Has anyone experienced a refusal to use the TGO face-to-face form?

[Punisher84]

Ok, first of all I never mentioned your age and frankly I don't care how old or young you are.

Second, I replied to canyn's post because at first it sounded like he was trying to say that your arguments were logic based when they clearly weren't.

I was trying to draw a distinction between opinion and logic, because I don't really like your opinions or your insinuation that we people who don't care for the FTF form need to just "chill" and that we are being overly paranoid.

s

Most of that wasn't directed at you anyway dariks. Since, we are on the topic though...

Lo-gic -noun 2.a particular method of reasoning or argumentation.

It's in the eye of the beholder. My logic is very simple, use the form or don't, but to have a 15 page thread war over a simple disagreement of opinion is silly and people could take a second and

I stand by the fact that many people are overly paranoid about the transfer of information. I'm not saying I wouldn't be cautious, but sometimes things are taken to an extreme. Whether that is a product of furiously typed replies that fail to reflect the full intent of the poster or their own true beliefs is something I can't diagnose for certain.

[Guest canynracer]

Ok lets get this out in the open. I really could not give a rats behind about your age because guess what....I'm the same damn age. You say that you are only speaking your opinion and age shouldn't matter. This is true. But your original post was not an opinion. It was intentionally making fun of people because you don't agree with them. Maybe some of the "wiser" people on this forum are right. Because if you think that this post quoted above is a simple statement of opinion, you have a very twisted perspective. Complain if you want punisher, but acting like you are in the 3rd grade will not get you respect here.

I think you need to re-read the original...there is nothing there making fun of anyone any less than any of the others that have responded to this thread.

This board is full of opinions, and they are all valid unless the are demeaning and meant as some form of attack.

So complain all you want mjwehrman, but whining like you are in the 2nd grade will not get you respect here....(doesnt sound like an attack...does it?)

[Warbird]

I wouldn't be crabby if I didn't get attacked every time I state MY opinion on a matter and then get blasted for being young. I've said it before and I will say it again, "It's not the years, it's the mileage." I deal with people twice my age day in and day out that don't know jack and couldn't form a free-thinking opinion about waffles, let alone debate constitutional rights.

I don't care if I'm agreed with, but until there is an age requirement here, and I'm obeying the rules, I'd at least like to hope my opinion could be debated and not my age.

Edit: Removed my age on my profile. Level the playing field a bit. Now maybe we can deal with issues and not birthdays.

I'm sorry you took such great offense. As I said I did not intend to simply dismiss your opinion and I certainly did not say it was worthless.

I agree that you certainly know more than many much older, however there are some of us who not only have age but a lot of miles on this course. For me it's in the millions and its worldwide in this fight. So, I know from where I speak.

My point was simply that it is not paranoia or paranoia w/o basis that gives some of us our opinions. I have seen the cycle and I have seen the rights dismantled in other countries, witnessed it first hand. I have seen it happen here in this country. When someone suggests that others are simply paranoid and they should chillout and get a grip or whatever some have suggested, I pointed out that there is a strong basis for some people to feel like they do. They have the mileage and the years and the wisdom to see the potentials.

So I hope you never have to fight the defensive fight, though I think you will at least by being an involved citizen. There are things which are fact and known by logic and reason and there are things known by experience. We haven't had a bad fight in 14 years now, but those days and the days leading up to it were to be the tip of the ice berg here in this country. That is our fact and that is our history. So just as you say do not call me young and ignorant, I say don't call me paranoid or ridiculous for understanding the sentiment of those who do not desire to leave behind them trails. It in no way means that they have ANYTHING to hide and I resent the implication by whoever said it.

As for me I don't care if you sign a form or not, I really could not care less. I have rarely done so, and I would have to decide on any particular situation if I would again on a private sale. I understand that is the law for a gun shop, that's their law not mine as a private citizen. I exercise my rights fully when need be.

Oh and thank you for your service to our country punisher. I for one greatly appreciate it.

Edited June 11, 2008 by Warbird

[Punisher84]

Ok lets get this out in the open. I really could not give a rats behind about your age because guess what....I'm the same damn age. You say that you are only speaking your opinion and age shouldn't matter. This is true. But your original post was not an opinion. It was intentionally making fun of people because you don't agree with them. Maybe some of the "wiser" people on this forum are right. Because if you think that this post quoted above is a simple statement of opinion, you have a very twisted perspective. Complain if you want punisher, but acting like you are in the 3rd grade will not get you respect here.

I'll admit that the first part of the post was inflammatory, but if you think I'm the only person on this forum that has ever posted something like that you're mistaken. There are 50 year olds on this forum that have lowered themselves to downright name calling.

Also, there is plenty of opinion in my post. I clearly stated my opinion when I said this...

If I was doing an FTF and someone said no to that form, they are going home empty handed. Just my viewpoint on it.

You think I have a twisted perspective? Why because I don't agree with what was said or that the majority of this thread has been nothing, but inflammatory posts and has dealt very little with the real issue at hand?

As for the last sentence in your reply, well I don't really see how I've acted like a 3rd grader, but to each their own OPINION.

[Guest canynracer]

back to the topic at hand, The form may ask a little too much, but it would not matter to me...

I would ask for a bill of sale that had the Firearm info, and some seller info....I would like to see the DL just so I know that the name hasnt been faked, but I understand if they did not want the number recorded.

[Punisher84]

I'm sorry you took such great offense. As I said I did not intend to simply dismiss your opinion and I certainly did not say it was worthless.

I agree that you certainly know more than many much older, however there are some of us who not only have age but a lot of miles on this course. For me it's in the millions and its worldwide in this fight. So, I know from where I speak.

My point was simply that it is not paranoia or paranoia w/o basis that gives some of us our opinions. I have seen the cycle and I have seen the rights dismantled in other countries, witnessed it first hand. I have seen it happen here in this country. When someone suggests that others are simply paranoid and they should chillout and get a grip or whatever some have suggested, I pointed out that there is a strong basis for some people to feel like they do. They have the mileage and the years and the wisdom to see the potentials.

So I hope you never have to fight the defensive fight, though I think you will at least by being an involved citizen. There are things which are fact and known by logic and reason and there are things known by experience. We haven't had a bad fight in 14 years now, but those days and the days leading up to it were to be the tip of the ice berg here in this country. That is our fact and that is our history. So just as you say do not call me young and ignorant, I say don't call me paranoid or ridiculous for understanding the sentiment of those who do not desire to leave behind them trails. It in no way means that they have ANYTHING to hide and I resent the implication by whoever said it.

As for me I don't care if you sign a form or not, I really could not care less. I have rarely done so, and I would have to decide on any particular situation if I would again on a private sale. I understand that is the law for a gun shop, that's their law not mine as a private citizen. I exercise my rights fully when need be.

I can live with that response. When you speak of fights, I may not have fought the same fights you are referring to yet, but being of the generation I am, and being raised the way I was I have fought long and hard to be accepted, and that is way I take offense at remarks about my age.

I won't go into a life story here, but let's just say that for 23 years of age I have seen and done quite a bit. I don't think that earns me points or respect by any means, but I'd like to think that my posts could be argued on the basis of that post alone and not how many years I've walked the earth.

Agree to disagree. And thank you for the comment about service

Edited June 11, 2008 by Punisher84
thank yous

[Guest canynracer]

Group hug anyone???????

[Punisher84]

Group hug anyone???????

Oh..wow. Umm no I'm good. How about we all just go get a beer or something? Oh man...geez.

[G27]

[Guest canynracer]

LMAO!!!

OK....How bout NOW?????

[Punisher84]

YAY GROUP HUGS!!!!!!!!!!!

[Guest theolog]

Much better in post #152. Thanks be to God, I was temporarily blinded by the other one.

[The Rabbi]

How come I feel like a smoke?

[Punisher84]

How come I feel like a smoke?

LOL

[Guest theolog]

How come I feel like a smoke?

Because you realized that despite everything, you still love me?

[The Rabbi]

Because you realized that despite everything, you still love me?

Actually it was the hot sweaty guys....

[G27]

So what's the over/under on the number of people in this thread that hit xuqa.com?

[Punisher84]

So what's the over/under on the number of people in this thread that hit xuqa.com?

LOL. I thought they were friend's of Canyn. I was about to be angry I never got an invite to THAT party.

[Guest theolog]

Actually it was the hot sweaty guys....

I knew it had to be one of the two.

[Guest canynracer]

LOL. I thought they were friend's of Canyn. I was about to be angry I never got an invite to THAT party.

If they were friends of mine, I would never leave the house....

[Guest mjwehrman]

This thread kinda reminds me of an old song "They're coming to take me away ho ho ha ha. To the funny farm where life is wonderful all the time!" :rolleyes:

This is really the only part of the post I had a problem with. And earlier some other people in the thread implying that by me not giving out personal information that I must be a criminal or plan to commit a crime with the firearm purchased. Punisher, I agree with the rest of your post. I have no hard feelings against anyone who wants a bill of sale. I understand it completely, I just choose not to do it. I spoke harshly and apologize to you and anyone else I have offended.

[Punisher84]

This is really the only part of the post I had a problem with. And earlier some other people in the thread implying that by me not giving out personal information that I must be a criminal or plan to commit a crime with the firearm purchased. Punisher, I agree with the rest of your post. I have no hard feelings against anyone who wants a bill of sale. I understand it completely, I just choose not to do it. I spoke harshly and apologize to you and anyone else I have offended.

I don't agree with the "they must be a criminal" theory, but I am a paperwork kinda guy. That comes from getting burned on one used car sale, and when someone else tried to burn me on another deal. I have no hard feelings either, if you don't want to fill out the form no big deal. I'll keep my gun and my peace of mind.

Edit: It appears though that you have admitted to being a criminal and got blasted for it in the mall thread. Carrying without a permit? Really man, just go get the damn license. http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/showpost.php?p=111159&postcount=23

Edited June 12, 2008 by Punisher84

[G27]

Personally, I don't plan on selling any guns (I sold them all already, right after that tragic boating accident - really!), but when I buy, I'd prefer not having a paper trail. If we ever need to utilize the 2nd to protect the rest, I think we're better off having some that are 'off the record'...

[Guest db99wj]

So what's the over/under on the number of people in this thread that hit xuqa.com?

:raiseshand::P

[Guest mjwehrman]

Edit: It appears though that you have admitted to being a criminal and got blasted for it in the mall thread. Carrying without a permit? Really man, just go get the damn license. http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/showpost.php?p=111159&postcount=23

Not quite sure what you mean by getting blasted for it. Nobody blasted anyone. And as soon as I have the funds available I will have a permit, but as it is I am still new to this state and have not had the chance yet.