Liquor Thread

[Mike.357]

Originally Posted by The Rabbi

If it was really good he'll post it again. And again.

I'm just upset my thread about whisky and ginger got zapped. I was having a ball with Mike.357 sharing knowledge. I seldom meet people who know so much about liquor.

Urse posted

You were wrong anyway. There is a huge difference between Old Grandad or Early Times Bourbon and Woodford Reserve or Blantons

Who are you referring to Urse?

Of course there is a huge difference between Grandad, Woodford and Blantons. I had already stated the big difference in bourbon is years aged. Woodford is a very soft bourbon aged a tad longer than four years, IIRC it is 8 year old. Never personally drank Blantons but I believe it is in the same league as Woodford. Both of which aside from aged longer are also single barrel bourbons. They are both higher proof as well, 92 maybe.

Most bourbons are blends of thousands of barrels.

Small batch bourbon is typically about 100 barrels blended.

Single barrel is just that. The bottle contains spirits from one specific barrel.

For that matter Early Times is not even a bourbon. Read the label, no claim to be bourbon on it. Early Times is aged in recycled bourbon barrels. At best it is KY whisky. For whisky to be bourbon one condition is that it is aged in a new charred oak barrel. Also ET is 80 proof

Old Grandad is bourbon and also fine product for the money. It is 86 proof and aged for four years IIRC.

[Guest Revelator]

In order for it to be called bourbon, does it also have to contain (or maybe be made with--I'm not really sure) 51% corn? And does it also have to come from--and this one's kind of funny to me--Bourbon County, KY? These are things I've heard. I don't drink dark liquors much anymore; I've switched to vodka. It's about the least unhealthy of the major liquors. But my favorite drink is and always will be a Manhattan.

[Mike.357]

rabbi posted on the "Tungsten screwed the pooch thread"

The aging issue. Bourbon doesnt age well past a certain time because of the cask charring. I think beyond 7 years or so you get a woody taste I dont like.

As the spirit ages it takes on flavors and tones from the barrel. Different stands of oak trees make barrels that offer different hints of flavor.

The woody taste you refer to is characterized as "Oakiness" or how "Oaky" the spirit is. Remember Scotch is aged in used barrels, so the flavor is doubly effected. I believe the smoothness that a bourbon can gain from extra years in the barrel is not available when scotch re-uses that barrel.

Aside from Oak there is a multitude of factors that go into individual flavors of different labels of bourbon.

[Mike.357]

In order for it to be called bourbon, does it also have to contain (or maybe be made with--I'm not really sure) 51% corn? And does it also have to come from--and this one's kind of funny to me--Bourbon County, KY?

Bourbon contains at least 51% corn mash and aged for two years. At one time there were very strict laws in what could be a bourbon. Now days there is a lot more latitude on that.

it is a common misnomer that bourbon must come from Bourbon County KY. That is not true. As I had posted in the Rabbi's original thread about whisky and ginger there is a bourbon on the market that is distilled in Virginia.

Bonded bourbon such as Evan Williams White Label must be 51% corn at minimum and aged in a newly charred white oak barrel, aged four years minimum and bottled at 100 proof. Also the timing of the tax being paid is involved. Bonded bourbon is not really a big deal anymore.

[Guest Revelator]

Laws against making your own stuff, laws against carrying in certain places. Ah, which is more silly? I'm going to say it's a tie. I had a homemade batch of East Tennessee moonshine one time that was pretty good. It was smooth. One bottle was regular 'shine, the other had cherries marinating in it. You could just eat the cherries and...WHOOO DOG!!

[Mike.357]

The last time I got some white lightning I put blackberries in it along with a table spoon of sugar. Softened it up a lot and made it taste a whole lot better.

I think I still have some in the mini fridge. Blackberry and also some peach.

It will get you there in a hurry. As for taste I prefer Jim Beam Black Label, for a few dollars more I like the Woodford Reserve.

There are a couple of brands of moonshine available in package stores around here.

One is called Georgia Moon. Comes in a jar. I have never tasted it and IIRC it was not a very good seller.

[Guest CleanSeries80]

i personally like Jager (the knock off Alpen Wolf is almost identical in taste) , 100 proof southern comfort and sometimes Admiral Nelson's spiced rum

[Guest darkstar]

I duuno about that moonshine stuff.....I had some one time that a guy in Atlanta gave me (it was from E. Tenn allegedly) fierce stuff. I saw a documentary about 'shine on national geographic a year or so ago. You never know whats in that stuff,,,I'm sure there are those who make it with care and quality and I'm sure there are those that dump whatever into it.

[The Rabbi]

On bourbon: to my knowledge the biggest determinant of taste is the mash used. More corn and it gets sweeter but lighter. I had some "corn whiskey" not too long ago. It was OK but wimpy. More rye and it gets heavier. Aging will affect it too of course.

I think bourbon must be at least 51% corn and aged in new oak casks. If you use re-used casks, like ET, then it cant be bourbon any more. "Bonded" means 100 proof and stored in gov't warehouses. I guess that's left over from the old days where a lot of whiskey was cut with lye or other nasty stuff. My great-grandfather drank a bottle of Old Overholt bonded rye a day. You can't buy the same stuff today, very watered down.

As for moonshine, the quick buck operators will throw a possum in the mash to speed fermentation and use an old car radiator for a condenser. Neither good ideas. The craftsmen do it right. I had some once and didnt care for it. Kind of a whanngy taste. I am told Hickman Co has the best stuff.

[DavidD]

Well, since it is a Liquor thread, I'll ask, Anyone else a Scotch lover? I generally drink Dewers 12 year old. I know, it's a blend and most really talk up the single malts but something about their 12 year old I just love. For my 40th birthday last October, Mom (yeah, can you believe it ) bought me a bottle of Johnny Walker Blue. No way I was dropping $230 for a bottle of Scotch just to piss it down the toilet but damn, it was good. I swear I copped a buzz just by smelling it, SMOOOOOOOOOTHE:drool:

[KahrMan]

Hey Mike.

In the last year or two I have really come to appreciate sipping bourbon. Jim Beam Black is my old stand by. Had some Woodford Revserve at Rabbi's and it was very nice. Any suggestions or favorites I should try?

[The Rabbi]

The best whiskey I have ever had was Van Winkle Rye. They dont sell many bottles and you'll have trouble finding it. But if you do it is the best.

DavidD, I think there are support groups out there for people like you.

Only time I like scotch is in the winter, just to warm up. The best one I ever had was a blend with a French name but unfiltered.

[Mike.357]

I would be concerned where moonshine is coming from. I was getting it from a dude who also sold beef jerky out of the trunk of his car, LOL. We made him a deal on Crown Royal for his wife and inturn he gave me a deal on shine and jerky. I tell you the jerky was ther best I have ever had.

The mix of corn mash and other grain definitely has a huge effect on the final product. I believe you are right on with what you say about that Rabbi.

Woodford is lighter and a bit more sour than the top of the line Evan Williams.

I beleive the Woodford has less rye. Makers Mark is a hotter bourbon which I believe has more rye. Jim Beam Black Label has maple syrup like finish tones to it that the Beam people say is due to the oak barrels it is aged in. I have done their taste test and if someway you ever get a chance to do that I recommend it. Leaned a lot on that bus.

Did you know that barrels being rotated around in the barrel house can change the flavor? Some barrel houses have massive operations to rotate barrels so they spend equal amounts of time at the different levels of storage.

Different oaks can give the spirit subtle flavor differences. These are very noticable on single barrel bourbons. With the blends and small batches is get harder to detect.

The Clan McGregor is pretty nasty stuff there Rabbi. Try to find something that comes in glass. Dotsun mentioned Grants. That stuff is affordable and tastes great.

[DavidD]

...DavidD, I think there are support groups out there for people like you......

I thought I was here!!!!!!

[Mike.357]

Any suggestions or favorites I should try?

Evan Williams Single Barrel is one of my favorites and price wise is in the Woodford range. I prefered it to woodford as it had a less sour taste but had exceptional smoothness on the finish and was not overly hot. I cannot think if the exact name of it but it comes in squatty square shaped bottle and would be in the single barrel section of the bourbons.

Bill, I never tried the Van Winkle but everyone says it is something very special. With most bourbons price can indicate quality and that being the case the Van Winkle ought to be that dang good.

[DavidD]

......We made him a deal on Crown Royal for his wife and inturn he gave me a deal on shine and jerky...........

:lol::lol: LMFAO

[gunsablazin]

Buffalo Trace bourbon is one of my favorites, try it you'll like it. Someone mentioned scotch, I don't usually drink it, but a friend gave me a bottle of Johnny Walker Black label it is a 12 yr. old blended whiskey that is quite good. My brother had a bottle of the Blue label and it is VERY good, at $225 for a 750 maybe a tad pricey though!

[Guest Grout]

No Fighting Cock fans here?. Heaven Hill Distillery looks out for us drunks,by providing good liquer at a reasonable price.

[The Rabbi]

Mike, I found the Evan Williams just a little weak. For me it was lacking something. Not every distillary rotates barrels. I went on the tour of Woodford Reserve and they told us they do not rotate barrels. They simply blend based on what's there. I think Jack Daniels does rotate them.

Van Winkle makes a bourbon that ought to be pretty good but the rye is speciual.

[KahrMan]

Buffalo Trace bourbon is one of my favorites, try it you'll like it. Someone mentioned scotch, I don't usually drink it, but a friend gave me a bottle of Johnny Walker Black label it is a 12 yr. old blended whiskey that is quite good. My brother had a bottle of the Blue label and it is VERY good, at $225 for a 750 maybe a tad pricey though!

I am finishing off a bottle of Buffalo Trace as we speak. This was my first bottle and only bought it because I liked the label. It is very nice though. I make it easy on the marketers. Thats why I thought I would ask for suggestions instead of going by the looks of the bottle.

[Guest eyebedam]

Ive been on a Vodka kick now for a couple years, its either Kettle one or Grey Goose on the rocks. I do like sippin on some on some GentlemaN JacK on occasion. Wild Turkey tends to get me in trouble.

[DavidD]

Yes, Grey Goose is awesome. I personally thinks it's the best Vodka out there but by no means am I a Vodka aficionado. As far as trouble, it's tequila for me . BTW Rabbi, isn't admitting the first step?????

[Magiccarpetrides]

Single barrel is pretty good, but I actually like Gentleman Jack better...its typically smoother plus I have found that the few times I was stupid enough to get drunk on single barrel I said some things I normally wouldnt say or bring up Im also a big fan of Woodford Reserve and for a change of flavor its hard to beat Captain Morgan Private Stock.

[The Rabbi]

Yes, Grey Goose is awesome. I personally thinks it's the best Vodka out there but by no means am I a Vodka aficionado. As far as trouble, it's tequila for me . BTW Rabbi, isn't admitting the first step?????

Yes! I hear that fondness for scotch can be cured.

In vodka I admit to liking Stolichnaya. If you like vodka and you like rye bread try Aalborg Akvavit. Straight from the freezer. With herring and crackers. That's Jewish soul food right there.

[Guest tokarev]

Hmmm, I guess that I'm the only one here that likes Wild Turkey. When it comes to vodka, Luksusowa potato and Belvedere rye is my favorites. Occasionly during the summer cookouts I'll have Captian Morgan's spiced rum with coke.