The 21ft rule - fail "these officers did not have to get cut"

[1morethan8]

"Don't know what those guys were thinking."

 

They wasn't!!

[BigK]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=related&v=jwHYRBNc9r8

I watch this show every week. I like how they always offer bad/good/better/best alternatives. It always makes me think and that is a good thing. Edited February 25, 2013 by BigK

[TNcitizen22]

Taze first, ask questions later.

[TMF]

Taze first, ask questions later.

I think the closest thing these officers have to a taser is a blow dart or maybe a witch doctor spell.

[Guest ab28]

At 20 feet... I tell them, "drop the knife or die". I use .357 magnum and most of the time .44 magnum or .454 Casull which would already be drawn, cocked, and aimed.  I like to aim just above the tip of their nose in the "triangle of death".

 

After 5 seconds, if the knife is not dropped.. I fire.

 

No need to side step and never closer than 20 feet.

Too much recoil and penetration for self defense. Better off with a high capacity 9mm with decent hollow points. Faster followup shots, not as much chance of hitting a bystander. The only time I'd pack a .454 is in grizzly country, it's clumsy, heavy, and overkill for anything else.

 

I love revolvers, they are great weapons, but as a combat handgun, a semi beats them hands down. 3x the ammo, faster reloads, and more than enough accuracy for any fight you'll get in with a handgun.

Edited March 18, 2013 by ab28

[1morethan8]

Too much recoil and penetration for self defense. Better off with a high capacity 9mm with decent hollow points. Faster followup shots, not as much chance of hitting a bystander. The only time I'd pack a .454 is in grizzly country, it's clumsy, heavy, and overkill for anything else.

 

I love revolvers, they are great weapons, but as a combat handgun, a semi beats them hands down. 3x the ammo, faster reloads, and more than enough accuracy for any fight you'll get in with a handgun.

 

But.. but.. I love to hear the big dogs bark! :woohoo:

 

I don't want to be in a gun fight where I need "3x the ammo" and "faster reload". And if the other guy has a gun, what do you think he's going to be doing while you're shooting all that ammo?

Well, with a .44 magnum or .454 Casull.. you don't need many followup up shots!

I don't find either the .44 or the .454 clumsy and I don't believe "overkill" is even possible!?

[Guest ab28]

But.. but.. I love to hear the big dogs bark! :woohoo:

 

I don't want to be in a gun fight where I need "3x the ammo" and "faster reload". And if the other guy has a gun, what do you think he's going to be doing while you're shooting all that ammo?

Well, with a .44 magnum or .454 Casull.. you don't need many followup up shots!

I don't find either the .44 or the .454 clumsy and I don't believe "overkill" is even possible!?

I don't spray bullets when using a semi, higher capacity is because with service rounds, it is going to take multiple hits to put someone down. Handguns are weak, as far as "regular" carry pistols go. The faster followup shots are important when facing multiple opponents, and for fast, accurate hits. As far as clumsy goes, the revolvers are big and bulky and would be a pain to carry every day concealed.

 

Revolvers definitely still have their place, but if I was facing 2-3 people in close quarters, I'd prefer a 9mm Glock, XD or whatever with some good hollowpoints. 9mm for the recoil control, and the fact that there isn't a whole lot of difference between 9mm, .45, and .40 in hollowpoints, as far as effectiveness goes.

 

Probably be more of a pain to use something that big while moving and point shooting like you would in a close range shootout.

Edited March 19, 2013 by ab28

[1morethan8]

Everyone has their own opinion on what handgun to carry. But, no one type is best for all situations.

If you feel that an auto is right for you... go for it!

 

"Handguns are weak, as far as "regular" carry pistols go."

I don't guess you were talking about the .44 mag or the .454 Casull...

because in the other post you were talking "overkill"?

 

I can unload either one of the 4's in three seconds. If two people are in close quarters and I have to shot...

somebody is going to have a bad day!

[Guest ab28]

Everyone has their own opinion on what handgun to carry. But, no one type is best for all situations.

If you feel that an auto is right for you... go for it!

 

"Handguns are weak, as far as "regular" carry pistols go."

I don't guess you were talking about the .44 mag or the .454 Casull...

because in the other post you were talking "overkill"?

 

I can unload either one of the 4's in three seconds. If two people are in close quarters and I have to shot...

somebody is going to have a bad day!

"regular" meaning between 9mm and .45. My opinion comes from several close range shootouts overseas. I wasn't just making a statement. You are going to miss in a gunfight, most likely, even with a lot of training. You have the military icon by your name, so I am sure you have an idea of what I am talking about. I am tall and slim, so even carrying a G19 IWB got to be a pain. Bigger people might not have as big an issue, and carrying it unconcealed would be fine for a revolver. Dragging a .454 out of concealment would be an issue.

 

I have shot a lot of guns over the years. Never a .454, but I have shot a .44 mag. It was accurate as hell, and fun to shoot, but the recoil put too much time between followup shots for my comfort. That is why I stopped carrying my G27, it was really snappy with full power defensive loads, I could shoot it, but the recovery time between shots was more than I would want.

 

If you like the .357, the .357 SIG has identical performance out of a semi, with more ammo before a reload. I think it pushes a 125gr bullet at about 1400 FPS,

Edited March 19, 2013 by ab28

[1morethan8]

ab28...

 

I don't want to be in any shootouts.. at my age I just don't think I have to many left! :ugh:

I can tell that you know what you're doing and I'm sure you have looked at all sides.

[Guest ab28]

ab28...

 

I don't want to be in any shootouts.. at my age I just don't think I have to many left! :ugh:

I can tell that you know what you're doing and I'm sure you have looked at all sides.

I understand, but a lot of the revolver users think they are just gonna be coolly placing one round center mass on each target in a gunfight, and anyone that uses a semi will just be spraying bullets. You are going to be moving and shooting, not using the sights, point shooting most likely one handed, trying to put as many bullets in the bad guy as you can. That's the reality of the situation. Training definitely helps a lot, but you won't be doing careful trigger squeezes, ect.

[glowdotGlock]

I'd have like to seen a couple loads of buckshot to this guy..

[1morethan8]

I'd have like to seen a couple loads of buckshot to this guy..

 

You are just heartless... I don't know what to think about you! :rofl:

[Dolomite_supafly]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=related&v=jwHYRBNc9r8

 

If I was walking through the parking lot and have a random guy tell me to stop like the driver did I would probably point and laugh. That is paranoia at its worst if you are telling people to stop for 15 feet away. I mean how many people are walking through the parking lot of Walmart warning odd acting people to stop. The driver is just not acting normal.

 

The other thing that I find idiotic is training or doing a scenario with a real knife. Accidents happen and you want to minimize the chance of injury during training. Had the victim stepped to the left a step just as the guy was fake stabbing it could have been really bad. Pretty bad judgement on their part.

 

Dolomite

[Superman]

There are training knives out there that are real knives but the blade was never sharpened. I think spyderco makes their trainers like that, which looks like what that was in the last video.

Edited March 22, 2013 by Superman

[TMF]

That is paranoia at its worst if you are telling people to stop for 15 feet away. I mean how many people are walking through the parking lot of Walmart warning odd acting people to stop. The driver is just not acting normal.



Dolomite

Yeah, if this guy was in Seattle he'd be doing this non-stop... so he'd be just another crazy guy yelling at people on the street.

[ttocswob]

I'll take the guy with the knife over the two guys arguing semi vs. revolver anyday...;)

[Guest MilitiaMan]

It all depends on where you live, what you've been exposed to and how you perceive threats.

 

The driver in that one video was acting perfectly normal towards what he perceived was a potential threat. One that actually ended up being a true threat. Had it turned out the other way and the guy was just someone asking for directions? No harm, no foul.

 

Not everyone is a threat, but not everyone is some lame duck asking the time of day.

 

I was sitting in the passenger seat, in a parking lot, while my wife ran in the store to grab a cold drink. Had my two toddler children in the back seat. Guy in a pick up comes flying in the parking lot, directly perpendicular to my vehicle. Alarms go off immediately. He jumps out and heads right towards my door. I pull my sidearm and place it in my lap pointed at the door (towards him). While I would have hated to have to fire inside a vehicle with my kids in it mind you, this all happened in mere seconds. He quickly walks up saying "hey, can I ask you something". What he gets back is "Back the F up and go back to your truck!". He stops and you can see he's thinking. I continue, "Whatever you are thinking, you're about to make a fatal mistake."

 

He hops back in his truck and speeds off.

 

A few seconds later 4 police cruisers fly by in the same direction this guy was headed.

 

Was there a connection between him and the police? Or just an odd coincedence? I don't know for sure. But I have never believed in coincedences. The guy was jumpy, aggitated and in hindsight probably looking to carjack a vehicle to avoid the police.

 

Did I overreact? Or did I react appropriately considering the crime ridden world we live in? I felt then and still feel now that I handled the situation perfectly.

 

I'd rather look like a defensive fool than give some nutbag the opportunity to do me or mine harm because I was trying to play it "nice".

[Guest hammerhead]

back to the original video, it's pretty sure that none of these guys in the video had any decent training...

 

why are you going to approach a guy with a knife in his hand holding a shotgun the way the lead officer was??? How come the man was surrounded the way he was were everyone was in the crossfire??? How come no one had their gun drawn and ready to fire???

[TMF]

back to the original video, it's pretty sure that none of these guys in the video had any decent training...

why are you going to approach a guy with a knife in his hand holding a shotgun the way the lead officer was??? How come the man was surrounded the way he was were everyone was in the crossfire??? How come no one had their gun drawn and ready to fire???

Because a week before this video was taken they had bones through their noses.