Weed, fights and guns: Trayvon Martin’s text messages released

[Mike.357]

Jury either has to come back with 2nd Degree murder or acquit.  There is no option for a lesser verdict, wouldn't make much difference as GZ is in the right and should be found not guilty of anything.

 

 

i am pretty sure the jury can come back with guilt on lesser charges.  Maybe I misheard the talking heads on CNN, dunno

[Mike.357]

 

 

Of course, nothing will ever be enough for some people...if they either want/believe Zimmerman is guilty there isn't anything that's going to change their minds.

 

 

a girl I work with is pretty much the smartest person I have ever know.  She is convinced Zim is guilty.  Nothing will change the opinion.

[Mike.357]

So the prosecution trots out TM mama to say what. "That's my baby crying out  I would recognize that voice in a crowd"  She is going to say that the voice is TM's no matter what.  So why even drag this out?   Please God let this BS end and let GZ get on with his life. 

 

of course she will testify that her baby cried out for help.  Powerful stuff to end the prosecution case with.  And the Defense will not touch her for cross examination with a ten foot pole.

[mikegideon]

a girl I work with is pretty much the smartest person I have ever know.  She is convinced Zim is guilty.  Nothing will change the opinion.

 

She may be smart, but wouldn't have been selected for that jury. Remember, the lawyers questioned those jurors. Took them awhile to find six that were qualified.

[c.a.willard]

I think the prosecution was trying to end with her today so that she would be whats in the jurors mind over the holiday that would be very powerful. Even with finishing on friday  if they can call a BS witness and then her they can end the day and go into the weekend with her testimony.   I do however think the defense will attempt to manipulate her on cross.  All it takes for them to get TM's actions in would be for her to say something along the lines of he was such a good boy  etc.  and i think putting her on the stand would be a mistake for that reason.  Think about even asking her why was TM in Sanford and not home with her.  She could potentially open the door to a lot of information that the prosecution does not want the jury to hear

[Mike.357]

She may be smart, but wouldn't have been selected for that jury. Remember, the lawyers questioned those jurors. Took them awhile to find six that were qualified.

 

we talked a bit about it today amid the bazillion sales we made.  She was absolutely shocked I thought Zim was innocent and was not swayed by my statement that following Martin was not a crime.  She absolutely see's any shooter as guilty.   I am pretty sure she could have made it to a jury if she wanted to.  ( this of course assuming she lived in Fla and was called for duty)  Several other I work with are also convinced Zim is guilty.  None of them care about actual facts, only their conceived notions of being anti gun.  I don't see it as far fetched that 6 woman in Florida got on that jury.  Murder 2, maybe not, but definitely guilty of something, if not guilty why was he charged is the consensus.

 

I am pretty sure Zim will be convicted of manslaughter at minimum. (unless I am wrong about a jury being able to bring back guilt on lesser charges)

[mikegideon]

we talked a bit about it today amid the bazillion sales we made.  She was absolutely shocked I thought Zim was innocent and was not swayed by my statement that following Martin was not a crime.  She absolutely see's any shooter as guilty.   I am pretty sure she could have made it to a jury if she wanted to.  ( this of course assuming she lived in Fla and was called for duty)  Several other I work with are also convinced Zim is guilty.  None of them care about actual facts, only their conceived notions of being anti gun.  I don't see it as far fetched that 6 woman in Florida got on that jury.  Murder 2, maybe not, but definitely guilty of something, if not guilty why was he charged is the consensus.

 

I am pretty sure Zim will be convicted of manslaughter at minimum. (unless I am wrong about a jury being able to bring back guilt on lesser charges)

 

The defense wouldn't let those kind of people on the jury. I promise you they identified those types, thru questioning, and disqualified them. Of course all the anti's think Z is guilty. Anti's are retarded.

Edited July 4, 2013 by mikegideon

[TripleDigitRide]

If the judge wouldn't allow testimony from "experts" as to who's screaming, I don't understand how she'd allow testimony from an obviously biased mother who hardly raised her son.

[Mike.357]

The defense wouldn't let those kind of people on the jury. I promise you they identified those types, thru questioning, and disqualified them. Of course all the anti's think Z is guilty. Anti's are retarded.

 

 

how many potential juror's did the defense bounce?   Are the sides limited on how many they can not allow on the jury?

[QuietDan]

The weakness of the prosecution's case, IMO, demonstrates that the concocted second degree charges and this whole trial was a political move to tamp down outrage in a segment of the community and give them a trial that they all demanded. IMO, it is a weak and laughable case; the prosecution is stepping through the motions with the best evidence they have, knowing in advance that "not guilty" is a foregone conclusion, barring some rookie error on the part of the defense. Part of this is obvious from the affect of the prosecutors. They don't have "fire in the belly," and the prosecutor appointed by the governor has hardly shown her face.

 

Another political result of this political trial, IMO, as either a by-product or as the main intent, is to demonstrate that shooting thugs is a difficult and time consuming process, thereby making other citizens extremely reluctant to shoot an attacking thug, even if the thug is threatening you with robbery or theft, with actual physical violence or the real fear of death or bodily harm.

 

If all the thugs out there that perpetrated violence on others were shot by their victims, we would decimate a segment of the population. There are segments of the political element that would consider that a bad thing, either because it would be a waste of sure votes, or because it riles up a segment of the population and makes it harder to control. It is a cheap pandering to a segment of the population and allows the political element and other elements to continue to ignore & avoid and fail to correct the true problem and an obvious truth, that so many of the youth of today are thugs and ought to be shot.

Edited July 4, 2013 by QuietDan

[JayC]

Zimmerman is currently only charged with Murder 2, the judge will decided if the lesser included offenses (and which ones) can also be presented to the jury at the time of jury instruction.  It's not a given that they'll be given manslaughter as an option.

 

i am pretty sure the jury can come back with guilt on lesser charges.  Maybe I misheard the talking heads on CNN, dunno

 

[JayC]

A lot, they can bounce any juror for 'cause', and anything that could hurt the defense is for cause pretty much...  the judge gave the defense great latitude in getting rid of problem jurors because of all of the press coverage.

 

Also, keep in mind that 5 of the jurors have firearms in their homes, and it only takes 1 of them to hang the jury.  I don't see the state taking a second whack at this case.

 

how many potential juror's did the defense bounce?   Are the sides limited on how many they can not allow on the jury?

 

[DaveS]

I'm convinced you are nothing but a troll. 

Because my opinion is differant than everyone else's here? I'm not allowed to think for myself? I'm not a TROLL at all. I just don't agree with you! PERIOD!

 

Dave

[Mike.357]

A lot, they can bounce any juror for 'cause', and anything that could hurt the defense is for cause pretty much...  the judge gave the defense great latitude in getting rid of problem jurors because of all of the press coverage.

 

Also, keep in mind that 5 of the jurors have firearms in their homes, and it only takes 1 of them to hang the jury.  I don't see the state taking a second whack at this case.

 

 

Thanks, I had not read or heard how many were sent home.   I know people who have no problem with guns for home protection but they are not fans of people carrying them out and about.

 

Zimmerman is currently only charged with Murder 2, the judge will decided if the lesser included offenses (and which ones) can also be presented to the jury at the time of jury instruction.  It's not a given that they'll be given manslaughter as an option.

 

Oh, the judge will decide the lesser charges.    thanks for that too.

 

I absolutely fully expect Zim to be found guilty of something.   Many otherwise seemingly intelligent people are convinced Zimmerman went on a cold blooded man hunt that night.  It is very conceivable that the judge has an opinion and jurors will see him guilty of something.  I would guess the judge is pretty good at hiding her feelings, but will still act on them.

[knewcomb]

Curious, if manslaughter carriers a 30 year sentence in Florida, what does Murder 2 carry?

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I think the judge has to set aside the jury's decision if she wishes to reach her own decision. If she does something

along those lines, it would, more likely, be to dismiss the charges. She would be a fool to do that.The state could

then try again. The best thing to happen would be for a jury verdict, guilty or not. An appellate court may have to sort

it out with a guilty verdict, because of too many possible errors. Juries don't lean on the side of guilty verdicts without

plenty of evidence to back it up. Unless we are in an alternate universe, considering that girl/woman who was found

not guilty for murder of her child, how could Zimmerman receive a guilty verdict with what evidence there is?

 

I think the jury would reach a not guilty verdict without the defense having to present. There's just nothing to defend.

The race card can't be used to adjudicate this. That would be more of a reason to have riots than threats from the

Shumers, Sharptons and Jacksons of the world. The Black Panther types have no dog in this, either, except from

politicians who are wishing for it.

[Guest nra37922]

If the judge wouldn't allow testimony from "experts" as to who's screaming, I don't understand how she'd allow testimony from an obviously biased mother who hardly raised her son.

Don't lose sight that this is a politically driven show trial with the government desperately seeking a guilty conviction to satisfy special interest groups.  The governments lawyers have done such a piss poor job to date that there is no way this judge is going to stop the mama's testimony.

[DaveTN]

If the judge wouldn't allow testimony from "experts" as to who's screaming, I don't understand how she'd allow testimony from an obviously biased mother who hardly raised her son.

They didn't let a state witness that said it was Martin screaming testify, but they did allow an expert to testify. He said....
 

Nakasone said that the sample was "not fit for the purpose of voice comparison." However, he said the "best approach would be familiar voice recognition by an individual who has heard him ...speaking uttering in a variety of conditions including screaming, yelling under similar setups."

He sat it up for the Mother to testify.

[mikegideon]

Don't lose sight that this is a politically driven show trial with the government desperately seeking a guilty conviction to satisfy special interest groups.  The governments lawyers have done such a piss poor job to date that there is no way this judge is going to stop the mama's testimony.

 

I'm not so sure I agree that the lawyers have done such a piss poor job. They had NOTHING to work with. I do agree with your first statement completely.

[TripleDigitRide]

Curious, if manslaughter carriers a 30 year sentence in Florida, what does Murder 2 carry?

The crime of Second Degree Murder is classified as a First Degree Felony and is assigned a Level 10 offense severity ranking under Florida's Criminal Punishment Code.

If convicted of Second Degree Murder, a judge is required to impose a minimum prison sentence of 16¾ years in prison and can impose any additional combination of the following penalties:

• Up to Life in prison.
• Up to Life on probation.
• Up to $10,000 in fines.

10/20/Life

Under Florida's 10-20-Life law, a person who uses a Firearm to commit Second Degree Murder must be sentenced to a minimum-mandatory prison sentence of 25 years. [1]

 

Edited July 4, 2013 by TripleDigitRide

[Oh Shoot]

Curious, if manslaughter carriers a 30 year sentence in Florida, what does Murder 2 carry?

 

The 30 year is for stipulation of victim being a minor, as I understand it, which is why it would be pretty much same bad news as murder 2 for Zim in this case.

 

- OS

[bubbiesdad]

Curious, if manslaughter carriers a 30 year sentence in Florida, what does Murder 2 carry?

It has to do with this

 

[URL=http://s277.photobucket.com/user/bubbiesdad/media/10-20-life_zps56645035.gif.html][/URL]

[TripleDigitRide]

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen! Court is scheduled to resume at 8:30 EST. According to my clock, they're already late. 

[TripleDigitRide]

Off to a great start. They can't figure out how to open the evidence locker/closet.

[DaveS]

Off to a great start. They can't figure out how to open the evidence locker/closet.

Isn't that great? Maybe they should practice that when the jury isn't present. Kinda like letting OJ try on the "gloves" before the jury comes in. This is turning in to a circus!!

 

Dave S