they don't deserve my sympathy. Does someone "deserve" to get breast cancer? No, but that person absolutely will get my sympathy. You see how that works?



We all make choices in life and have to live with those choices. When you make bad choices you have to deal with the outcomes. Life is really that simple.

Let's see if I can say this a little better. Some people on here (I don't know if it's you specifically, because I really don't care) have suggested that because Zimmerman exited his vehicle that he was "looking for trouble". As if him getting his head beat against concrete is in direct correlation with exiting his vehicle, it is not. Assuming it was somehow his fault Trayvon got on top of him simply because he exited his vehicle, that he brought it on himself, is wrong. That's placing zero responsibility in the altercation on the Trayvon side

Now, to play to your examples, Trayvon jumped a guy and beat his head into concrete causing said guy to pull the trigger and defend his life. Yes, I understand cause and effect very well, just not some people's skewed view of it Edited July 14, 2013 by KKing

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Strategically thinking, he would have had a lot better chance of defending his little brother behind a locked door, with the heat on the phone (if that were the possible intent to confront). 

 

What you say sounds reasonable, or at least arguable. Just not enough data. Like the many times I've toted heavy tool X to light workpiece Y, when if I'd been thinking straight it would have been the other way around. :)

[leroy]

We've wasted lots of bandwith here on the "what if's" all this.  Some of it pretty well reasoned and some of it childish and onesided; but that is the nature of things pretty much everywhere.   There are several things that are for sure here:

1.   Mind your business (...Z-Man, stay in your truck,  Dear sweet Trayvon, dont beat that "creepy a**ed cracker" followin me down, bro...).

2.   If you have an encounter be careful and courteous; your inquisitor could be armed and he may, in fact, know how to shoot.   Dont be in the business of teaching leasons to anyone.  The lesson might go wrong.

3.  Choices in life have consequences.  Some of them can be life-changing, some life-ending.  We all know how that one worked out.

4.   The "tribal ones" and "race baters" will never be placated nor will they they be appeased.   That's the one everyone needs to think about a bit.   No amount of law, verdict, nor facts will convince the "race-bating" community and their childish followers that justice has been served any time there is a black-white conflagration.   Everyone needs to think about that one a bit. 

 

We have had six years of the post-civil war reconstruction redux here, a president that opined that "...if he had a son he would look like Trayvon...", an  US attorney general that mounted and facilitated a witch-hunt to take a "cracker"s scalp using your and my money to do so, a morally and ethically bankrupt bunch of carpet baggers and "crackers" in the florida state government that sought to make political hay from the death of a young man and a little old man who had to shoot him to keep from gettin killed, a bunch of dispicable parents that cravenly tradmarked "Trayvon" and "Justice for Trayvon", presuably to go into the business of profiting from their son's death, a high profile black lawyer callin in favors from the state, federal, and race baiting movers and shakers to get his way in a malicious prosecution in a self-defense case; the list goes on and on...

 

My take away from all this is that there are more places where we are more divided than ever and no amount of talk is gonna fix it.  The race baiters and their sickening political allies have done their jobs well.  This country has been balkanized, and more and more folks fully understand that.  They are retreating to their homes and arming themselves, and for good reason.   They cant trust their neighbors (...in some locations...), they cant trust government for obvious reasons, and the list goes on and on.  We are living in precarious times.

 

leroy

Edited July 14, 2013 by leroy

[DaveTN]

And there is any evidence to support that theory, that Zimmerman chased him down, that a fit 17 year old could not outrun a pudgy "pussy"?  If Treyvon was in fear, the adrenalin would have allowed him to get to his home a lot quicker than Zimmerman, no way the young man could not out quick the old guy.

Correct. Duty to retreat on the part of an innocent person that had a right to be there? Should have run home, should have called 911, and should have done anything but engage his attacker?
However… I concede. A jury of his peers put their stamp of approval on what he did. All I asked for was that he get a fair trial; that happened.

[Guest nra37922]

Time to move on.

 

GZ was thankfully found NOT GUILTY.  Take what lessons you want from what happened based upon your personal opinion/belief and deal with it. 

 

Race Haters need to go find another non-black on black crime to whine about cause they sure don't worry about black on black or black on non black crimes.  Already Al Charlatan is stirring up a DOJ Civil Rights case.

[TMF]

[
Let's see if I can say this a little better. Some people on here (I don't know if it's you specifically, because I really don't care) have suggested that because Zimmerman exited his vehicle that he was "looking for trouble". As if him getting his head beat against concrete is in direct correlation with exiting his vehicle, it is not. Assuming it was somehow his fault Trayvon got on top of him simply because he exited his vehicle, that he brought it on himself, is wrong. That's placing zero responsibility in the altercation on the Trayvon side



Now, to play to your examples, Trayvon jumped a guy and beat his head into concrete causing said guy to pull the trigger and defend his life. Yes, I understand cause and effect very well, just not some people's skewed view of it

Did he only get out of his truck? Seems to me that if that's all he did then the unprovoked assault from Martin would have taken place within arms length of his truck, right?

And I don't think I have claimed that Martin is innocent of any wrongdoing. For all I know behind that scaaaaaary photo of him flipping a bird is a hardened criminal that beats up whites for breakfast and curb stomps Hispanics for dinner. Hell, that might explain all the media confusion.

No, my issue with Zimmerman is mainly from a HCP holder perspective in regard to what you do and don't do when you're strapped. Carrying a gun doesn't make you suddenly invincible. Much of his defense was spent building an image of him being a meek rolly polly, yet he decided to pursue someone he thought was a suspicious man on drugs??? That doesn't compute. So either he is a brave brawler, or he was emboldened by his carry piece. That is the crux of my problem, and part of how I formed my opinion on his state of mind when he stepped out of his truck.

[45guy]

Maybe you all heard something I did not. I listened to the 911 call while Z was out walking around, it did not sound like he was running or trying to chase someone down. He was talking calmly about what was going on. When did the chasing take place?

[jgradyc]

Mistakes were made by all parties...

 

GZ: Never lose situational awareness. Don't follow suspect into a dark walkway. Identify yourself assertively, ie: I'm neighborhood watch, what are you doing here?"

 

TM: Don't let getting dissed or wanting to do something to brag to your girlfriend to cause you to do something really stupid. Don't start a confrontation.

 

Parents: Teach kids that actions have consequences. Ground your kid when he gets suspended. TM was suspended THREE TIMES. Take away his phone. Get both of you into a counseling program.  TM had missed 53 school days and it was only February... what kind of parent lets their kid get away with this?

 

Teach your kids when followed by a stranger.... 1) Run away  2) get to a safe place 3) tell an adult 4) tell a police officer 5) call 911 6) run home and lock the door and call someone.

 

There seems to be a huge amount of discussion about TM and GZ, while disregarding the role (a lack of) parenting played in creating this tragedy.

Edited July 14, 2013 by jgradyc

[charlessummers]

Nope...since his use of SD deadly force was justified he is immune from civil suits; same as we here in TN

Until King Hussein Obama gets involved.

[45guy]

Did he only get out of his truck? Seems to me that if that's all he did then the unprovoked assault from Martin would have taken place within arms length of his truck, right?

And I don't think I have claimed that Martin is innocent of any wrongdoing. For all I know behind that scaaaaaary photo of him flipping a bird is a hardened criminal that beats up whites for breakfast and curb stomps Hispanics for dinner. Hell, that might explain all the media confusion.

No, my issue with Zimmerman is mainly from a HCP holder perspective in regard to what you do and don't do when you're strapped. Carrying a gun doesn't make you suddenly invincible. Much of his defense was spent building an image of him being a meek rolly polly, yet he decided to pursue someone he thought was a suspicious man on drugs??? That doesn't compute. So either he is a brave brawler, or he was emboldened by his carry piece. That is the crux of my problem, and part of how I formed my opinion on his state of mind when he stepped out of his truck.

I do not think Z was a brawler or emboldened by having his gun. I really do not think he thought there would be a confrontation. Many times the best way to keep someone from doing something illegal is for them to think they are being watched. Most of the time the person being watched goes on about his business knowing he was doing nothing wrong or they move on to a different location where they are not being watched. I have done this many times with shoplifters or those I thought were shoplifting.

[East_TN_Patriot]

I find it interesting that people want to convict GZ for wrongdoing because he originally followed TM while talking to the 911 dispatcher even though he stopped following him after being told to do so and told the dispatcher that he would meet the police next to his truck, but these same people don't place any blame on TM who did not call the police even though he had a cell phone in his hand and didn't continue to run to the home where he was staying upon seeing a "creepy ass cracker" following him.  Instead, he approached GZ from behind as he walked back to his car, started a confrontation, and struck GZ in the face breaking his nose.  Even then, TM did not disengage, but stayed on the offensive while GZ was on the ground and started beating his head onto the concrete.  With all of that, people want to blame GZ for choosing not to stay in his truck and say that is the whole reason this happened.  TM had multiple opportunities to avoid this confrontation, but he chose to go on the offensive as a man walked away from him.  Whether GZ's original suspicion was reasonable or not, whether his effort to keep TM in view while the police responded was wise or not, neither of these are justification for being attacked from behind, or attacked at all.  

If you would instantaneously go on the offensive with an aggressive physical attack just because someone is following you, then you are likely to find yourself dead or in the defendant's seat following the incident.

For interested folks, here is the blog post I wrote about the verdict:

The Zimmerman Verdict: Has Justice Been Served?

Edited July 14, 2013 by East_TN_Patriot

[tnhawk]

........  TM had missed 53 school days and it was only February... what kind of parent lets their kid get away with this?

........There seems to be a huge amount of discussion about TM and GZ, while disregarding the role (a lack of) parenting played in creating this tragedy.

 

Someone should have told TM there are better ways to prepare for "aeronautic school" than missing school and getting high.

[TMF]

I find it interesting that people want to convict GZ for wrongdoing because he originally followed TM while talking to the 911 dispatcher even though he stopped following him after being told to do so and told the dispatcher that he would meet the police next to his truck, but these same people don't place any blame on TM who did not call the police even though he had a cell phone in his hand and didn't continue to run to the home where he was staying upon seeing a "creepy ass cracker" following him. Instead, he approached GZ from behind as he walked back to his car, started a confrontation, and struck GZ in the face breaking his nose. Even then, TM did not disengage, but stayed on the offensive while GZ was on the ground and started beating his head onto the concrete. With all of that, people want to blame GZ for choosing not to stay in his truck and say that is the whole reason this happened. TM had multiple opportunities to avoid this confrontation, but he chose to go on the offensive as a man walked away from him. Whether GZ's original suspicion was reasonable or not, whether his effort to keep TM in view while the police responded was wise or not, neither of these are justification for being attacked from behind, or attacked at all.


If you would instantaneously go on the offensive with an aggressive physical attack just because someone is following you, then you are likely to find yourself dead or in the defendant's seat following the incident.

There is a large enough time gap from when Zimmerman told the operator he was no longer following Martin to the time the altercation was reported by a caller to 911. A large enough time gap by several times over for GZ to have made his way back to his truck. If he wasn't running or immediately returned to his truck he wouldn't have been more than a couple steps from his vehicle by the time he got off the phone with the dispatcher. This is why I do not believe he was returning to his truck when the altercation happened.

And no, TM doesn't get a pass either if in the same amount of time he could have reached his doorstep or called 911 himself. But he is dead, so it is hard to hold him accountable for his role. At any rate, George was older and more mature, in theory, and knew that he had a gun on him. When you carry a gun you don't go looking for trouble with a plan to use it when you find it.

[Guest Emtdaddy1980]

At the end of the day, its sad that a young MAN is dead because he chose a wrong path. I was a little bit of a punk when I was 17, as I'm sure a lot of us were. But as I've stated before I wouldn't have hesitated to defend myself had I been in Zs shoes. I think that Z made some mistakes leading up to the confrontation, but none of those mistakes negated his right to self preservation once he was physically assaulted. Rather than attempting to retry the case amongst ourselves, why not focus on the lessons we can take away from it for ourselves and our children.

[Guest ThePunisher]

If we can learn anything from this Zimmerman trial spectacle, it's that "Barack the Healer" of racial tensions only helped make the racial divide even wider with his politicizing this tragic event.

[Guest nra37922]

If we can learn anything from this Zimmerman trial spectacle, it's that "Barack the Healer" of racial tensions only helped make the racial divide even wider with his politicizing this tragic event.

And did you really expect anything different?

[RobertNashville]

Until King Hussein Obama gets involved.

They've already been involved and did what was described by many as an exhaustive investigation and found nothing.  Further, not only does Zimmerman's background not show him to have any racial tendencies, it shows exactly the opposite (which is one of the reasons the prosecution didn't want those facts to make it into evidence).

Now of course, with the likes of Obama and Holder in officer who knows what they might do...one can never say "never" with thugs like them; but at the end of the day, Obama is a pretty smart politician and I think he likely believes that going after Zimmerman now after already doing a DOJ investigation that exonerated him of civil rights violations would be a pretty dumb political move.

[DaveTN]

Obama is a pretty smart politician and I think he likely believes that going after Zimmerman now after already doing a DOJ investigation that exonerated him of civil rights violations would be a pretty dumb political move.

 

What’s he care about a political move; he has zero at risk?

[RobertNashville]

I find it interesting that people want to convict GZ for wrongdoing because he originally followed TM while talking to the 911 dispatcher even though he stopped following him after being told to do so and told the dispatcher that he would meet the police next to his truck, but these same people don't place any blame on TM who did not call the police even though he had a cell phone in his hand and didn't continue to run to the home where he was staying upon seeing a "creepy ass cracker" following him.  Instead, he approached GZ from behind as he walked back to his car, started a confrontation, and struck GZ in the face breaking his nose.  Even then, TM did not disengage, but stayed on the offensive while GZ was on the ground and started beating his head onto the concrete.  With all of that, people want to blame GZ for choosing not to stay in his truck and say that is the whole reason this happened.  TM had multiple opportunities to avoid this confrontation, but he chose to go on the offensive as a man walked away from him.  Whether GZ's original suspicion was reasonable or not, whether his effort to keep TM in view while the police responded was wise or not, neither of these are justification for being attacked from behind, or attacked at all.  

If you would instantaneously go on the offensive with an aggressive physical attack just because someone is following you, then you are likely to find yourself dead or in the defendant's seat following the incident.

For interested folks, here is the blog post I wrote about the verdict:

The Zimmerman Verdict: Has Justice Been Served?

It's always pretty damn easy to judge someone's actions after the fact...I would agree that it would have been smarter for Zimmerman to stay in his vehicle but some here keep repeating that like am religious mantra; as if it has magical powers...know one here can know that Martin wouldn't have attacked Zimmerman anyway while he was in his vehicle (and seatbelted in a vehicle is a lousy place from which to defend yourself).

 

More to the point, however, there are some here who simply will not accept the facts, evidence and testimony; they'll go right on believing that Zimmerman was guilty or manslaughter or take the legally ridiculous position that his use of deadly force to for self defense was legally justified but should be "punished" anyway.

 

I'm happy for Zimmerman....I have sympathy for Martins parents and that a young man's life cut short but I have a feeling that Trayvon was heading for and end like this whether he had ever met up with Zimmerman or not like so many young black (and white) men in our society today.

[RobertNashville]

What’s he care about a political move; he has zero at risk?

Just conjecture on my part but I think he does have something to risk and nothing to gain...I'm sure that after he leaves office he's going to want to be very involved with politics and the party, especially given his young age and I think his standing in the party could be at risk because his party has a lot to risk.

 

There isn't much of anything a black Democrat can do to garner more votes or lose votes among blacks since blacks vote upwards of 95% Democrat so going after or not going after Zimmerman now isn't going to have much of an impact there but they can most certainly lose votes of other voting blocks if they are perceived as being raciest or vindictive; especially among young whites.

 

Is that a guarantee? Not at all but since they've done an investigation already and couldn't find anything I doubt they could win in court even if they did try to charge Zimmerman with something now.

Edited July 14, 2013 by RobertNashville

[Guest ThePunisher]

Now of course, with the likes of Obama and Holder in officer who knows what they might do...one can never say "never" with thugs like them; but at the end of the day, Obama is a pretty smart politician and I think he likely believes that going after Zimmerman now after already doing a DOJ investigation that exonerated him of civil rights violations would be a pretty dumb political move.

Can only conjure up images of "Dumb and Dumber".

[MattCary]

Someone should have told TM there are better ways to prepare for "aeronautic school" than missing school and getting high.

 

Worked out pretty good for the current President.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

They've already been involved and did what was described by many as an exhaustive investigation and found nothing.  Further, not only does Zimmerman's background not show him to have any racial tendencies, it shows exactly the opposite (which is one of the reasons the prosecution didn't want those facts to make it into evidence).

Now of course, with the likes of Obama and Holder in officer who knows what they might do...one can never say "never" with thugs like them; but at the end of the day, Obama is a pretty smart politician and I think he likely believes that going after Zimmerman now after already doing a DOJ investigation that exonerated him of civil rights violations would be a pretty dumb political move.

 

The media is so inaccurate that it can't be trusted, but on the TV last night they were saying the DOJ investigation had been put on hold awaiting the outcome of the trial, rather than case closed with no evidence.

 

I'm not rooting for this corrupt admin to involve itself in this mess, but will not be surprised if they do so. On the other hand, the only thing that would surprise me from this admin is some wisdom, on ANY issue.

[knewcomb]

If they do bring this to trial as a civil rights case, the division in our country right now will be nothing. Hopefully they will have some "wisdom".