Aurora: Anyone notice something wrong with this picture?

[sigmtnman]

Perhaps I've missed this in another thread but in the image of the fire exit look at the ar-15.

If for some reason the picture cannot be seen, go here and check it out: http://www.dailymail...ath-Ledger.html

Now it could just be piss poor reporting which would not surprise me but I've read something to this extent from different sources:

It appears, the police say, that James E. Holmes, the man accused in the Aurora shootings, used all three types of weapons inside the theater as well, first firing the shotgun, then using the semiautomatic rifle until its 100-round barrel magazine jammed, and finishing off with a pistol.

http://www.nytimes.c...al-arsenal.html

Edited July 27, 2012 by sigmtnman

[DavidD]

^{That's certainly no "100 round Barrel magazine"}

Edited July 27, 2012 by DavidD

[gjohnsoniv]

What is a barrel magazine?

[Ebow1]

I think the reporter meant to say that it is shaped like a barrel, not knowing that they are commonly referred to as drum magazines. Also no there is not one present. I'm betting he was standing in the doorway and dropped the gun there when it jammed. Also, all this talk about hi-cap mag bans makes me want a 50 round drum mag for my 1911. Just to be ridiculous.

[E4 No More]

They probably meant "drum" magazine and got it wrong as usual. Nevertheless, that is clearly a fabrication most likely designed to inflame the masses.

[R_Bert]

yet there are fairly specific figures noted around the media, etc. on the number of rounds associated with the drum mag. Is it possible that he it dropped the drum after a hang-up, cleared the gun, and inserted a standard mag ? (not that I really trust any accounts on this, media, blogs, or else). Just pointing out it is possible that it used both types of mags.

[Oh Shoot]

Ya know, there's no telling what really happened. Seems likely that this guy never even fired any of these guns before he walked into the theater with them. For all I've heard, he may never have even fired a gun in his entire life!

I suppose, if we can believe it whenever it comes out, the exact number of rounds fired, the types of mags he had, and how many were left in each, might give a more complete picture. I'm beginning to wonder if most of the wounded folks were actually hit by sprayed birdshot, and there may have been a lot fewer actual shots fired than panicked eye witness reports seem to indicate.

I guess it's a good thing he didn't really know his stuff: I suspect that most any AR owner who has actually shot the thing for a while, assuming his intent was to do so, would have killed more than 12 folks under the same circumstances. Likely many more.

And really, similar results with a 9mm or larger caliber handgun with a buncha mags -- hell, Cho killed 32 with "only" 9mm and .22LR handguns at VA Tech.

- OS

Edited July 27, 2012 by OhShoot

[Guest rebeldrummer]

this is taken from the article...

..."he assembled a terrifying arsenal – including a Remington shotgun, an AR-15 assault rifle and 6,000 rounds of ammunition"...

if thats all it takes to assemble a TERRIFYING ARSENAL i would LOVE to see what they would call some this sites members' "arsenal" ha ha ha ha...

that is just crazy......

Edited July 27, 2012 by rebeldrummer

[BrasilNuts]

I saw that picture a few days ago and noticed what appeared to be a 30 round magazine, but I didn't really give it an more thought.

In another thread here on TGO it appears that he might not have been wearing any body armor and I bet when it's all said and done there is no 100 round magazine either.

Anti-gun agenda or just piss poor reporting?

[E4 No More]

yet there are fairly specific figures noted around the media, etc. on the number of rounds associated with the drum mag. Is it possible that he it dropped the drum after a hang-up, cleared the gun, and inserted a standard mag ? (not that I really trust any accounts on this, media, blogs, or else). Just pointing out it is possible that it used both types of mags.

Possible for sure, but the "report" was that the weapon jammed and he tossed it aside. I would imagine he didn't want to take the time to clear a jam and give some of the vitims a chance to flee.

[Chucktshoes]

Anti-gun agenda or just piss poor reporting?

Both.

[DaveTN]

Maybe be just dumped the 100 round mag that had jammed and replaced it with a 30. My wife said she heard on the news that he went out to his car and was returning, but someone shut the door.

[vontar]

Yea I remember reading on CNN on the outside of the link it was referred to as an AK47 like weapon or similar and then inside the article it was told to be a AR15. My thought was they had to work in AK47 just because they could and more people outside the gun community would know that name quicker then an AR15. Plus everyone know the AK47 is evil right? I remember seeing the AK47 on the top 10 guns and they said it was so reliable that even John Wayne would carry one because he was practical. They guy said if he was going to an Alien planet and could only take 1 gun with him, it would be an AK47. But even though it appears to me he had a AR15, their is allot of talk about the AK47. Not that the type of gun means much but they probably feel it would be easier to try to ban an AK47 because people associate it with evil. Inanimate objects are tools at the very best. Evil comes from the person that holds the tool. That is why we need more sane people to also hold the correct tools.

[~48_South~]

Well from the testing I have done personally over the years,after reading the story I thought it was a miracle that more people hadnt been killed since he was using a "AK47" in a crowded theater then I saw the above picture while researching on my own and noticed the AR and instantly thought to myself that explains it. In theory the numbers killed and or injured would have been much higher had he used a 7.62x39 do to its ability to penetrate way better than 5.56, either way it is a horrifying event and my heart goes out to all of the victims and their families.

Edited July 30, 2012 by ~48_South~

[Oh Shoot]

/... In theory the numbers killed and or injured would have been much higher had he used a 7.62x39 do to its ability to penetrate way better than 5.56, ...

Horse pucky. The guy didn't know what he was doing. Fortunately. Not gonna be surprised to find he never actually shot a gun in his life, let alone the ones he recently bought.

Cho killed 32 with a 9mm and .22 handgun at VA Tech, moving around the campus no less. Breivik killed 69 in Norway, and wounded another 110, moving around an island with a lot more room for people to run. With a Mini14 and "only" .223.

Most anyone who owns an AR and shoots it much at all would have killed many more folks than The Joker did, given the resolve to do it. I'm sorry, but your claim about 5.56/.223 (whichever he used) versus 7.62x39 being the reason is just a caliber holy war fallacy.

If actual exact ballistic and wound statistics are ever released, I'll bet we'll find that a good number of those wounded were hit with scattered shotgun shot, too. We don't even know what type shot he used, but sounds like it wasn't buckshot. [edit: We also don't know how many treated in the various hospitals weren't even shot, but just injured. actually, we do now]

The death count was incredibly low, IMO, and perhaps a contributory factor was that he may have obscured his own targets somewhat with the smoke, but it didn't have anything to do with choice of calibers. Just seems pretty obvious to me that mostly, again fortunately, he just wasn't an experienced competent shot, may have mostly just sprayed and prayed, may not have actually gotten off all that many AR rounds period what with the reported jam and whatnot.

Main point though is that even a non-tactical trained mere range shooter with single 9mm pistol could have easily killed more than 12 in a packed theater. Fortunately this lunatic was a firearms incompetent one.

- OS

Edited July 31, 2012 by OhShoot

[~48_South~]

Horse pucky. The guy didn't know what he was doing. Fortunately. Not gonna be surprised to find he never actually shot a gun in his life, let alone the ones he recently bought.

Cho killed 32 with a 9mm and .22 handgun at VA Tech, moving around the campus no less. Breivik killed 69 in Norway, and wounded another 110, moving around an island with a lot more room for people to run. With a Mini14 and "only" .223.

Most anyone who owns an AR and shoots it much at all would have killed many more folks than The Joker did, given the resolve to do it. I'm sorry, but your claim about 5.56/.223 (whichever he used) versus 7.62x39 being the reason is just a caliber holy war fallacy.

If actual exact ballistic and wound statistics are ever released, I'll bet we'll find that a good number of those wounded were hit with scattered shotgun shot, too. We don't even know what type shot he used, but sounds like it wasn't buckshot. We also don't know how many treated in the various hospitals weren't even shot, but just injured.

The death count was incredibly low, IMO, and perhaps a contributory factor was that he may have obscured his own targets somewhat with the smoke, but it didn't have anything to do with choice of calibers. Just seems pretty obvious to me that mostly, again fortunately, he just wasn't an experienced competent shot, may have mostly just sprayed and prayed, may not have actually gotten off all that many AR rounds period what with the reported jam and whatnot.

Main point though is that even a non-tactical trained mere range shooter with single 9mm pistol could have easily killed more than 12 in a packed theater. Fortunately this lunatic was a firearms incompetent one.

- OS

Wasnt trying to start a caliber war, ballistically the 7.62x39 has alot better penetration than 5.56 so collateral damage should have been way higher had he used that over 5.56. Kind of the same concept as if he had used a Barrett M107 with 2 mags loaded with 707 Grain AP, just not quite to that extreme. I was simply saying we are lucky he went with a rifle that fires a round that travels at extremely high velocity and is designed to fragment on impact rather than punch on through to whatever is behind the original target which in this case would have more than likely been another victim. When there are that many targets in one place stacked on top of one another maximum penetration would seem to be ideal.