Open carry: a bad idea

[partypilot1]

Well, if I did have to walk in downtown Memphis at 2 am wearing a tux with $100 bills sticking out. I for one, would want to be armed and prefer it to be visible. A concealed weapon is nice but you would probably look like a big target.

I see pro's and con's to both.

I see the need to open carry when you are put in a situation where YOU might be the victim ie. east Nashville, Memphis, any ghetto (some of us don't have the luxury to just avoid dangerous places)

I see the need to conceal when in Brentwood or Bellemead, where "IF" something did happen you can best decide "if and when" to use it.

OC, CC it's all about the best tactical situation, in which, your environment is a key factor

[John Wall]

If i were going to walk that walk in Memphis, I would want my PATROL RIFLE!!!

Take the HCP course, get extra training, keep it current and make up your own mind.

I train Armed Professionals and Citizens for a livelihood, and I don't know a single LEO who carries openly off duty. More than an openly carried firearm, your non verbal cues, posturing and body language will tip off a street wise thug or gang banger on whether you are a "Hard Target".

The professional looking fellow openly carrying had the look of a Hard Target. Many folks I see OC'ing do not have that look. This has NOTHING to do with carrying a firearm.

There is an older gentleman working at Gun City who openly carries a 1911. EVERY PART OF HIS BEING, FROM NON VERBAL CUES, POSTURING, TO LASER EYES LETS THE WORLD KNOW HE IS A VERY HARD TARGET. It is worthwhile to meet Larry. A nicer fellow you will not meet. The firearm will NOT substitute for Situational Awareness. Trust me, you will NOT get the drop on him. He is one of few Armed Citizens who has "THE LOOK". When you go in the shop, you will not have to ask for him.

If you are going to OC, get some style of quality retention holster and get retention training. It is NOT Kung Fu or Rocket Science.

You have Fire Insurance, a spare tire and such and never expect to use it. The same rationale should apply to defending your life and the life of others.

[Guest canynracer]

As is typical in these open carry is bad threads no evidence is ever presented to prove open carry is dangerous. It is just a bunch of feelings that are thrown around as fact.

And yet, you have not provided anything except "its legal"

Just cause something is legal, doesnt make it right.

[Guest HunterH]

I train Armed Professionals and Citizens for a livelihood, and I don't know a single LEO who carries openly off duty. More than an openly carried firearm, your non verbal cues, posturing and body language will tip off a street wise thug or gang banger on whether you are a "Hard Target".

The professional looking fellow openly carrying had the look of a Hard Target. Many folks I see OC'ing do not have that look. This has NOTHING to do with carrying a firearm.

Absolutely outstanding info and well said. I could not agree more!

[Fallguy]

I agree how your carry yourself, head up/head down, aware of your surroundings or oblivious to what's going on can make you appears as a hard or soft target regardless of carry or not.

And that OC does not automatically make you appear as a hard target, and that OC with the tendencies of being a soft target is a dangerous situation.

Oh...and I've known several LEO's that OC of duty...even had their badge on their belt. .....one even about 3 counties over at the cellphone store with me.

[Marswolf]

I have to agree. If you are going to OC, you have to have the look that you can and will use that handgun on your side, rather than just trying to impress your friends with it. Few people have that look unless they are in a uniform or dressed in a way that gives them that look that they should OC for some official reason.

[Guest HunterH]

Oh...and I've known several LEO's that OC of duty...even had their badge on their belt. .....one even about 3 counties over at the cellphone store with me.

I promise I am not trying to be a smartass, but when I think of OC with a badge on the belt, all I can think of is Walker: Texas Ranger. On the bright side, I think we could all use a little more Chuck Norris in our lives.

[Fallguy]

I promise I am not trying to be a smartass, but when I think of OC with a badge on the belt, all I can think of is Walker: Texas Ranger. On the bright side, I think we could all use a little more Chuck Norris in our lives.

LOL...+1 on Chuck

[DaveTN]

I love this one being bandied about. Cite some facts or even word of mouth story where this happened.

Cops open carry and it happens to them a lot.

[Fallguy]

An officer being shot while attempting to arrest someone or incident to a traffic stop or serving a warrant or any other time actively engaging in law enforcement duties is a little different than if he gets shot while waiting in line at Wendy's.

Both happen and both are tragic, but I'd venture to say that the largest majority of LEO shootings involve the first set of circumstances, not that later.

[Guest 70below]

The professional looking fellow openly carrying had the look of a Hard Target. Many folks I see OC'ing do not have that look. This has NOTHING to do with carrying a firearm.

I agree fully with your statement, because he is not an easy mark a felon would not want to risk that situation. My point was more to emphasize on the other hand he was not viewed as a threat from John and Jane Q. Public because he carried himself in that manner. For all they know he could have been a mafia hit man, but his charisma and look were that which people take to. And you're right, there are VERY few people that can pull that off, or should try, it definitely wouldn't work for me.

[Guest HunterH]

I agree fully with your statement, because he is not an easy mark a felon would not want to risk that situation. My point was more to emphasize on the other hand he was not viewed as a threat from John and Jane Q. Public because he carried himself in that manner. For all they know he could have been a mafia hit man, but his charisma and look were that which people take to. And you're right, there are VERY few people that can pull that off, or should try, it definitely wouldn't work for me.

I would just add that when OCing in a suit or dress cloths, the general publis likely assumes you are an LEO or somekind. (likely a detective or federal agent of some type.) I know I would assume that if I saw an someone in a suit with a gun on their belt. The way they carry themseves is still the paramount factor IMO.

[molonlabetn]

Depends on why you're doing it. There are plenty of occasions I'd prefer to conceal... but I've got 2 good reasons for sometimes not:

1. Comfort. Why not stay nice and cool with just a t-shirt without having to carry a mouse-gun or subcompact?

2. Education. The more people who know that it is legal, positive and normal for good people to have a gun, the easier it is to 'recruit' new shooters. Besides, what is the point of any other kind of pro-gun exposure if we are scared and ashamed of our own?

[DaveTN]

An officer being shot while attempting to arrest someone or incident to a traffic stop or serving a warrant or any other time actively engaging in law enforcement duties is a little different than if he gets shot while waiting in line at Wendy's.

Both happen and both are tragic, but I'd venture to say that the largest majority of LEO shootings involve the first set of circumstances, not that later.

Sorry, I missed the part where he was standing in line at Wendy’s.

I was responding to Mike implying that no one that open carries has ever had their gun taken from them and used on them.

Cop involved shootings are documented. Why and how they occurred are used as training tools.

I guess I need to check the database of Tennessee HCP holder involved shootings to see if that has ever happened. Oh wait…. I can’t find that information… maybe one of you guys can provide me with the source of that info.

[Fallguy]

My mistake. I didn't see where he had quoted the part about "taking your gun and using it against you" I thought he was talking about the argument that you will be targeted first because you OC.

But I would still argue the times that an officer gun is taken from him and used against him are more when he is actively engaged in LE duties, transporting/guarding a prisoner, wrestling with a suspect after a traffic stop and such as opposed to when he is sitting at the restaurant having lunch.

My main point is the bad things that happen to a LEO who OCs are more because of his position and actions as a LEO not simply because he OCs. Can the same thing happen to a HCP holder? Of course....but not as likely.

[DaveTN]

My main point is the bad things that happen to a LEO who OCs are more because of his position and actions as a LEO not simply because he OCs. Can the same thing happen to a HCP holder? Of course....but not as likely.

I agree that is far less likely for an HCP holder. I have been in Tennessee for 10 years and have only seen one person open carrying and he was an off duty cop.

I just don’t agree that it has never happened; but then we have no real way of knowing.

[Fallguy]

Oh I agree it probably has happened (never and always are rare) but just no real way to prove.

[Guest Engloid]

In a way I agree (I conceal), but consider this:

Cops don't conceal, and how often does a bad guy start a shooting in their presence. In other words, are the cops deterring crime, or only changing the place/time in which it happens?

[Fallguy]

Well...if it is changed to a time and location of when I'm not there...I'm all for it.

[TripleDigitRide]

Haven't y'all made up my mind yet? Is OC a good or bad idea?

[Guest nraforlife]

Haven't y'all made up my mind yet? Is OC a good or bad idea?

Guess the answer is a resounding YES depending on your personal view.

[Fallguy]

Guess the answer is a resounding YES depending on your personal view.

That's about it...good for some, maybe not so much for others.

[DaveTN]

Everyone has made up their minds. That happened before this thread and even before this forum. I don’t think there are very many people on the fence on this issue.

[mac12]

There's only one time that I OC'd and it wasn't an issue. It was during cold weather so I was carrying under a light jacket and went to my local rural babershop. I had to take the jacket off, of course, and didn't want to leave the gun in the car. If my barber noticed it he didn't say anything. That's the beauty of having it legal both ways.

[Guest ProguninTN]

Ah, An OC debate. I guess it's about time I come back around here.

I CC most of the time, but I do occasionally OC. Having skimmed the posts, perhaps everyone should float his/her own boat on means of carry. As far as legality goes, I can only speak for myself, but I will always fight to keep OC legal. We mustn't let our state be overrun with sheep.

ProguninTN