Mag Ban Bill in the House

[mav]

The constitution grants no rights to the citizens of this country. It only acknowledges that which they already possess merely by breathing. When the very government that is supposed to protect those rights and liberties sees fit to trample over them, it makes itself an enemy of the people and of the constitution it is supposed to follow. I don't know whether you just still think there is hope of righting the ship at the ballot box, or if you have the oath you took to the constitution confused with loyalty to the government. I would posit that both positions are incorrect.

Let me be perfectly clear here. The federal government has become an enemy of the constitution and an enemy of the people it is supposed to protect and defend. At this point, the people of this country are well justified in using whatever means are at their disposal (including just shooting the bastards) to dissolve the current bonds and form new ones.

This divide isn't about Republican or Democrat or who wins an election. This is about the being on the side of liberty or tyranny and the federal government has firmly come down on the side of tyranny.

 

Sir, that is well said.

 

The biggest problem I had with some of the earlier arguments is that armed resistance is not a legitimate course of action, and those that engage in such are nothing more than terrorists.  I think that is a pant load, and shows a severe lack of understanding of the founding of this country.

 

That said, I in no way advocate the use of violence against the government.   As I stated earlier, I do not believe we are nowhere near to that point.  I did mention that gun (meaning all guns) confiscation would certainly be a justifiable reason in engage in such action.  Yes, there are politicians that would like to do that very thing, Bloomberg for example.  Disarming the populace is denying individuals the right to defend themselves which I believe is paramount in the principles of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. 

 

I do not see this happening, so I am not really concerned about it.  However, if it did happen, the use of armed resistance is certainly legitimate and a justifiable course of action. 

[DaveTN]

The real question Dave, is how much liberty and freedom will you allow the government to strip away, how much s#%^ will you allow yourself to be force fed before you sack up and do something about it?

I’m setting in my house in Tennessee. I can own most common guns, others I can own for a fee. I can carry a gun most places I go. Sack up? Why do I need to sack up? What do you think I should do?

I led you down the path to taking over our nation’s capital and then ask you, “What now”. You didn’t have an answer. What do I need to be doing now? What freedoms of mine have been stripped away?

I did want to overthrow the government when I was a smoker and the states decided they knew better than business that smoking should not be allowed in businesses. But I quit smoking and got over that.

Everyone on here said they didn't like smoking and that the state was doing the right thing and "helping" businesses.

[mikegideon]

Sir, that is well said.

 

The biggest problem I had with some of the earlier arguments is that armed resistance is not a legitimate course of action, and those that engage in such are nothing more than terrorists.  I think that is a pant load, and shows a severe lack of understanding of the founding of this country.

 

That said, I in no way advocate the use of violence against the government.   As I stated earlier, I do not believe we are nowhere near to that point.  I did mention that gun (meaning all guns) confiscation would certainly be a justifiable reason in engage in such action.  Yes, there are politicians that would like to do that very thing, Bloomberg for example.  Disarming the populace is denying individuals the right to defend themselves which I believe is paramount in the principles of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. 

 

I do not see this happening, so I am not really concerned about it.  However, if it did happen, the use of armed resistance is certainly legitimate and a justifiable course of action. 

I agree... I think. All this talk is based on what-ifs. This is a little different than most. This REALLY is gun gunfiscation that will be introduced to the senate, and a president that will support it to the letter when it's introduced. The intent is there. The action will be there in a couple of days.

[mcurrier]

[quote name="DaveTN" post="872433" timestamp="1356908226"]Our founding Fathers never intended the 2nd amendment to be used by a bunch of azzhats to justify killing Americans because they aren’t happy with the current administration.We have a set of checks and balances in place. If they fail to point of us taking up arms against each other our country will be in total collapse.I am an American. I will never turn my back on my country.[/quote]Glad you cleared that up for us.

[mav]

I agree... I think. All this talk is based on what-ifs. This is a little different than most. This REALLY is gun gunfiscation that will be introduced to the senate, and a president that will support it to the letter when it's introduced. The intent is there. The action will be there in a couple of days.

 

Yes, I am using this as nothing more than a theoretical exercise.  There are some that believe there is never any justification to use force of arms to reinstitute a new form of government.  Some also believe that the SCOTUS is the final arbiter of what is and what is not constitutional.  They are wrong on both counts.

 

On the latter, it is the states who are supposed to be the final arbiters on what is constitutional.  I cannot find any mentioning of judicial review granted to the supreme court in Article III.  If there were, that would mean that the federal government, which the states created, could make up their own rules at the expense of the states and people. 

 

On the former, there is indeed a time when taking up arms is certainly justifiable.  Granted, there are some who want to do it if their taxes are increased.  I am pretty moderate when it comes to talk of armed resistance.  I view it only as the last resort of a free people wanting to ensure their freedoms.  I guess in some people's eyes, that makes me un-American.  Oh well, there is nothing I can do about that.

Edited December 31, 2012 by mav

[mikegideon]

A lot of it is just TGO banter. No sense in agreeing when you can have a real good argument on the way to agreement. :)

 

If they attempt gun confiscation, we're ALL gonna take it very seriously. President Penut Head intends to do exactly that. Just has to go thru his motions first.

[DaveTN]

A lot of it is just TGO banter. No sense in agreeing when you can have a real good argument on the way to agreement. :)

 

If they attempt gun confiscation, we're ALL gonna take it very seriously. President Penut Head intends to do exactly that. Just has to go thru his motions first.

Absolutely, it’s just discussion. I’m not pizzed at anyone. But besides the forum, we have to be careful in discussing overthrowing the government and shooting people. There are agency’s that will act on that kind of stuff. But it could be I just don’t understand how those things work. ;)

[mav]

Absolutely, it’s just discussion. I’m not pizzed at anyone. But besides the forum, we have to be careful in discussing overthrowing the government and shooting people. There are agency’s that will act on that kind of stuff. But it could be I just don’t understand how those things work. ;)

 

I am certain I was put on some sort of list a long time ago. :tinfoil:

[mikegideon]

Absolutely, it’s just discussion. I’m not pizzed at anyone. But besides the forum, we have to be careful in discussing overthrowing the government and shooting people. There are agency’s that will act on that kind of stuff. But it could be I just don’t understand how those things work. ;)

I don't expect the government to be overthrown to begin with. I'm expecting the mother of all street fights

[DaveTN]

I don't expect the government to be overthrown to begin with. I'm expecting the mother of all street fights

That’s what I’m saying. A few radicals try something and they will be taken out in a heartbeat. If they open fire they will be killed and painted as terrorists.

I don’t think the government will come after my guns in any way, but that doesn’t mean what you are describing won’t happen. I think there are some (Misguided Patriots for lack of a better name) that want a revolt and picture themselves as someone our founding Fathers would be proud of.

I hope we have some advance warning on this fight so I can schedule my nap accordingly.

[Chucktshoes]

A lot of it is just TGO banter. No sense in agreeing when you can have a real good argument on the way to agreement. :)

If they attempt gun confiscation, we're ALL gonna take it very seriously. President Penut Head intends to do exactly that. Just has to go thru his motions first.
Absolutely, it’s just discussion. I’m not pizzed at anyone. But besides the forum, we have to be careful in discussing overthrowing the government and shooting people. There are agency’s that will act on that kind of stuff. But it could be I just don’t understand how those things work. ;)

Yep. Pretty much this.

I am certain I was put on some sort of list a long time ago. :tinfoil:

This too. If I am not on ALL the watch lists then somebody isn't doing the job they are being paid for. Of course, we are talking about government employees so you never know.

[Chucktshoes]

Double Tap. Edited December 31, 2012 by Chucktshoes

[Guest 6.8 AR]

That’s what I’m saying. A few radicals try something and they will be taken out in a heartbeat. If they open fire they will be killed and painted as terrorists.

I don’t think the government will come after my guns in any way, but that doesn’t mean what you are describing won’t happen. I think there are some (Misguided Patriots for lack of a better name) that want a revolt and picture themselves as someone our founding Fathers would be proud of.

I hope we have some advance warning on this fight so I can schedule my nap accordingly.

They usually are painted by our government as terrorists. Whatever they want the media to say is what those

people will be called. The Constitution does provide for dealing with tyranny and overthrowing that tyranny. It

probably should have happened a long time ago, but we let it keep on pushing us deeper in over our head. There will be a time when it is called for, after we realize our vote has been reduced to ashes. I'm holding out for common sense to prevail, but it sure is getting frustrating.

 

The pattern I keep seeing is just flat troubling. Dave, I doubt anyone around here wants to start trouble, but I

am beginning to see trends that don't look too promising. It could be just a matter of time. I certainly hope not, but I see the writing on the wall every time a gun ban, or something else gets traction. Obamacare will kill our economy and a gun ban would make us powerless to defend against everything else the DC crowd can think of. Do you see it stopping any time, soon?

 

No concessions, at all. They have lost the argument and if anyone caves on anything concerning guns, they can rot in Hell.

Edited December 31, 2012 by 6.8 AR

[Guest ThePunisher]

[quote name="DaveTN" post="872486" timestamp="1356911826"] What is a Constitutional right and what is not will be determined by the Supreme Court of the United States; not by a thug threatening me with a gun.[/quote] The soon to be liberal commie dominated SCOTUS will be the arbiter that rubber stamps everything the WH Dictator enacts by EO that will enslave you and your offspring the rest of your days. They will trample the Constitution you and I love so dearly. Yours and my Constitution will soon be burned and outlawed by these commie bast**ds, and everyone will have to declare allegiance to the commie manifesto.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I have that same concern.

[m16ty]

The odds of no bans happening is starting to look better. Saw BHO in a interview on Meet the Press today and even he is starting to backtrack. I don't think he's changed his mind on the matter but he doesn't seem to want to talk about it much anymore. Even the liberal talking heads are starting to have doubts they can get something passed. I guess it could be a ploy to get us to let our gaurd down though. Everybody was all excited right after the shooting but Americans have a short attention span and they seem to be loosing interest.

[Will H]

^^^  One can only hope.

[mikegideon]

The odds of no bans happening is starting to look better. Saw BHO in a interview on Meet the Press today and even he is starting to backtrack. I don't think he's changed his mind on the matter but he doesn't seem to want to talk about it much anymore. Even the liberal talking heads are starting to have doubts they can get something passed. I guess it could be a ploy to get us to let our gaurd down though. Everybody was all excited right after the shooting but Americans have a short attention span and they seem to be loosing interest.

Yep. They definately enjoyed this one more than most.

[RAJTENN]

Hopefully the Dems will add $30B of "PORK" to any gun or magazine ban and the Republicans will kill it.

[K191145]

They usually are painted by our government as terrorists. Whatever they want the media to say is what those
people will be called. The Constitution does provide for dealing with tyranny and overthrowing that tyranny. It
probably should have happened a long time ago, but we let it keep on pushing us deeper in over our head. There will be a time when it is called for, after we realize our vote has been reduced to ashes. I'm holding out for common sense to prevail, but it sure is getting frustrating.
 
The pattern I keep seeing is just flat troubling. Dave, I doubt anyone around here wants to start trouble, but I
am beginning to see trends that don't look too promising. It could be just a matter of time. I certainly hope not, but I see the writing on the wall every time a gun ban, or something else gets traction. Obamacare will kill our economy and a gun ban would make us powerless to defend against everything else the DC crowd can think of. Do you see it stopping any time, soon?
 
No concessions, at all. They have lost the argument and if anyone caves on anything concerning guns, they can rot in Hell.

There's still many ways to protest and resist right now without starting a hot civil war, if some mag ban is passed and I can't find new mags to buy all I can do about that is write my reps, but if some kind of registration or turn-in bill is passed, millions of gun owners can resist by not acknowledging such an un-constitutional law. I keep reading some who seem to fear that if you resist there will be armed storm troopers breaking down your door, just how many LEO's, feds, soldiers etc. are there? Are there enough to search "MILLIONS" of households for guns? I certainly don't plan on caving in and hope no one else does because we are just too many for the government to deal with and I believe they can't completly trust all the LEO's and military personell to follow orders to attack American citizens. We may have an opportunity to put the politicians back in their place somewhat, at least show them that the people still ultimatly rule.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

And that's what needs to happen, first.

[m16ty]

There's still many ways to protest and resist right now without starting a hot civil war, if some mag ban is passed and I can't find new mags to buy all I can do about that is write my reps, but if some kind of registration or turn-in bill is passed, millions of gun owners can resist by not acknowledging such an un-constitutional law. I keep reading some who seem to fear that if you resist there will be armed storm troopers breaking down your door, just how many LEO's, feds, soldiers etc. are there? Are there enough to search "MILLIONS" of households for guns? I certainly don't plan on caving in and hope no one else does because we are just too many for the government to deal with and I believe they can't completly trust all the LEO's and military personell to follow orders to attack American citizens. We may have an opportunity to put the politicians back in their place somewhat, at least show them that the people still ultimatly rule.

 

What they will do is just go after a few and make a really bad example out of them. Most of the rest will fall in line for fear it will happen to them. All it would take is just a couple of raids covered by the media where they drag the guy and his wife out in cuffs (or kill them in a shootout), take everything he owns, and put his kids in foster care.

 

They wouldn't get them all but they would get most of them and most of the ones left will be buried deep in the ground.

[mikegideon]

What they will do is just go after a few and make a really bad example out of them. Most of the rest will fall in line for fear it will happen to them. All it would take is just a couple of raids covered by the media where they drag the guy and his wife out in cuffs (or kill them in a shootout), take everything he owns, and put his kids in foster care.

 

They wouldn't get them all but they would get most of them and most of the ones left will be buried deep in the ground.

 

It won't be that cut and dried.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

What they will do is just go after a few and make a really bad example out of them. Most of the rest will fall in line for fear it will happen to them. All it would take is just a couple of raids covered by the media where they drag the guy and his wife out in cuffs (or kill them in a shootout), take everything he owns, and put his kids in foster care.

 

They wouldn't get them all but they would get most of them and most of the ones left will be buried deep in the ground.

That's always a possibility. Depends on how low they wish to stoop. They've done it before. Almost sounds like

something Dean Koontz wrote.

[Chucktshoes]

What they will do is just go after a few and make a really bad example out of them. Most of the rest will fall in line for fear it will happen to them. All it would take is just a couple of raids covered by the media where they drag the guy and his wife out in cuffs (or kill them in a shootout), take everything he owns, and put his kids in foster care.

They wouldn't get them all but they would get most of them and most of the ones left will be buried deep in the ground.
That's always a possibility. Depends on how low they wish to stoop. They've done it before. Almost sounds like
something Dean Koontz wrote.

Or Bracken.