Shotgun advise wanted

[Tobashadow]

After almost a decade of hardly able to shoot or hunt other than some every now and then to keep familiar with my carry guns, due to going to war with thyroid cancer and all its after effects. I got back into shooting for fun last year when the wife got real interested over the past year wanting to get her carry permit. So I've been upgrading some of my guns and getting newer ones like my AR's and a Mosin to play with. But after having a 410 years ago i enjoyed and seeing everyone enjoy fun gunning with the larger ones like 12 and 20 I want to move up. I have a bunch of 12 and 20 and 410 ammo from my grandfather's estate and a couple real old single shot 12 and 20 I can't shoot that I intend to pass down to my son someday. But I want something more modern.

Budget $400 prefer a pump

Real issue is that due to the before mentioned medical problem, my parathyroids were destroyed which resulted in long term muscle and bone damage till it was controlled due to extreme low blood calcuim levels. Due to that I bruise and bone fracture like a 65 year old and I'm only 40.

Enough of my whining boo hoo hoo lol.

Due to that backwards recoil is the issue, on my AR's and AK's it's a non issue due to its recoil systems. And my Mosin with bare stock bruised me nice after about 20 rounds but I could handle it.

What's the advice in the room? Buy a 410 or sell or give away the 410 shells I have and move up for more fun? Is there something I can do to lower the recoil on a modern 20 or 12 pump to enjoy the move heavy loads. My hands tho hurt from arthritis can handle the shock if that helps it's just my upper body and shoulders that have issue but I did handle the Mosin if that's a usable example.

[MississippiBoy]

With recoil a problem you may want to look at 20 guage, and also I would encourage a look at semi-autos. You can find some for the $400-$500 range.

[A.J. Holst]

I read this somewhere on the internet and it makes sense to me, but I have not verified the accuracy.

 

"...a 20ga provides about 75% of a 12ga with 50% of the recoil..."

 

I am sure this can vary widely depending on ammo and range.

[Guest Broomhead]

I haven't used one, so I have no firsthand knowledge, but they are available. http://www.brownells.com/shotgun-parts/stock-forend-parts/buttstocks/specops-gen-ii-trade-recoil-reducing-adjustable-stock-set-prod22792.aspx

 

My dad has one on his Mossberg 12ga but neither of us have shot it yet to give a review on it.

[Randall53]

Semi auto's will have less recoil than a pump, O/U, double barrel or any other shotgun. 20 ga is fine, even for home defense. I have an 870 tactical rigged that holds 7+1 3/0 buck shot for the wife.  stays by the bed on her side.  She's good with it too. 3/0 buck is 17 rounds of 25 caliber shot. That can do some damage at across the room ranges.

[Trekbike]

I also agree a 20 gauge might be your best option. If you are set on a pump then check out the Knoxx recoil reducing stocks. As said earlier a semi will lessen the recoil. Also, Benelli has some recoil reducing models from what I remember.

[jb980]

You might try a mercury recoil reducer on a 12ga. Most are easy to install and they aren't that expensive.

[Tobashadow]

I was thinking pump since auto loaders may be affected by recoil reducing stocks. With a pump I could take care of feeding manually and it wouldn't be a issue.

So would a 20 mossberg pump be a good choice with a knoxx stock added? Should be under budget from what little I've looked.

This will be a play gun with no real world use other than to watch things go boom or try out skeet again. I've got plenty of other kinds for other reasons I just see others having fun and want to join in.

[TnShooter83]

I know you want a pump, but it you look around you might find a good Remington 1100 in 20ga.

I feel this is one of the best over all field guns for the money on the used market.

Also look for one with a screwin choke or if it is a fixed choke. Modified barrel is the best.

 

If you do decide on a pump, I'd lookf for a full size gun.

The more the gun weighs the less the recoil will be.

[Guest almostdoc]

Like others have said, if recoil is an issue, seriously consider a 20 gauge and consider a semi-auto.  The CZ 720 (street ~$450 new) is close to your budget in a 20 semi, and gets great reviews from what I hear.  Don't personally own one, but have been thinking about picking one up for 3 gun myself when funds permit.  http://www.cz-usa.com/products/view/cz-720-semi-auto/

[smithra89]

I second the Remington 1100 in 20 gauge...although, can't go wrong with a Mossberg pump. I'm sure you will enjoy whatever you decide on! Good Luck!

[jtmaze]

My walmart in Jax. Usually has an 870 in 20 gauge for less than 300. I have been thinking of getting one for the wife.

[TexasAggie]

Also look at a shoulder pad. I was in Gander Mountain the other day complaining about my 35 Remington's kick. They recommended a LimbSaver Recoil Pad. I've heard a lot of good recommendations and they have a good selection of slip-on and precision fit pads.

[Guest carter]

Hawk 982 if you can find one... if all u wanna do is shoot... if you're worried about a brand and intend to pass it down what not im sure you could pick up a good used Remington

[mike243]

I have a weatherby 20g semi,great shooting very lite recoil,$500 a little over your budget but nothing else to buy,

[JAB]

IMO, felt recoil is dependent on many factors other than the 'gauge' of the gun.  For instance, I have an old single shot Stevens 20 gauge that I can't stand to shoot without a slip-on recoil pad.  I honestly cannot bear to put more than one or two through it and I am not all that recoil sensitive (I don't generally consider the recoil of a Mosin-Nagant to be a big deal, for instance.)  Honestly, that little 20 - even with target loads - hurts many times worse than my BIL's O/U 10 gauge using 3.5 inch loads.  With that slip-on recoil pad it is fine and even pleasurable but without it the darned thing kicks my butt.

 

Also, I don't think that semiautos always have less felt recoil.  I inherited a 16 gauge semiauto from my grandfather and, without a recoil pad, it slaps me just as badly as the little 20 I mentioned in the above paragraph.  Again, with a slip-on recoil pad it is fine but without one I just about couldn't stand shooting it - and certainly couldn't handle more than one mag-tube full at a time.

 

Further, I don't notice any more 'felt' recoil from my 12 gauge, 20 inch barreled Maverick Security 88 or my nephew's field model Maverick 88 12 gauge than I notice from his Remington 870 20 gauge (none of them have anything more than the factory butt plate/pad on them.)  I also have an old Sears bolt action 20 gauge that is pretty pleasant to shoot with no extra cushioning.  My old Springfield field length 12 gauge pump isn't unbearable without a recoil pad but it will certainly get your attention.  Point being that even within the same 'gauge' there can be a pretty wide range of felt/perceived recoil and going from a 12 to a lighter gauge will not necessarily guarantee less felt recoil or a more pleasant shooting experience.

 

Just yesterday evening I bought one of these from Academy:

 

http://www.academy.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10151_10051_519201_-1__?N=39632025

 

Since I live in an area where I can shoot in my back yard, I have actually tried it out, already.  I wanted to do a quick, informal pattern check so I ran one Remington #6 shot load, one Remington 00 Buck load, one Winchester Super X 00 Buck load and one S&B 'special' slug through it, back to back, and my shoulder is no worse for wear.  All of those were 2 3/4 inch loads - I generally don't even fool with 3 inch loads in 12 gauge (or 20 either, for the most part.)  For my type of shooting, I don't really see the need.  To me, the recoil from my new Stevens is more of a 'push' than a hit/slap.  This probably has to do with the angle of the buttstock as well as the extra stability offered by the pistol grip.  I was actually worried that the little fellah was going to kick the crud out of me because I think the buttstock is partly hollow but it proved to be pretty pleasant to shoot.  It isn't a high dollar shotgun but I am pretty sure I am going to like it.  I can only imagine how much more pleasant the recoil would be with one of the more expensive, recoil reducing stocks that has the pistol grip and a full stock.

 

My mom has a basic model Mossberg 500 .410 pump.  It has plastic, faux-wood furniture and its recoil is not unpleasant in the least.  In fact, it is a pretty fun little shotgun.

 

Mostly, I said all that to say just because one, particular shotgun in any, particular gauge might 'hurt' you, don't give up.  I'm willing to bet that somewhere out there is a gauge/gun/recoil pad combination that will be just right for you.  Heck, none of the shotguns I mentioned as being 'pleasant' or 'fun' to shoot had a price tag anywhere near $400.  At that price point, I would imagine you can find something that is both fun and comfortable.

Edited May 10, 2013 by JAB

[Tobashadow]

IMO, felt recoil is dependent on many factors other than the 'gauge' of the gun. For instance, I have an old single shot Stevens 20 gauge that I can't stand to shoot without a slip-on recoil pad. I honestly cannot bear to put more than one or two through it and I am not all that recoil sensitive (I don't generally consider the recoil of a Mosin-Nagant to be a big deal, for instance.) Honestly, that little 20 - even with target loads - hurts many times worse than my BIL's O/U 10 gauge using 3.5 inch loads. With that slip-on recoil pad it is fine and even pleasurable but without it the darned thing kicks my butt.

Also, I don't think that semiautos always have less felt recoil. I inherited a 16 gauge semiauto from my grandfather and, without a recoil pad, it slaps me just as badly as the little 20 I mentioned in the above paragraph. Again, with a slip-on recoil pad it is fine but without one I just about couldn't stand shooting it - and certainly couldn't handle more than one mag-tube full at a time.

Further, I don't notice any more 'felt' recoil from my 12 gauge, 20 inch barreled Maverick Security 88 or my nephew's field model Maverick 88 12 gauge than I notice from his Remington 870 20 gauge (none of them have anything more than the factory butt plate/pad on them.) I also have an old Sears bolt action 20 gauge that is pretty pleasant to shoot with no extra cushioning. My old Springfield field length 12 gauge pump isn't unbearable without a recoil pad but it will certainly get your attention. Point being that even within the same 'gauge' there can be a pretty wide range of felt/perceived recoil and going from a 12 to a lighter gauge will not necessarily guarantee less felt recoil or a more pleasant shooting experience.

Just yesterday evening I bought one of these from Academy:

http://www.academy.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10151_10051_519201_-1__?N=39632025

Since I live in an area where I can shoot in my back yard, I have actually tried it out, already. I wanted to do a quick, informal pattern check so I ran one Remington #6 shot load, one Remington 00 Buck load, one Winchester Super X 00 Buck load and one S&B 'special' slug through it, back to back, and my shoulder is no worse for wear. All of those were 2 3/4 inch loads - I generally don't even fool with 3 inch loads in 12 gauge (or 20 either, for the most part.) For my type of shooting, I don't really see the need. To me, the recoil from my new Stevens is more of a 'push' than a hit/slap. This probably has to do with the angle of the buttstock as well as the extra stability offered by the pistol grip. I was actually worried that the little fellah was going to kick the crud out of me because I think the buttstock is partly hollow but it proved to be pretty pleasant to shoot. It isn't a high dollar shotgun but I am pretty sure I am going to like it. I can only imagine how much more pleasant the recoil would be with one of the more expensive, recoil reducing stocks that has the pistol grip and a full stock.

My mom has a basic model Mossberg 500 .410 pump. It has plastic, faux-wood furniture and its recoil is not unpleasant in the least. In fact, it is a pretty fun little shotgun.

Mostly, I said all that to say just because one, particular shotgun in any, particular gauge might 'hurt' you, don't give up. I'm willing to bet that somewhere out there is a gauge/gun/recoil pad combination that will be just right for you. Heck, none of the shotguns I mentioned as being 'pleasant' or 'fun' to shoot had a price tag anywhere near $400. At that price point, I would imagine you can find something that is both fun and comfortable.

Academy is a hour drive from me but that one does look spot on for what I want.

[Smith]

Get a Mossberg 500 or 870 and get a Blackhawk Knoxx spec-ops stock and don't worry about the recoil. If price is an issue get a Hawk 982 or Pardner Pump and you can use the 870 spec-ops stock on them. I've had several and their 90% recoil reduction is pretty accurate.

[Tobashadow]

Well what a fun night, was in walmart in Athens and on the shelf was a savage in the configuration exactly how I wanted it.
No shelf tag so from 8:20pm - 9:09pm they hunted and found the price was $199, so i told them ring me up I'll take it.

The answer I got was sorry we stop selling at 9pm. Behind the counter in the display was a sign that says gun sells are 7 days a week 8am-10pm with a picture of the eastern United States highlighted, annnnnnnd here comes the face palm moment.

They told me it's 9pm due to nashville being a hour behind us! :huh:

So now I'm reminded why I quit buying guns at walmart 20 years ago.

[JAB]

Well what a fun night, was in walmart in Athens and on the shelf was a savage in the configuration exactly how I wanted it.
No shelf tag so from 8:20pm - 9:09pm they hunted and found the price was $199, so i told them ring me up I'll take it.

The answer I got was sorry we stop selling at 9pm. Behind the counter in the display was a sign that says gun sells are 7 days a week 8am-10pm with a picture of the eastern United States highlighted, annnnnnnd here comes the face palm moment.

They told me it's 9pm due to nashville being a hour behind us! :huh:

So now I'm reminded why I quit buying guns at walmart 20 years ago.

 

Sorry about your ordeal but you did just answer a question for me.  I was in the Athens Walmart on Saturday and noticed that they had the Savage/Stevens just like the one I bought at Academy in their case.  I don't recall having seen one of them at any Walmart, before and I thought to myself, "I wonder if I could have gotten it cheaper here."  The answer is nope - sounds like Walmart's price was $10 more than what I paid at Academy.

 

I do wish you had been able to get it - having just bought one, myself I would have liked to have read your impressions of it.

 

I hear you on not buying firearms at Walmart, though.  My mom bought her .410 pump at the Lenoir City Walmart and it took over an hour of just standing there, waiting for them to get the paperwork done, locate the box and get a manager to walk us out of the store with the gun.  Academy was at least a little better - another guy was buying a shotgun when I was buying mine and they got me out in about half an hour or so.   Academy's setup was kind of weird, though.  They don't have registers at the gun counter (at least at the Knoxville location) so I had to walk up front and pre-pay for the background check, bring the receipt back to the gun counter, fill out the paperwork, wait for the check and then go back up front to pay for the shotgun. 

 

For 'good buying experience', nothing beats my LGS and that is the reason I prefer to make most of my gun purchases there.  I just saw the Savage on the Academy website and couldn't pass up the price.

Edited May 13, 2013 by JAB

[Tobashadow]

And the saga continues lol.

Academy was stripped bare, not a short barrel shotgun to be found and the long barrel selection was pitiful. The guy behind the counter was actually ashamed of the poor in stock.

Made the errr "mistake" of going into Gander to look, yha won't do that again.

Maybe walmart still has the Stevens tomorrow and maybe they actually want to sell it this time.

Either way going to check Dunham's first.

[JAB]

And the saga continues lol.

Academy was stripped bare, not a short barrel shotgun to be found and the long barrel selection was pitiful. The guy behind the counter was actually ashamed of the poor in stock.

Made the errr "mistake" of going into Gander to look, yha won't do that again.

Maybe walmart still has the Stevens tomorrow and maybe they actually want to sell it this time.

Either way going to check Dunham's first.

 

Good luck!  I meant to tell you that when I bought the Savage/Stevens at the Knoxville Academy they didn't have one on display.  The guy behind the counter initially said that they were sold out of them but decided to check their stock via their computer and realized that they had two of them in stock (locked in the 'cage' behind the counter) and the problem was simply that no one had put any out on display.

 

I think it is a good idea to go into Gouger Mountain on a semi-regular basis just to make yourself feel like the prices at other stores just might be somewhat reasonable.

 

Y'all don't have an LGS down that way right now, do you?  I noticed last Saturday that 'Guns and Ammo' on Congress Parkway in Athens looked to be closed.  I had only been in there once and that was over a year ago so I have no idea what their stock/prices were like.  There's Fugate a little further down the road but I have never even been in there so don't know anything about them.

 

There are a couple of gun stores in Vonore and my favorite LGS is actually Farnsworth's in Vonore.  They generally have fair pricing but I don't know if you'd be able to find a Savage/Stevens like you are wanting there.  Normally, I would have ordered the Savage through them but with the current gun craze, etc. I think they have had a little trouble getting stock plus they probably couldn't have done much better than Academy's price on it, anyhow.  I will say that Farnsworth's had the exact, same model of Tristar shotgun - with a pistol grip and full buttstock - that Academy was selling.  The difference was that Academy's price was $530 while the price Farnsworth had on it was $350.

 

I have only been into Dunham's once but, based on the ammo prices (this was just before the current scare) I was tempted to ask if they were a subsidiary of Gander Mountain.  Their prices seemed pretty high, to me.

Edited May 15, 2013 by JAB

[Tobashadow]

Only thing we got is Dunham's, the ammo and guns tend to be about 10% higher than everyone else but I get 20% off coupons all the time. The LGS I like to use now is Frontier but they seem to hate mil surps which I'm a huge fan of and they are too far a drive for casual looks and unfortunately I'm a sucker for low cost impulse gun buys which is not them. The shop in Maddisonville is the carry badge place so that's last on the list lol.

I've been in fonsworth twice with cash in hand and they ignored me no matter how much I asked for help. I hear good things about them but if they profile me out then I don't need what they have.

There's a little shop in Sweetwater but he's well under stocked and surprised he's still around. I felt sorry for him two months ago when I stopped in but there was nothing for me. He's been my Keltec dealer for years.

[LenoirGunner]

Semi auto 20 gauge. It will reduce the recoil and make sure you get a limbsaver too. Pumps are fun, but from what you are saying you would probably get more use out of a 20 gauge semi.

[Tobashadow]

Well what a fun night, was in walmart in Athens and on the shelf was a savage in the configuration exactly how I wanted it.

No shelf tag so from 8:20pm - 9:09pm they hunted and found the price was $199, so i told them ring me up I'll take it.


The answer I got was sorry we stop selling at 9pm. Behind the counter in the display was a sign that says gun sells are 7 days a week 8am-10pm with a picture of the eastern United States highlighted, annnnnnnd here comes the face palm moment.


They told me it's 9pm due to nashville being a hour behind us! :huh:


So now I'm reminded why I quit buying guns at walmart 20 years ago.

Sorry about your ordeal but you did just answer a question for me. I was in the Athens Walmart on Saturday and noticed that they had the Savage/Stevens just like the one I bought at Academy in their case. I don't recall having seen one of them at any Walmart, before and I thought to myself, "I wonder if I could have gotten it cheaper here." The answer is nope - sounds like Walmart's price was $10 more than what I paid at Academy.

I do wish you had been able to get it - having just bought one, myself I would have liked to have read your impressions of it.

I hear you on not buying firearms at Walmart, though. My mom bought her .410 pump at the Lenoir City Walmart and it took over an hour of just standing there, waiting for them to get the paperwork done, locate the box and get a manager to walk us out of the store with the gun. Academy was at least a little better - another guy was buying a shotgun when I was buying mine and they got me out in about half an hour or so. Academy's setup was kind of weird, though. They don't have registers at the gun counter (at least at the Knoxville location) so I had to walk up front and pre-pay for the background check, bring the receipt back to the gun counter, fill out the paperwork, wait for the check and then go back up front to pay for the shotgun.

For 'good buying experience', nothing beats my LGS and that is the reason I prefer to make most of my gun purchases there. I just saw the Savage on the Academy website and couldn't pass up the price.

Picked up the Savage at Walmart for $199. And some 223 ammo, hopefully get to try out the shotgun this weekend. If its too hard on me I guess I can hand it down to my son, he'd love that lol.

They asked for a phone number and wrote it on top of the 4473 and wouldn't tell me why so i gave them my throw away google voice number.
Edited May 16, 2013 by Tobashadow