Going camping this weekend...tips?

[1morethan8]

Ground is white in Bradley Co... Covered in 30 minutes between 11:00 and now(11:30).

[Lumber_Jack]

Cotton kills.

No blue jeans or cotton shirts. Synthetics or wool. Things that dry quickly. Layer for warmth. Nothing is waterproof but a frogs ass, so take dry socks and under layers to change if you get wet

[1morethan8]

If you need to ask what equipment and clothes you will need... maybe a weekend camping/backpacking trip like this one wouldn't be a real good idea? But it is a damn good way to find out what works and what doesn't!

The problem is not being properly prepared and this can get you in real trouble fast in cold weather.

It's best to get your "feet wet" in warmer weather... and your first winter trip from a base camp.

[JR2ATN]

That's what we called a white mans fire. White man builds a big fire and sits far away. Indian builds a small fire and sits close.

 

Too hard to cook this much salmon over a small fire.... :cool:

 

Edited February 2, 2013 by JMR1138

[runco]

That salmon looks good, wait its dinner time, I am hungry. Wife whats for dinner...............Oh I forgot its Saturday night, pizza or eat out.

[MattCary]

Watching too see the report on how it went.

[Guest Cogent Design]

It was awesome. My buddy and I got there after dark on Friday night, walked about 100 yards to a campsite, started a fire, pitched tents, and had some awesome fireside conversations. People really don't exaggerate what is talked about around a campfire. I barely knew the guy before. When we arrived it was 22 degrees according to his car's thermometer. For some reason my 0-10 degree bag wasn't keeping me warm. I'm not sure how they're rated, but I froze all night and woke up around 6:30 Saturday to the sound of frozen precipitation hitting my tent's roof. It wasn't snow and wasn't quite hail. It looked and felt like tiny styrofoam ball bearings. I went out chopped some firewood, built a fire, ate breakfast, then as we were packing, it started snowing. It stopped after dumping about an inch of snow on us. Not letting this deter us, we set out.

 

The first day we hiked a little over 8 miles to get to this cabin that was little more than 4 walls, a roof, and a fireplace. As previously stated, I'm just getting into backpacking. I've been camping before, but not like this. I used my 3 day bag from LAPG: (http://www.lapolicegear.com/diplomat-3-day-backpack1.html) and utilized the molle webbing to hold everything that I couldn't fit inside. I wanted to turn this into somewhat of a bug out kit test, so I tried to not take anything that would normally not be in my bug out bag. One of the first lessons I learned was that carrying a ~35 pound bag sucks, and it sucks a lot more when the ground is covered in snow and in some places there are hidden sheets of ice underneath. This is where I learned that landing on one's Glock with all of one's body and backpack weight doesn't make it go off. I knew this ahead of time, but it was reassuring to test it out. We hiked through the freezing for maybe 5 hours with breaks every 30 minutes or so seeing along the way some awesome views!

 

Upon arriving at the cabin, we rested for a bit and in the waning light went out for some firewood. The normally difficult task of cutting logs into firewood side pieces proved to be nearly impossible in our exhausted state. We got enough to last well into the night, made a fire, cooked dinner then I fell asleep around 6:30. Around 8pm, a couple more backpackers entered the cabin, ate dinner, and went to sleep. It was a public cabin that could sleep 15 or so, so it wasn't a big deal. Saturday night, it got COLD. I woke up shivering multiple times, my experienced friend did the same. He woke up in the middle of the night to find our new friends spooning in front of the fire. Awkward.

 

Sunday morning after breakfast, we set out along a different trail and hiked about 9 miles back to the parking lot. This hike was easy compared to the grueling experience we endured the day before and we made excellent time, it only took us about 3 hours.

 

The trip was a lot of fun. I was mentally prepared for it, and adequately prepared in a physical sense in terms of having stuff I needed. My bag was overly heavy, so next time I will be sure to cut down the weight. That goes for my bug out bag as well. I packed heavily on water, 1 camel back, 900ml water bottle, and 3 regular water bottles. I could have managed solely on the hydration pouch's water supply. There were also plenty of streams from which I could've filtered water. Next time, I will go with the hydration pack and 900ml bottle. I also carried 4 cans of fruit, each weighing in at 15oz. I will not make that mistake again.

Other lessons include..

• Pack heavy things close to your body, so they torque your body less.
• Waterproof boots are a must, I slipped into a stream on both hiking days. Sucked.
• Wool socks are awesome.
• AR Magazine pouches make excellent granola bar carriers.
• Dryer lint is a great fire starter. Thanks for recommending that. My buddy used a vaseline/sawdust mixture that he favored.
• For that temperature weather, I had one too many layers of clothing. I was anticipating rain, so packed extra and didn't use it.
• Walking sticks are great for going up or down hills.
• Be sure the hatchet is sharpened
• Don't pig out on rest breaks. Eat a little bit each break so your stomach doesn't get upset.

On a somewhat unique note: I am gluten intolerant. It gives me terrible migraines, so I couldn't pack Clif bars nor can I eat much of what others eat. Basically, no flour unless it is derived from corn or rice. I made two bags of trail mix using nuts, Chex Mix, and chocolate chips, had eggs for breakfast both days, and ate some fruit. It did a good enough of a job sustaining me, but I do have some improving to make in that area.

 

Again, it was a lot of fun. Hiking 8+ miles a day was terrible with so much weight on my back, but I don't regret it. Everybody I met on the trails or at other campsites was super nice and genuinely wanted to talk. Lastly, I was able to hone my map reading and fire starting skills along with a little bit of first aid. Most importantly perhaps, is that I am more of a man now than I was 3 days ago.

[eRay]

Take a couple of road flares. They smoke like crazy and smell but they are super hot and burn for 15 minutes. I have started lots of wet brush fires burning with them. They are so hot that I have started a fire from a pile of coal along the railroad track with no kindling.

[1morethan8]

For the most part, sounded like a great trip!

 

Can you tell us what area you were in?

 

Did you wear a toboggan cap during the night? You loose a lot of heat from your head.

Did you have a pad under your sleeping bag? This will help break the cold from the bottom. You can also use your heavy coat under the bag.

Never wear all the clothes you plan to wear the next day to bed. But keep part of them in your bag so you can put them on when you get up, that way you won't be as cold when you get out of the bag and have warmer cloths to put on.

Edited February 4, 2013 by 1morethan8

[peejman]

Trade that 900ml water bottle for an old-fashioned hot water bottle.  Heat some water over the fire and put the bottle between your legs in the sleeping bag.  It'll keep your lower body warm. 

 

Hiking sticks are a must with a heavy pack.  I normally hike with about 35 lbs as well...  22 lbs of 2 yr old + 8 lbs of child carrier pack + 5 lbs of diapers, wipes, water, and snacks.  Falling isn't an option. 

[Lumber_Jack]

You could have two issues with your sleeping bag

1) it's not a great bag an 10 degree rating is optimistic for this bag

2) you had too much clothed on to allow your bag to heat properly. I don't sleep naked but definitely just underwear. Also fresh socks before bed helps. Otherwise you may just need a better bag. Remember you were pushing the limits of the bags ability. 10 degree bags aren't comfortable at 10 degrees, but should be great for ~30 degrees. For really cold camping I'd recommend a sub zero bag. Also make sure it's drawn up tight around your head. Any body heat escaping hurst the process. Edited February 4, 2013 by Lumber_Jack

[monkeylizard]

As was said above, bag ratings mean that's the point at which it will help you survive, not feel like you stayed at a Holiday Inn. If it was 22 when you arrived, the temps probably dropped more as the night went on. I'd say that bag did what it was supposed to do. It kept you alive in temps just above its rating. I've always heard a 30 degree rule is a good one to follow for comfort in cold weather. Subtract 30 degrees from the temps of where you'll be sleeping, and that's the rating you want. In your case, you were probably in the teens, so you'd have wanted something in the (-10)~(-20) range. If it had dropped down closer to zero on your second night, that would explain the shivering. You really pushed the limits on the bag but it did it's job. You'd have wanted a (-30) or so bag to be warm without some form of supplemental heating.

 

The water bottle tip above works, but it's heavier than the "Hot Hands" shake-em up warmers. Toss them in your bag and stay toasty. The downside is that they are not reusable like the water bottle. They're good for a weekend of camping, not so good for SHTF prepping.

 

I'll second the ground pad/air matress. It's almost a necessity in cold weather and a real comfort in all weather. There are some good ones that pack up small and are light weight. REI in Brentwood has lots of them that you can try out in their store if you don't already have one.

Edited February 4, 2013 by monkeylizard

[Guest Cogent Design]

Here's a link to the area. It was in the South Cumberland State Park. http://www.friendsofscsra.org/parkmap.htm We hiked up the North Rim, and returned via the North Plateau.

 

On the sleeping thing, I had a pad, but I'll try putting my heavy coat under me in the future in addition to it. The water bottle between the legs is a great idea! I had a toboggan on while sleeping. I did consider removing more clothes to stay warmer in the sleeping bag, but didn't want to freeze to death. lol Is that the right thing to do for mummy bags. The bag is also an Ozark Trail from Walmart. I paid about $35 for it. I realize it's on the cheaper end, but I still expected more out of it.

 

Thanks for the feedback!

[Guest Cogent Design]

As was said above, bag ratings mean that's the point at which it will help you survive, not feel like you stayed at a Holiday Inn. If it was 22 when you arrived, the temps probably dropped more as the night went on. I'd say that bag did what it was supposed to do. It kept you alive in temps just above its rating. I've always heard a 30 degree rule is a good one to follow for comfort in cold weather. Subtract 30 degrees from the temps of where you'll be sleeping, and that's the rating you want. In your case, you were probably in the teens, so you'd have wanted something in the (-10)~(-20) range. If it had dropped down closer to zero on your second night, that would explain the shivering. You really pushed the limits on the bag but it did it's job. You'd have wanted a (-30) or so bag to be warm without some form of supplemental heating.

That makes sense. You posted this before I replied. Assuming my bag is okay, I'll be sure to better equip for next time.

[1morethan8]

Your bag was the main problem.

If you plan to winter camp outside a lot, this would would be a good start...

 

http://www.goldnuggetsurplus.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Store_Code=gnasi&Screen=PROD&Category_Code=SB-sleeping-bags-sleeping-bags&Product_Code=SB004

 

You can find them at a lower price by searching, and they do come "used".

 

Sorry.. no short cuts to quality.

[monkeylizard]

When  you start looking at outdoor gear for pushing any envelope, you have to usually pick 2 of the following 3:

• Weight/Size
• Cost
• Performance

The gold nugget linked above is low cost and good performance, but it's 9 lbs and bulky.

 

Marmot's top-end cold weather bag has great performance and is just 5 lbs, but it's expensive at $699 MSRP.

http://marmot.com/products/cwm_membrain?p=429

 

You experienced what it means to pick #2 over #3  :)

 

 

FYI - Don't store your sleeping bag in its stuff-sack. A compressed bag's fill will lose its loft and become less fluffy. That means less effective at keeping you warm and less padding between you and the ground. http://www.rei.com/learn/expert-advice/caring-sleeping-bag.html

Edited February 4, 2013 by monkeylizard

[Lumber_Jack]

I'll say this. I have a marmot 15 degree bag and I've never been cold, even when sleeping at temps in the teens. It cost about $160-200. I can't remember, but I've had it for almost 10 year.

[Lumber_Jack]

My bag came with a storage sack, about the size of a kitchen trash bag to store it in. That's about the size you need for a "man" size sleeping bag to not loose it's loft as monkey lizard mentioned above

[monkeylizard]

Right. The storage sack is different than the compression stuff sack that you'd use while actually backpacking with it. I ruined a perfectly good Kelty bag by not knowing this. Now it's just a warm weather bag. I'll have to go buy a new one if I ever try the cold stuff again. In other words...the Kelty is just fine. :)

[peejman]

Here's another excellent source of info on all manner of gear....  http://www.backpacker.com/gear/

[Moped]

If you are set on carrying that much weight, I would go with a true hiking backpack with an internal frame. The weight is distributed much better.than is a Assault Pack.  A lot of them have the pouch for a hydration pouch too.

[Randall53]

Wait till spring...you won't have to worry about all that crap....!!! LOL

[Wyldk2]

I agree with the above post. I don't camp in the winter.  Have to carry enoughto keep warm, and still not carry too much or it gets heavy.

 

Maybe look into a lightweight tyveck/thermal bag to use with your current bag. I have one and it gets hot but allows your feet to breathe.

[Glenn]

I used to winter hike a lot in the 70's and 80's. We either couldn't find or couldn't afford a lot of ultralight gear. It was not unusual to start out a 4 or 5 day winter trip with 50 to 60 lbs in an external frame pack. Once played pack mule for several older people and carried 110 lbs up Leconte. Probably why I have the knees of an 80 year old man. 

 

Winter was the only time I liked to go. I was in the mountains the weekend it got to -24 in knoxville. Our thermometer just went to -30 and passed that early in the day.

[Wyldk2]

Now, atv camping i can do. Just not the hiking/camping part. I used to hike and camp, but got out of that once i got into my other hobbies.