More gang activity

[Tennjed]

Alcohol is not bad. Alcohol abuse is bad.

You don't have to convince me that alcohol abuse is bad and causes other bad things to happen.

However, I have a better chance of winning the Powerball lottery and being elected president of United States and throwing the winning touchdown in a Super Bowl game and all happening on the same day compared to the chance of making alcohol illegal.

It's also a bit disingenuous of you to claim that you want to make pot legal and that doing so will reduce crime and gang violence when what you really want is to make alcohol illegal. If making pot legal is going to reduce crime and gang violence what the hell do you think making alcohol illegal is going to do?

Actually, we don't have to think about what making I'll call illegal will do because we already have plenty of experience with that.

alcohol is a poison so to say it is not dangerous is misguided

I said I prefer that alcohol be illegal, I also stated that that is not feasible. So if alcohol stays legal then I want pot legal. A certain % of alcoholics would become potheads if it was legal and I feel some lives would be saved and some crime go down on that alone. How much, I have no idea but it is worth it to find out. If 1 percent of alcoholics choose marijuana instead it would save lives and lower crime. I have not stats on that because it is not legal. But being in al-anon for several years I can tell you many gutter drunks who weeds in and out of jail now smoke pot only and they lead violent free lives. They hold jobs. They do stuff they couldn't while drinking.

I prefer total abstinence, but can tell you my experience with being around alcoholics and drug users is that is is hypocritical and absurd to argue alcohol should be legal but pot not

[piercedan]

Deja Vu, didn't we already run down this rabbit hole? I think the point that gangs and violence won't be solved by legalizing pot is very valid. These idiots will just shift their "business" to some other "product" that will bring in money. It's whack a mole.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

http://m.aol.com/dai...cid=dsk_df_news

Alcohol is more dangerous to society than illegal drugs such as crack cocaine and heroin, a new British study published in the medical journal The Lancet finds. The findings are a direct challenge to the systems of drug classification and legislation that currently prevail in most nations.

Scoring highest, alcohol was the most harmful drug compared to others in the study -- and by a wide margin. Part of the reason for this stems from the law of large numbers, professor David Nutt of London's Imperial College, who led the study, explained in a BBC interview. Because alcohol is so widely used, it has a huge impact on society. Alcohol scored 46 in the study's damage assessment system, followed by a distant second, heroin (21). In third place was crack cocaine (17), with tobacco, cannabis and cocaine rounding out the highest six.

You just lost any credibility you had.

I don't mind the argument(this one), but I do mind ragged quotations and bending puzzle pieces to make them fit. Take the politics

out of the argument and I'll go pop a pilsner.

I am not criticizing the Lancet or the publisher, but that doesn't make it credible any more than Mother Jones Diary.

You are driven for some other reason than that piece of published work. Anyone who wants alcohol banned and pot

made legal went over the cliff with granny in that DNC commercial. Or maybe Code Pink won you over.

"I prefer total abstinence, but can tell you my experience with being around alcoholics and drug users is that is is hypocritical and absurd to argue alcohol should be legal but pot not." And that is fine for you or any individual

who chooses to go that path, but when recognizing that ability, you shouldn't look down on everyone else who might disagree with you.

Keep a debate alive, but don't tell me how I should live my live. I get my marching orders from someone a

lot higher.

Edited September 27, 2012 by 6.8 AR

[Tennjed]

Deja Vu, didn't we already run down this rabbit hole? I think the point that gangs and violence won't be solved by legalizing pot is very valid. These idiots will just shift their "business" to some other "product" that will bring in money. It's whack a mole.

There is more to it than that. How much more jail space would we have if we legalized pot? Could we not keep the gang bangers in jail longer? Just because they switch doesn't mean you shouldn't do it. Making it harder from them to conduct their business has benefits

[Tennjed]

You just lost any credibility you had.

I don't mind the argument(this one), but I do mind ragged quotations and bending puzzle pieces to make them fit. Take the politics

out of the argument and I'll go pop a pilsner.

I am not criticizing the Lancet or the publisher, but that doesn't make it credible any more than Mother Jones Diary.

You are driven for some other reason than that piece of published work. Anyone who wants alcohol banned and pot

made legal went over the cliff with granny in that DNC commercial. Or maybe Code Pink won you over.

You are twisting my words and making puzzle pieces to make something fit your agenda. I never said I want alcohol illegal and pot legal. I said I want them both treated the same. A big difference. To keep your credibility you might not want to misquote me

Edited September 27, 2012 by Tennjed

[Tennjed]

You just lost any credibility you had.

I don't mind the argument(this one), but I do mind ragged quotations and bending puzzle pieces to make them fit. Take the politics

out of the argument and I'll go pop a pilsner.

I am not criticizing the Lancet or the publisher, but that doesn't make it credible any more than Mother Jones Diary.

You are driven for some other reason than that piece of published work. Anyone who wants alcohol banned and pot

made legal went over the cliff with granny in that DNC commercial. Or maybe Code Pink won you over.

"I prefer total abstinence, but can tell you my experience with being around alcoholics and drug users is that is is hypocritical and absurd to argue alcohol should be legal but pot not." And that is fine for you or any individual

who chooses to go that path, but when recognizing that ability, you shouldn't look down on everyone else who might disagree with you.

Keep a debate alive, but don't tell me how I should live my live. I get my marching orders from someone a

lot higher.

With all do respect are you not telling marijuana users how to live their life or looking down on them by promoting that it stay illegal?

[RobertNashville]

I'm starting to think that Mayor Bloomburg has moved from NYC to Memphis and is now posting on TGO.

And I'm going nuts trying to figure out how someone is is perfectly okay with outlawing alcohol because it's so bad and then disparages 6.8 for telling marijuana users how to live their lives.

[RobertNashville]

alcohol is a poison...

Really? Then why aren't I dead???

...so to say it is not dangerous is misguided

I have not said one word regarding alcohol being or not being dangerous.

More to the point; I could sit here and without even trying hard, come up dozens of things that are "dangerous" when they are misused or used in excess; should we make all those things illegal too?

[Guest 6.8 AR]

With all do respect are you not telling marijuana users how to live their life or looking down on them by promoting that it stay illegal?

No sir! I'm not telling anyone how to do anything. Your argument is flawed, or maybe it's your premise.

It was considered a problem by others in society before I came of age, and laws were passed, whether or not I agree

with them, and it doesn't matter what my thoughts are. Please don't say I twisted anything, okay?

All I said of substance, at least in my mind, was that I doubt that making mary and jane legal wouldn't affect gang related

crime go away, but that it would be replaced by some other crime after it was deemed not worth it, leaving a net change

of zero.

Society has made it's mind up on issues like these and many more, and has even changed it's mind a few times realizing

a mistake was made.

I say you want it legalized for some other reason. I don't know and I don't care, but your argument flipping the legality

of one to the other sounds like something dreamed up in Hollywood. Doesn't fly with me.

[Tennjed]

I'm starting to think that Mayor Bloomburg has moved from NYC to Memphis and is now posting on TGO.

And I'm going nuts trying to figure out how someone is is perfectly okay with outlawing alcohol because it's so bad and then disparages 6.8 for telling marijuana users how to live their lives.

I guess I am not clear enough. I would prefer it all because I think all of it is dangerous, but I know that is fantasy land and said so from the get go.(and i will admit it will most likely cause crime to go up, i just am uneasy with the nonchalant way alcohol is treated) i simple feel that to treat the 2 different is, let's say strange, considering the legal one is more harmful. I want pot legal as a substitute for alcoholics. I try to make the case by showing how people that use alcohol are in the same boat as people that use pot. To tell someone they should not be allowed to smoke pot while the same time drinking alcohol is, let's say strange. To not want to be told want you can and cannot drink but yet are comfortable telling others what they can and cannot smoke is, let's say strange. The dangers of alcoholic is well documented. The dangers of marijuana are not well documented.

I would like a perfect world where all of it is gone and crime doesn't exist, but that is not feasible and honestly selfish. So the most reasonable thing to do is legalize pot and treat it the same.

FWIW I respect all opinions, that what makes the world interesting but I hope to get some alcohol users to realize they are not being very fair to say marijuana should be illegal

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I'm starting to think that Mayor Bloomburg has moved from NYC to Memphis and is now posting on TGO.

And I'm going nuts trying to figure out how someone is is perfectly okay with outlawing alcohol because it's so bad and then disparages 6.8 for telling marijuana users how to live their lives.

Now wait a minute!. I just told them to go and enjoy

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I guess I am not clear enough. I would prefer it all because I think all of it is dangerous, but I know that is fantasy land and said so from the get go.(and i will admit it will most likely cause crime to go up, i just am uneasy with the nonchalant way alcohol is treated) i simple feel that to treat the 2 different is, let's say strange, considering the legal one is more harmful. I want pot legal as a substitute for alcoholics. I try to make the case by showing how people that use alcohol are in the same boat as people that use pot. To tell someone they should not be allowed to smoke pot while the same time drinking alcohol is, let's say strange. To not want to be told want you can and cannot drink but yet are comfortable telling others what they can and cannot smoke is, let's say strange. The dangers of alcoholic is well documented. The dangers of marijuana are not well documented.

I would like a perfect world where all of it is gone and crime doesn't exist, but that is not feasible and honestly selfish. So the most reasonable thing to do is legalize pot and treat it the same.

FWIW I respect all opinions, that what makes the world interesting but I hope to get some alcohol users to realize they are not being very fair to say marijuana should be illegal

I didn't tell anyone what they could or could not do.

Utopia doesn't exist, just like unicorns and fairies.

Take your argument and use it with handguns(assuming you're not Michael Bloomberg). What kind of gun do you carry?

Edited September 27, 2012 by 6.8 AR

[Chucktshoes]

As a proponent of legalization, I just want to state for the record that I have no desire to smoke pot. All it ever did was make me fall asleep.

[Tennjed]

I have not said one word regarding alcohol being or not being dangerous.

Well you kinda did

Alcohol is not bad. Alcohol abuse is bad.

.

Edited September 27, 2012 by Tennjed

[Tennjed]

I didn't tell anyone what they could or could not do.

Utopia doesn't exist, just like unicorns and fairies.

Take your argument and use it with handguns(assuming you're not Michael Bloomberg). What kind of gun do you carry?

I agree about utopia and said so in the post. Maybe I misunderstood you and I apologize if I did, I thought you were against legalzation of pot

I say you want it legalized for some other reason. I don't know and I don't care, but your argument flipping the legality

of one to the other sounds like something dreamed up in Hollywood. Doesn't fly with me.

I stated my reasons, as a safer alternative to alcohol And what doesn't fly with me are people that flip the legality of them saying one should be and one shouldn't be. It is not based on solid logic. The 2 should be treated the same. That is my main point. In fairy land all is illegal, but that is not going to happen, so both should be legal

Edited September 27, 2012 by Tennjed

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I agree about utopia and said so in the post. Maybe I misunderstood you and I apologize if I did, I thought you were against legalzation of pot

And what doesn't fly with me are people that flip the legality of them saying one should be and one shouldn't be. It is not based on idea solid logic. The 2 should be treated the same

Go back, please and read some of my posts. I have been on both sides of this arguments for completely different

reasons than you. There are "reasons" on both sides of this argument. There are consequences attached to decisions

made, either way. Society has made decisions, whether or not they are wrong, will take someone other than me to

decide, because I see no net benefit to society by changing this one. I do see net problems creeping up, though,

and I'm not interested in it particularly.

I do agree with the libertarian view of this, but I also see more important libertarian ideas than pot, at this moment.

I'm sorry, but I don't subscribe to the "Throw the baby out with the bath water approach", which you evidently do

on this issue.

My fingers are about to fall off. I want a beer, bad! Y'all have fun!

[Tennjed]

I do apologize if I misunderstood you. Before you have you beer tell me what the baby and bath water reference means I have never heard that one

And I do see benefits to society. The biggest getting non violent drug offenders out of our over crowded jails. I also see a benifit to a small percentage of alcoholics. How many i dont know but enough to justify it

I do apologize if I misunderstood you. Before you have you beer tell me what the baby and bath water reference means I have never heard that one

And I do see benefits to society. The biggest getting non violent drug offenders out of our over crowded jails. I also see a benifit to a small percentage of alcoholics. How many i dont know but enough to justify it. And lastly making drug dealers and gang bangers job more difficult

Edited September 27, 2012 by Tennjed

[DaveTN]

I agree about utopia and said so in the post. Maybe I misunderstood you and I apologize if I did, I thought you were against legalzation of pot

I stated my reasons, as a safer alternative to alcohol And what doesn't fly with me are people that flip the legality of them saying one should be and one shouldn't be. It is not based on solid logic. The 2 should be treated the same. That is my main point. In fairy land all is illegal, but that is not going to happen, so both should be legal

It’s not about fair, and whether or not drugs are legalized has nothing to do with alcohol. As someone that has pulled many bodies out of cars that was a result of DUI, I can assure you alcohol is a powerful drug. I guess one of the advantages of drugs is that when you take drugs you know you are going to be impaired. But there are still people that think they can handle their booze and not be impaired. It isn’t legal, and they aren’t treated as if it’s legal.

However… as I said “fairness†has nothing to do with it and alcohol will have little impact on the drug debate. I can get drunk on Saturday night, go to work on Monday morning and be just fine. If I were to take a piss test; I would pass. On the other hand, I could get high on Saturday night, go to work on Monday morning and be just fine. If I were to take a piss test; I would fail and lose my job.

On the other hand, if someone sober leaves work and kills someone on the way home in a vehicle crash; chances are they won’t go to prison. If someone stops for a few beers at the local bar after work and kills someone on the way home in a vehicle crash; chances are they will go to prison.

Is that fair? Nope, and you can make drugs legal if you want, but that won’t change how business handles testing positive. Life is not fair, and one has nothing to do with the other.

[DaveTN]

And I do see benefits to society. The biggest getting non violent drug offenders out of our over crowded jails.

The way I would fix the drug problem is cut the head off the snake. That means take out the biggest suppliers and cut the flow. However, these are so called “Non-Violent†offenders because they don’t get their hands dirty with the violence. Let them go?

Letting out “Non-violent†offenders sounds like good idea, but think about it. Shoplifters are non-violent offenders. Are you going to say that shoplifters no longer go to jail? Can you imagine the repercussions of that? Any other crimes you would like to do away with jail time for? How about burglary? Burglary is a non-violent offense, unless of course someone catches them in the act and gets killed by the burglar. Non-payment of child support is a non-violent offense and our jails are loaded with them. Let them all go? How about white collar crimes and scams, almost all of it is non-violent. Do they get to go free also?

[daddyo]

Just remember that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

[Ramjo]

Legalize weed and tax it like cigarettes you will cut down on crime and generate revenue. Enforce the law just like you would a DUI.

This probably would work.

[Jonnin]

lol hes doing 5 MPH on the interstate, darn stoned drivers!

[Guest 6.8 AR]

As a proponent of legalization, I just want to state for the record that I have no desire to smoke pot. All it ever did was make me fall asleep.

Same here! When I did it, I made sure there was a good source of junk food and a cozy couch nearby.

If there is a way to decriminalize pot without adding all the bureacracy and dealing with legal decisions and

existing prisoners with their burdens of society paying both ways, blah, blah, blah, and, oh yes the idea of

taxation which I don't see why this is necessary, and whatever else like all the safety considerations, please

tell how this can be accomplished easily.

[Tennjed]

The way I would fix the drug problem is cut the head off the snake. That means take out the biggest suppliers and cut the flow. However, these are so called “Non-Violent†offenders because they don’t get their hands dirty with the violence. Let them go?

Letting out “Non-violent†offenders sounds like good idea, but think about it. Shoplifters are non-violent offenders. Are you going to say that shoplifters no longer go to jail? Can you imagine the repercussions of that? Any other crimes you would like to do away with jail time for? How about burglary? Burglary is a non-violent offense, unless of course someone catches them in the act and gets killed by the burglar. Non-payment of child support is a non-violent offense and our jails are loaded with them. Let them all go? How about white collar crimes and scams, almost all of it is non-violent. Do they get to go free also?

I guess I needed to be more specific and spell it out. We should let out non violent marijuana users out of prison. Never meant to imply legalizing theft.

Your other argument about the piss test is easily solved by not firing someone who doesn't break the law

[Jonnin]

I guess I needed to be more specific and spell it out. We should let out non violent marijuana users out of prison. Never meant to imply legalizing theft.

Your other argument about the piss test is easily solved by not firing someone who doesn't break the law

specifically, let em out if their only offense was possession. Stealing is nonviolent.