DC gun ban

[Guest jackdog]

I thought we were discussing not arguing.

But perhaps if one disagrees with you it then becomes an augment.

[Guest jackdog]

hey skip my last post, I have them to thanks for the apology

[molonlabetn]

I think I'll chime in...

On fighting our government and military through civilian resistance:

- It has indeed been shown in other conflicts that a primitively armed, well-organized group of people can cause heavy losses to advanced units with more training. But, I have two contentions with this line of thinking...

- 1. The greater there is a technology and armament gap between opposing forces, the more an 'underdog' needs to rely on stealth and unpredictability. They cannot go head-to-head. All that an occupying force needs to do is cause a standoff, meanwhile cutting off vital supplies to the resistance. If the resistance is not nimble, and cannot pare down the opposition quickly through attrition, the occupiers have effectively won. The only way for a resistance movement to have success without superior or equivalent weaponry, is to take out the leadership... If the leadership is un-touchable, then the only way for a resistance force to stand up to a military is to have heavy weapons, or the ability to effectively destroy heavy weapons. So, with this in mind, the outlook for being able to 're-take' the US from a tyrannical government is grim... at best we could hope to hold our own, to be thorn in their side, with only small arms.

- 2. The need for private, unrestricted ownership of military-style equipment is based mainly (in my mind) about principle. Humans have a RIGHT to self-defense, and historically have been required to defend themselves from over-bearing 'official' entities which were threatened by 'revolutionary' concepts of liberty, and attempted to squash them. The 2nd Amendment directly addresses this, in wording and intent. Gun-owners are the ultimate check and balance keeping the government at bay against the brink of tyranny, and in that regard we should be able to back that obligation up with the means to actually perform that function. So, it is not so much about resistance strategy (yet)... it is about clinging to the undeniable principle of liberty set forth by those who outlined this experiment for that very purpose! When we completely lose that right, it is already too late to fight for it within the constraints of the present system.

The DC gun ban has fallen... May more anti-liberty strongholds fall in the same way! The legal/political system is a battle-ground unlike any other, one which cannot be approached lightly, or have any assurance of victory... I look forward to a SCOTUS ruling in favor of 2A, but I'm not holding my breath either. Though it would be a solid step in the right direction.

[Marswolf]

Hell, American citizens aren't willing to fight for their freedom even when someone else is doing the killing and dieing. I wouldn't go into armed rebellion against the government with the current US populace as my ally. I think that day is past.

The reason for us to have military-style weapons is that the criminals can get them and it makes no sense to expect good citizens to protect themselves from these thugs with inferior weapons.

[molonlabetn]

Hell, American citizens aren't willing to fight for their freedom even when someone else is doing the killing and dieing. I wouldn't go into armed rebellion against the government with the current US populace as my ally. I think that day is past.

The reason for us to have military-style weapons is that the criminals can get them and it makes no sense to expect good citizens to protect themselves from these thugs with inferior weapons.

I agree that most aren't. It would become a fight for individual freedom, and not so much for collective freedom, since so many people are willing to sacrifice liberty for security... They do not deserve my blood.

But I am willing to fight... And if I was the only one, I still would be.

I deserve my blood, and the choice to take the risk of it being spilled for a cause I believe in.

[Marswolf]

Unfortunately (for me) I agree with you. I'm sure I'd die, but I'd get my quota, and they probably wouldn't be grunts.

[Guest jackdog]

I would like to believe that many of our members of the armed services would choose to fight to preserve our freedoms. Like a lot of you guys what America is becoming is to say the least scary as hell. More and more each day we move away from a republic and are becoming a democracy. Guess I would fight, yes probably die, ( getting hold sucks anyway) but America or the America I grew up in means that much to me.