Wanting to try 9mm lead in .357 mag

[Will H]

I have 500 9mm lead bullets arriving today from Falcon Bullet.  They are 147 grain.

 

Given that there is such a small difference in size between the .38/.357 and the 9mm I am wanting to load these in .38 special cases for my Ruger GP100 and Rossi 92 lever action with a moderate charge of 5 grains of Unique.  If this is successful I can drop to one bullet for both 9mm and .38.

 

I was wanting to see if anyone had tried this and if they had any input or could share some results or cautions before I do it.

Edited April 4, 2013 by Will H

[Garufa]

I have never tried it but you might wind up with leading and accuracy issues.

 

Those 9mm bullets are .356 diameter and a typical lead .38 is .358.

[Jonnin]

I have been using cheap 90 ish grain 380s in  380, 9mm, and 38s with very good results --- all 3 guns are accurate as can be and this has provided me with a very cheap supply of ammo for punching holes in paper.   Off the top of my head I forget which bullet is bigger, but use the smaller size for both cartridges and it should be fine.  If the bullet does not expand to seal, you will have a leading problem, this can be solved usually with either softer lead (pressure will make it seal), stronger load data (just be safe), or using a hollow based bullet (might need a new mold).  You could also do gas check or paper patch if its giving trouble, but those are not worth it IMHO, if you just can't make it go make 2 types of bullets is going to be easier.

Edited April 4, 2013 by Jonnin

[Will H]

Thanks yall.  These bullets are hard cast, so I will be sure to watch for leading.  I think I am going to try and isolate the trials to the GP100 at first as it should be easier to spot/ clean up any leading issues that occur.  

[Guest TN.Frank]

Even a hard cast lead bullet will lead the barrel if it doesn't fit right. Normally, like has been said, a 357Mag/38Spl will take a .358" lead bullet where as a 9x19mm will take a .356"(although some 9's with lose barrels can take up to a .358") so I can almost bet you'll get leading and accuracy won't be top notch either. Still, what the heck, give em' a try, if worse comes to worse you'll be scrubbing lead out of your barrel and that'll be about it.

[Guest K7Sparky]

Hard cast flat base needs more whack to obdurate than soft cast.  Jacket doubt any significant obduration at HG pressures

 

If you get leading head up on the powder charge.  This experiment is a RYO.  The Ruger would be my test vehicle.

 

GP 100 and all Rugers are hell for sought built to withstand STUPID!.  Rossi look like S&W built for specified loads.  If you can find hollow base you are ahead

 

As TN. Franks says giver a go.  All you have to worry about within in reason is getting the lead out.

[Garufa]

Hard cast flat base needs more whack to obdurate than soft cast.  Jacket doubt any significant obduration at HG pressures

 

If you get leading head up on the powder charge.  This experiment is a RYO.  The Ruger would be my test vehicle.

 

GP 100 and all Rugers are hell for sought built to withstand STUPID!.  Rossi look like S&W built for specified loads.  If you can find hollow base you are ahead

 

As TN. Franks says giver a go.  All you have to worry about within in reason is getting the lead out.

 

I have no idea what you just said.

[RED333]

Slug your barrel, and see what the size is.

[xd shooter]

It will work your brass alot but you could put .358 "lead" bullets in a 9mm case & size it down using a Lee factory taper crimp.

 

Me I would slug the barrel on both & get the right bullets for both!

Edited April 5, 2013 by xd shooter

[Will H]

Slug the barrel?  Forgive my ignorance, I do have slugs in my yard, but what good would it do to stick them in a gun?  LOL

 

 

 

Seriously, what does slug the barrel mean?

[xd shooter]

To push a boolit through your barrel so you can measure the size of your bore to know what size boolit it will need.

 

A soft lead round ball works great.. Do a search on youtube for suging a barrel. It will give you a good idea.

[Will H]

Thanks guys.  I will try that and see what I get.

[Guest TN.Frank]

Also, make sure the bullet is somewhat over sized so it'll engrave into the rifling. It'll do no good if it under bore diameter.

[221 Fireball]

Slug the barrel?  Forgive my ignorance, I do have slugs in my yard, but what good would it do to stick them in a gun?  LOL

 

 

 

Seriously, what does slug the barrel mean?

I'm with ya Will, but wish I would've waited for the explanation, because I slugged my barrel and now my hand is sore as hell! :rofl:

Edited April 6, 2013 by 221 Fireball

[gregintenn]

Thanks yall.  These bullets are hard cast, so I will be sure to watch for leading.  I think I am going to try and isolate the trials to the GP100 at first as it should be easier to spot/ clean up any leading issues that occur.  

I doubt you'll have to watch for leading....it'll probably be pretty obvious. But you'll never know for sure till you try it.

[Will H]

True.  I made a batch of 10.  It really looks like I am going to have to order .38 anyway, as there is "crimp ring" on these, and I ammo share my GP100 with my Rossi levergun, so I don't want to put these in a tube mag.  Oh well, tomorrow is going to be a good day for trying stuff out at the range so this will just be part of the experiments, along with heavy magnum loads, and my first wax slugs.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Have wondered a few things about this issue. Not being a caster, I have no experience with bullet sizing dies or methods.

 

If one had a .355 or .356 bullet sizing die and suitable press, then could spare .357 or .358 bullets be driven thru the die to convert .38/.357 bullets into a size suitable for 9mm loading?

 

What about the reverse? If one had a .357 or .358 die, could one insert .355 or .356 bullets (with the sizing die closed-off on one end), and then use a mallet and some sort of suitably-sized pusher rod-- Insert each bullet into the closed-off die and then give it a strong-enough mallet tap to force the diameter a couple of thousandths bigger? Or alternately maybe use an arbor press to mash bullets into a sightly bigger size inside a closed-off die? With soft lead maybe it wouldn't take a very forceful tap to expand the bullet a mere couple of thousandths?

 

That is just a curiosity question because I don't have any experience with sizing cast bullets.

 

Assuming that the above would be workable with soft lead, a related question which would be more relevant to me, because I virtually always use jacketed or at least plated bullets-- What are the odds of such a thing working with ordinary jacketed bullets? Would it become much more difficult, perhaps "impractically difficult" to down-size a jacketed bullet a couple of thousandths using a bullet-sizing rig? Or the other way around, to expand a jacketed bullet a couple of thousandths by whacking it with a pusher rod, or mashing it with an arbor press, to make the bullet just a tiny bit bigger? 

[Will H]

Well, I went to the range yesterday and tried it out.  Total fail.  They shot fine, flew straight, but they left a good part of themselves in the barrel.  For the record you cannot shoot hardcast 147 grain 9mm from a Ruger GP100 or a Rossi 92.

 

I guess I will be ordering those .38's. 

[Dolomite_supafly]

That is because they were undersized. There is another thread where people think a 9mm needs a.355" cast bullet. A cast bullet needs to be at least .001" over the bore but I personally run .002" over the bore without issue. I have even ran cast bullets that are .005" over the bore without issue.

A cast bullet that is the same as the bore or smaller will lead the bore in most cases.

[gregintenn]

I wonder if a hollow based 9mm bullet would work in a 357. I don't know how hot you'd need to load it to blow the skirt out enough to get a good seal.

 

Did you have a hard time getting the lead out of your barrel and forcing cone?

Edited April 9, 2013 by gregintenn

[Will H]

I don't know enough about lead to answer or even speculate.

 

Yeah, it was easy to "get the lead out".  I only shot 6 lead rounds, saw the leading, stopped, and completed my range session with FMJ.  When I got home I coated the inside with Hoppe's and let it set of about 15 minutes.  Then I went at it with a brass brush and finally a jag.  It came clean as can be.

[gregintenn]

I don't know enough about lead to answer or even speculate.

Me neither. :whistle: I was sorta hoping you'd give it a try and report back to us. :D

[Dolomite_supafly]

For a hollow base just load like normal based on weight. The pressures will be high enough to seal a lead bullet.

 

There used to be a 41 Colt caliber. The bullet would drop through the barrel before being fired.

[Lowpower]

In the '70's Ruger made the single six in .38/.357 and added a 9mm cylinder to the package. You just swapped out the cylinders and shot the 9's. You might give Ruger a call and ask them what the bore size was of those barrels.

 

Lp

Edited April 10, 2013 by Lowpower