ATF Seizes Toy Guns

[jphillips63]

AS title says watch the you tube clip...

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y2sWiZ8BizI&feature=youtu.be

[Rowdy]

The insanity continues...

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I liked that agent's explanation of how. Moron.

[gjohnsoniv]

Idiots, idiots everywhere.

[TMF]

Just like I can convert the neighbor's cat into a deadly anti-personnel mine by simply shoving C4 up its ass and wrapping the animal with ball bearings. Ban cats!

[Chucktshoes]

Check the video date. Nearly 3 years go. We excoriated the F-Troop on this board over this when it happened. I'm pretty sure there is a near 3year old thread on the buried in the archives.

[rugerla1]

Freaking idiots!!

[jphillips63]

Check the video date. Nearly 3 years go. We excoriated the F-Troop on this board over this when it happened. I'm pretty sure there is a near 3year old thread on the buried in the archives.

 

 

My bad I just saw it on another forum and never thought t olook at the date of when it was uploaded

[JayC]

F-Troops strikes again, or did 3 years ago :)  At least their so worried about toy guns they aren't out bothering any law abiding gun owners ;)

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I didn't look at the date, but it did smell similar. :D I guess I expect them to do stupid stuff all the time.

[Jonnin]

the media supports them, they put TOY in quotation marks as if this were in question.  

[LagerHead]

I thought they taught you at least the basics of firearms when you joined the ATF. I guess not.

[c.a.willard]

When this oriinally happened alot of "experts" called it obsurd.  Then they actually got there hands on that model of airsoft gun and concluded that all that was neaded to convert the airsoft lower receiver to accept a real fire control group IIRC was some light sanding.  The full auto claim was crap, but the reality is that some airsoft lowers are so very close in spec that it would not require any major machining to complete a functional lower.

Edited March 1, 2013 by c.a.willard

[npgunner]

I thought they taught you at least the basics of firearms when you joined the ATF. I guess not.

no no no silly ...

ATF = Automatically Take Firearms (without question)

[LagerHead]

no no no silly ...

ATF = Automatically Take Firearms (without question)

 

Well there you go. My ignorance is showing again.

[c.a.willard]

I did a little more digging on the particular model of arisoft gun as far as what would be required to make it a functional lower.  Depending on the model seized (they seized 2 differed WE model airsoft guns).  At least one of the two confiscated is nearly identicle to a 3 hole M16 lower.  A hole would nead to be drilled to keep the beffer retaining pin/spring.  Some light sanding would need to be done to fit the fire control group.  And if im looking at the photos right one of the models only has one of the pin holes drilled for the FCG.  The other doesnt appear to be drilled out but it does have a circular score mark to make it look like a pin marking exactly where to drill.   It's all stuff thet the majority of people on this forum could probably do in their living room with a dremel during walking dead commercial breaks.

[npgunner]

Well there you go. My ignorance is showing again.

Haha. It amazes me how people like that get into government jobs, or how they stay. Sometimes I think if the average Joe wasn't so busy working to make ends meet (and had time to pay attention to these things) it would all be a little different. Maybe we should have all government activities take place on the weekend so we could all pay more attention (and they'd have less time to screw things up).

[c.a.willard]

http://www.blowbackarmory.net/product_p/parts_we_m4_105.htm   We airsoft lower.  Noticably thinner walls and  gap by where the bolt catch goes but it looks faily close to me.  If it wasnt a recipe for getting arrested, at 60 bucks for the stripped lower id give it a try.  I wonder about the legalities of making it functional as it is legal to manufacture your own firearm, may have to send off an email to ask the ATF if i filled in the hole for the auto sear if it would be legal to make it functional.

[Dolomite_supafly]

These are not your typical airsoft guns. These are very high end guns that actually have FCG's that work like real guns.

 

Not condoning it but the FCG of these airsoft guns are very, very close to real firearms. Depending on what they are made of they could possibly be used to turn a real gun into a FA, at least temporarily..

 

These are high end airsoft rifles that work identical to real guns. The only difference is they use 6mm plastic BB's.

 

They look close enough that if they were not sitting next to each other most of us here would have a hard time telling the difference. If I removed the names next to them how many of us could pick the real FCG?

 

Heck, I think I found a source for lowers now :)

 

The pictures are from here:

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=1&f=6&t=822272

 

So to the untrained ATF eyes they do look like FA FCG's, especially if they have nothing to compare it to.

 

Dolomite

[glock55]

These are not your typical airsoft guns. These are very high end guns that actually have FCG's that work like real guns.

 

Not condoning it but the FCG of these airsoft guns are very, very close to real firearms. Depending on what they are made of they could possibly be used to turn a real gun into a FA, at least temporarily..

 

These are high end airsoft rifles that work identical to real guns. The only difference is they use 6mm plastic BB's.

 

They look close enough that if they were not sitting next to each other most of us here would have a hard time telling the difference. If I removed the names next to them how many of us could pick the real FCG?

 

Heck, I think I found a source for lowers now :)

 

The pictures are from here:

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=1&f=6&t=822272

 

So to the untrained ATF eyes they do look like FA FCG's, especially if they have nothing to compare it to.

 

Dolomite

 

gee dont you hate it when the voice of reason rears its ugly head? almost makes one want to reasess ones opinion :stunned:

[TMF]

These are not your typical airsoft guns. These are very high end guns that actually have FCG's that work like real guns.
 
Not condoning it but the FCG of these airsoft guns are very, very close to real firearms. Depending on what they are made of they could possibly be used to turn a real gun into a FA, at least temporarily..
 
These are high end airsoft rifles that work identical to real guns. The only difference is they use 6mm plastic BB's.
 

They look close enough that if they were not sitting next to each other most of us here would have a hard time telling the difference. If I removed the names next to them how many of us could pick the real FCG?
 
Heck, I think I found a source for lowers now :)
 
The pictures are from here:
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=1&f=6&t=822272
 
So to the untrained ATF eyes they do look like FA FCG's, especially if they have nothing to compare it to.
 
Dolomite

Looking at the side by side it appears the fake lower is slightly shorter than the other, as in it wouldn't accept an upper. If it did the upper would be line up incorrectly which wouldn't activate the auto sear when the bolt was forward, not to mention the auto sear pictured wouldn't work with a real bolt. So for argument's sake, let's say that you need to acquire an actual auto sear, bolt and 3 position selector to make this work; how would that be any different then doing the same thing in a standard polymer lower?

[Dolomite_supafly]

Just saying to the untrained eye that they look similar enough to be confused. And without a side by side could you tell the lower is shorter?

The ATF probably had nothing to compare it to.

Dolomite

[c.a.willard]

The other issue would be how easily they could be converted to accept actual semi auto FCG.  It looks like it shold accept a drop in FCG.  And the block where the bolt would normally go is removable.  It is the portion of the airsoft gun used to release gas from the magazine.    As far as the ATF is concerned it usually comes down to how much time and skill is necessary to convert it into a working receiver.  hence why you can buy a 80 percent receiver through the mail but not one that is closer to being a finished product.  I'm not sure exactly how much work it would take to make it functioning but i think it would be fairly minimal. 

 

I just sent of an email to BATFE asking about the legalities of using one to make a functional lower sans the auto sear.  My only concern really is the hole being pre drilled for the auto sear.  If they say its GTG im gonna order one of the WE stripped lowers just to see how difficult it would be.  the WE stripped lowers are only 60 and may be suitable enough for something like a dedicated 22

[gjohnsoniv]

Those are some seriously realistic airsoft guns. I'm just used to the Wally World/Crosman specials.

[TMF]

Just saying to the untrained eye that they look similar enough to be confused. And without a side by side could you tell the lower is shorter?
The ATF probably had nothing to compare it to.
Dolomite

Yeah, I was more talking about the agent's assessment that this could be made into a functional FA weapon. If the parts don't match up it ain't gonna work, and it appears that even if you put the correct parts in there it still wouldn't work because they wouldn't line up correctly.