Weed, fights and guns: Trayvon Martin’s text messages released

[Lumber_Jack]

what's goin to be the "clincher" closing argument? (ala: "if the glove doesn't fit, you must acquit")

I honestly think it was yesterday when O'mara used the Prosecutions dummy and started bashing its head on the court floor.

[Sam1]

Has to be one of the best headlines I've seen in a while:

 

[Randall53]

What seems to have been ignored throughout this fiasco.....If this community is so small...(the prosecutor said only 3 small streets?) why didn't TM just run on home if he thought he was being followed?  Seems to me he doubled back to confront and attack the "Cracker" that was "following" him? This would also support the claim that TM took all the time in the world to circle GZ's truck and wait for a chance to attack him? I also don't understand the talk about a "phantom bush" that the prosecution mentiond and that GZ talked about.  In the video I saw, there was shrubs and bushes along every residence big enough to hide behind on a dark and rainy night.

Edited July 12, 2013 by Randall53

[DaveS]

What seems to have been ignored throughout this fiasco.....If this community is so small...(the prosecutor said only 3 small streets?) why didn't TM just run on home if he thought he was being followed?  Seems to me he doubled back to confront and attack the "Cracker" that was "following" him? This would also support the claim that TM took all the time in the world to circle GZ's truck and wait for a chance to attack him? I also don't understand the talk about a "phantom bush" that the prosecution mentiond and that GZ talked about.  In the video I saw, there was shrubs and bushes along every residence big enough to hide behind on a dark and rainy night.

Why should TM "run home"? He had absolutely no duty to retreat. Why does everyone keep saying he should run?

Zman said TM was running. What more do ya'll want?

Edited July 12, 2013 by DaveS

[Randall53]

Why should TM "run home"? He had absolutely no duty to retreat. Why does everyone keep saying he should run?

Zman said TM was running. What more do ya'll want?

 

Because everyone is saying GM should have stayed in his truck.  He had no duty to do that either.  Both had the right to be where they were. It's just as correct to say TM should have went directly to the place he was staying even if he hadn't felt he was being followed by a "creepy assed Cracker". He certainly should not have circled back to and walked around GM's truck then went to find a place to hide behind some shrubs to ambush him, if he got out of it, as it is to say GM should have stayed in his truck. If either had happened the event would not have taken place.

[Hozzie]

Why should TM "run home"? He had absolutely no duty to retreat. Why does everyone keep saying he should run?

Zman said TM was running. What more do ya'll want?

 

I think if you are going to say that Zman "should" have stayed in his car, then you can absolutely say that TM "should" have ran home.  Fact is, Zman "could" have stayed in his car and this may have been averted <OR> TM "could" have ran home and this may have been averted.  Fact is, neither of them did what they "could" or "should" have.  They both have equal blame on that front.  In the end it doesn't matter what they could or should have done.  There was an altercation, Zman was fearful for his life (I do believe this although it could be argued and that is why there is the case) and ultimately he killed TM.  No matter who could have, should have, or would have done anything, I don't believe the prosecution has proven any other scenario than what Zman has consistently said, which was self-defense.

Edited July 12, 2013 by Hozzie

[TNMTBik3r]

Depending on what story you listen to, TM DID go close to home if not all the way there. But then he decided to go back and confront. Was part of one of Jentels statements.

[Randall53]

I think if you are going to say that Zman "should" have stayed in his car, then you can absolutely say that TM "should" have ran home.  Fact is, Zman "could" have stayed in his car and this may have been averted <OR> TM "could" have ran home and this may have been averted.  Fact is, neither of them did what they "could" or "should" have.  They both have equal blame on that front.  In the end it doesn't matter what they could or should have done.  There was an altercation, Zman was fearful for his life (I do believe this although it could be argued and that is why there is the case) and ultimately he killed TM.  No matter who could have, should have, or would have done anything, I don't believe the prosecution has proven any other scenario than what Zman has consistently said, which was self-defense.

 

I agree. A 6'2" young MAN, even if he was only 17 jumped and wanted to fight a 5'7" Porky and teach him a lesson.  He got so involved and heated, he didn't want to stop the "lesson" he was gonna teach the "creepy assed Cracker" and went past the line.  GM cried for help for 45 seconds before stopping the threat against his life.  That is a VERY long time to take the kind of beating GM received.

Edited July 12, 2013 by Randall53

[Mark@Sea]

Depending on what story you listen to, TM DID go close to home if not all the way there. But then he decided to go back and confront. Was part of one of Jentels statements.

Dingdingdingdingding...
We have a winner.

TM returned and ambushed Zimmerman.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

I watched the whole prosecution closing today. I thought the prosecution lawyer did a fairly good job with what he had to work with. He might even pull it off with an all-woman jury. Nothin against women or anything, but dang! All-woman jury is Al Bundy's worst nightmare! :)

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-d3eU9zhEs

 

====

 

The essence of the prosecution theory is to consider a long time line and the essence of the defense theory is to consider a short time line.

 

According to the defense-- M started the SH and then Z brought the IT.

 

According to the prosecution, using a longer time line-- Z started the SH, causing M to contribute IT. Z, suddenly out of his depth, doubled-down on the IT. Then lied about the extent of his pursuit to mask his culpability in starting the whole mess.

 

According to either theory, there wouldn't have been any IT if there hadn't been any SH.

 

Unfortunately, as far as I know, being a dumb-ass ain't against the law. The prosecution has a hard job to prove beyond shadow of a doubt that Z really is criminally stupid, rather than a mere garden-variety f-up.

 

But still, an all-woman jury decides the verdict. The defense has to work real hard to hypnotize them women-- "Pay no attention to any event before the first punch." The case is real beneficial for the defense if the timeline starts with the first punch. If those women go back to the jury room and begin to seriously discuss a long time-line, then there is no telling what they will decide. A woman can remember every stupid thing a man did going back for decades. They are real excellent with long time lines. So it might not be as optimistic for Z as some would suppose. Dunno.

[Randall53]

I'll tell you one thing Lester....there won't be a shortage of notes to read back through.  I read something that said several times in the course of the testimony, jurors asked for additional notebooks. This deliberation might not be as short a time frame as the TV annalist say it will.

[rugerla1]

I'll tell you one thing Lester....there won't be a shortage of notes to read back through.  I read something that said several times in the course of the testimony, jurors asked for additional notebooks. This deliberation might not be as short a time frame as the TV annalist say it will.

I haven't caught the time frame the analyst are saying, what's their guess as of now?

[Guest nra37922]

I'll tell you one thing Lester....there won't be a shortage of notes to read back through.  I read something that said several times in the course of the testimony, jurors asked for additional notebooks. This deliberation might not be as short a time frame as the TV annalist say it will.

Preparing for the books that they will write maybe?

[Randall53]

I haven't caught the time frame the analyst are saying, what's their guess as of now?

 

I've heard as little as 3 hours deliberation. 

 

 

Preparing for the books that they will write maybe?

 

Very good point! I wouldn't blame them if they did.

[Mike.357]

hearing the "experts" saying a couple of days to deliberate, but really who knows.

 

Heard O'Mara say today he does not write up his closing arguments but rather knows what he wants to say and just goes with it.  I am hopeful to see how he does.

 

I do not understand why lesser charges is part of the game. I understand it is Florida law to do this but it seems sort of like playing poker and getting to change the bet after all the cards are laid out to see.  Seems kind of F'd up.  But it is what it is.

 

I really do not think the prosecution has proved anything that is contested.  If life was fair Zimmerman will go home a free man next week.

[eRay]

I agree. A 6'2" young MAN, even if he was only 17 jumped and wanted to fight a 5'7" Porky and teach him a lesson.  He got so involved and heated, he didn't want to stop the "lesson" he was gonna teach the "creepy assed Cracker" and went past the line.  GM cried for help for 45 seconds before stopping the threat against his life.  That is a VERY long time to take the kind of beating GM received.

 

I think this  sums up the situation better than anyone else has explained it. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that this is exactly what happened.

Edited July 12, 2013 by Eray

[JWC]

I heard they were gonna go for 19th degree murder too but changed their mind because the koala bear tracks were gone because of rain

[Worriedman]

I have not commented (much) on this whole thing, waiting till the evidence is in to see what it presents.

I have learned that if you lie to women, they will not forgive that, and the Prosecution lied to them today.  de La Rionda told the jury that Zimmerman told his neighbor to tell his wife he had "killed" someone when he asked him to call and tell her that he (Zimmerman) had been taken into custody.  That is a patent lie, and will be proven by reading back of testimony.

 

O'Mara will crucify de La Rionda for that lie tomorrow, the jury will not forget it even though the prosecution gets the last word.

Edited July 12, 2013 by Worriedman

[TLRMADE]

This is some NBA players profile...... This is only going to get worse....



Here's some other random ones:





This profile has been removed....

Edited July 12, 2013 by TLRMADE

[MattCary]

This is some NBA players profile...... This is only going to get worse....



Here's some other random ones:





This profile has been removed....

 

Yeah, that type of thing is helpful... *eyeroll.*

[Guest Bonedaddy]

I remember seein' my grandfather ridin' shotgun in a jeep, on the TV, durin' the riots in Memphis. Just wonderin' if this could get that stupid......

[Randall53]

I remember seein' my grandfather ridin' shotgun in a jeep, on the TV, durin' the riots in Memphis. Just wonderin' if this could get that stupid......

Yep...I think so. And with today's gangsta mindset, things could get worse. Back in those days the rioting was more confined to the hood. Might not be that confined this go around and could spread to all areas.. I sure hope not though.

[Titansfan]

I was in college during the 1992 LA Riots after the trial of the police offcers accused of beating Rodney King.  Over the last few days, I have been pulling up footage of the riots on You Tube.  While I have no concern for rioting in most of Tennessee (Memphis, would be the only exception), I will be taking my family to St. Louis on Sunday and will be there until Wed. 

 

Somethings I have thought about, in 1992, cell phones were rare, rioters/looters learned of the news on radio/TV.  Today, virtually everyone has a cellphone and that can been hooked to Twitter/Facebook and other social media.  For instance, a gang member can tweet, "ain't no POlice at liquor store on corner of ______ & ______" .  Few minutes later, flash mob arrives.  Or tweet, "white family stuck in traffic at ________ & ________ intersection"

[Mike.357]

i wonder if Martin's parents arrived in court after OMara started his closing argument on purpose to make sure the jury noticed them?

[Sam1]

Preparing for the books that they will write maybe?

That's exactly it.