The BEST .380 Defensive Load

[Luckyforward]

Feedback, please!

What is the best .380 cartridge for personal defense?

[TripleDigitRide]

You'll likely get several different answers. Here is some helpful info.

http://www.firearmstactical.com/ammo_data/380acp.htm

[Guest c_o_jones]

I think Speer Gold Dots and Federal Hydra Shoks do good in .380.

[KahrMan]

The best .380 load for personal protection is 230 gr .45

[Guest sermon8r]

The best .380 load for personal protection is 230 gr .45

Spoken like a True Believer!

[DaveTN]

What is the best .380 cartridge for personal defense?

There is no such thing.

[Guest TheBulldog]

I'd fill that thing with Glaser safety slugs!

Better yet, upgrade to a better caliber, the 380 has always been a weak caliber.

[Guest sermon8r]

The best .380 load for personal protection is 230 gr .45

A .380 with you beats a .45ACP sitting in the safe

[molonlabetn]

Any FMJ which will function reliably. JHPs don't penetrate enough in this caliber.

[Guest m4coyote]

There is quite an argument in favor of the FMJ for defensive use in the .380. The various JHP rounds for the .380 may not allow for adequate penetration to the vital organs.

I would far prefer a round that would effect a .355 diameter hole in a major artery, lung, or heart of an attacking assailant, rather than a mostly superficial .50 caliber flesh wound.

[molonlabetn]

The other option would be the Double-Tap load: http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_62&products_id=233

It seems to get the most out of that little cartridge. I haven't seen any terminal ballistics on it, but with about 15% more velocity than the next best JHP .380 load, I'd be willing to give it a shot... especially considering the excellent reputation of the Gold-Dot bullet they use in their loads.

Other than that, the Remington 102gr Golden Sabre might be worth trying... the heavier bullet would obviously have greater sectional density, and be a good penetrator as a result.

All of that is speculation, of course... but incapacitating people with handgun calibers is a crapshoot at best, anyways.

[Guest I_AM_WOOD]

I got some of both laying around any one willing to let me shoot them.

[Luckyforward]

The other option would be the Double-Tap load: http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_62&products_id=233

It seems to get the most out of that little cartridge. I haven't seen any terminal ballistics on it, but with about 15% more velocity than the next best JHP .380 load, I'd be willing to give it a shot... especially considering the excellent reputation of the Gold-Dot bullet they use in their loads.

Other than that, the Remington 102gr Golden Sabre might be worth trying... the heavier bullet would obviously have greater sectional density, and be a good penetrator as a result.

All of that is speculation, of course... but incapacitating people with handgun calibers is a crapshoot at best, anyways.

I had thought of the Golden Sabre as I utilize it in other calibers, but the Double Tap sounds pretty awesome.

Your comment about the "crapshoot of incapacitating people" is so true.

[DavidD]

Your comment about the "crapshoot of incapacitating people" is so true.

As I was reminded Friday night by the owner of the Sonic in Old Hickory who told us his manager put two rounds of .45 JHP in the Bad Guy yet he still managed to run away. Of course shot placement was an issue.

[DavidD]

You'll likely get several different answers. Here is some helpful info.

http://www.firearmstactical.com/ammo_data/380acp.htm

Ok, maybe I'm showing my ignorance here but why is the penetration LESS in Bare Gelatin than that with Clothed Gelatin in these stats?

[molonlabetn]

Ok, maybe I'm showing my ignorance here but why is the penetration LESS in Bare Gelatin than that with Clothed Gelatin in these stats?

Because when the hollowpoint gets clogged expansion is delayed, and will act more like a FMJ round, thus penetrating deeper.

[DavidD]

Because when the hollowpoint gets clogged expansion is delayed, and will act more like a FMJ round, thus penetrating deeper.

I suspected such. Sooo, one might as well not use JHP's??????

[molonlabetn]

I suspected such. Sooo, one might as well not use JHP's??????

Most of the premium brands are not affected much by clothing. It's simply a matter of some being slightly better than others... and of course the randomness of reality. Since, what does any of it really matter if the bullet strikes a button, or something in a breast pocket, causing it to fragment or deflect... It really doesn't matter what ammmo you use, as long as it will penetrate enough, and you can hit with it repeatedly and quickly. Spending money on a premium SD cartridge is like taking the extra care to run premium gas in your 'Vette, even though it'll run okay on regular. That extra little bit might be what you need when the time comes to put the hammer down.

[Metalhead]

I personally like Golden Saber, Extreme Shock, and Corbon Pow'rball in my kel-tec. Think I've got ES loaded in it atm.

[Guest Todd@CIS]

For .380ACP, stick with FMJ for practice and defense.

With the POSSIBLE exception of the Hornady XTP (only because it doesn't expand that much), there is not a .380 JHP made that expands AND penetrates deep enough to be recommended for effective self defense.

FWIW, my general rule of thumb:

For calibers that can reliably expand AND penetrate approx 12" of calibrated gel...JHP.

For calibers that can reliably expand OR penetrate approx 12" of calibrated gel...FMJ.

We WANT expansion...we NEED penetration.

Plus, you get the added benefit of better feed reliability in small autos (which sometimes can be more finicky than service-sized pistols).

Edited December 14, 2009 by Todd@CIS

[Guest TheBulldog]

For .380ACP, stick with FMJ for practice and defense.

With the POSSIBLE exception of the Hornady XTP, there is not a .380 JHP made that expands AND penetrates deep enough to be recommended for effective self defense.

FWIW, my general rule of thumb:

For calibers that can reliably expand AND penetrate approx 12" of calibrated gel...JHP.

For calibers that can reliably expand OR penetrate approx 12" of calibrated gel...FMJ.

We WANT expansion...we NEED penetration.

Plus, you get the added benefit of better feed reliability in small autos (which sometimes can be finickier than service-sized pistols).

Blue or Silver Glaser safety slugs will address your concerns.

You'll get more energy down range and the Silver Safety slugs are good for 1300+Fps from a 3" barrel.

Remember these are plastic tipped rounds that are frangible, they penetrate and release shot pellets into the cavity.

Air Marshals Use these rounds as they will Not penetrate an aircrafts skin yet will deliver a quick stop on a human combatant.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/Ammo-Centerfire-45-50-Caliber-45-ACP-Defense-Hunting-45-ACP-P-Glaser-Safety-Slug-Silver-145-Grains-6-Pack_QQ5574_QQ207

http://waterguy.us/handgun.htm

[Guest Todd@CIS]

Blue or Silver Glaser safety slugs will address your concerns.

You'll get more energy down range and the Silver Safety slugs are good for 1300+Fps from a 3" barrel.

Remember these are plastic tipped rounds that are frangible, they penetrate and release shot pellets into the cavity.

Air Marshals Use these rounds as they will Not penetrate an aircrafts skin yet will deliver a quick stop on a human combatant.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/Ammo-Centerfire-45-50-Caliber-45-ACP-Defense-Hunting-45-ACP-P-Glaser-Safety-Slug-Silver-145-Grains-6-Pack_QQ5574_QQ207

http://waterguy.us/handgun.htm

BullDog...where are you getting your information?

When discussing handgun terminal ballistics, energy plays a very small part and Glasers would be a poor choice in this caliber.

For more information on terminal ballistics, check out www.tacticalforums.com , with particular attention to "DocGKR's" posts as he happens to be an authority on the subject.

Also, has something changed, because last I saw FAMS (Federal Air Marshals) were issued the Gold Dot in .357 SIG?

BTW, explosive decompression of an airliner due to penetration of the skin or a passenger window with a bullet is an urban legend.

Edited July 15, 2008 by Todd@CIS

[Guest TheBulldog]

BullDog...where are you getting your information?

When discussing handgun terminal ballistics, energy plays a very small part and Glasers would be a poor choice in this caliber.

For more information on terminal ballistics, check out www.tacticalforums.com , with particular attention to "DocGkr's" posts as he happens to be an authority on the subject.

Also, has something changed, because last I saw FAMS (Federal Air Marshals) were issued the Gold Dot in .357 SIG?

No, they went frangible a while back, hence the silver tip slug.

[DaveTN]

No, they went frangible a while back, hence the silver tip slug.

Glaser’s have been frangible since they were invented in the early 70’s.

Glaser is the worst choice I can think of for a defensive round in any caliber.

They have an application, but defensive carry is not it.

[Guest GLOCKGUY]

Blue or Silver Glaser safety slugs will address your concerns.

You'll get more energy down range and the Silver Safety slugs are good for 1300+Fps from a 3" barrel.

Remember these are plastic tipped rounds that are frangible, they penetrate and release shot pellets into the cavity.

Air Marshals Use these rounds as they will Not penetrate an aircrafts skin yet will deliver a quick stop on a human combatant.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/Ammo-Centerfire-45-50-Caliber-45-ACP-Defense-Hunting-45-ACP-P-Glaser-Safety-Slug-Silver-145-Grains-6-Pack_QQ5574_QQ207

http://waterguy.us/handgun.htm

a good freind of mine is a Air Marshal he lives in ALT. GA. and he still carries a 357 SIG Sauer pistols with hollow-point

Air marshals carry automatic .357 SIG Sauer pistols with a 12-round cartridge. The bullets are hollow-point and expand on entering a body

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2005-12-07-air-marshals_x.htm

Federal Air Marshals carry the SIG-Sauer P229 service pistol in a .357 SIG chambering.[3]

The P229 can be chambered in 9 mm, .40 S&W or .357 SIG. Changing between .40 S&W and .357 SIG is as simple as switching out the barrel. Conversion barrels, from companies such as Bar-Sto Precision Machine[4], also allow a P229 or P226 to change between a .40 S&W/.357 SIG to a 9 mm caliber. Magazines shipped with .357 SIG models have a "necked" throat that will only accept that caliber. Magazines shipped with .40 S&W models will accept either caliber. The 9 mm model cannot be converted to another caliber

"and the p229 is not chambered in 380

Edited July 15, 2008 by GLOCKGUY