Looking at 308 semi auto rifle... M1A ?

[Guest Shep Stoner308]

Let me start off by saying that I have never owned anything other than what I currently own, shotguns, pistols and one rifle a 22 speedmaster 552. So my knowledge of other semi auto rifles is quite limited to what I have been reading and trying to learn in studying the various semi automatic rifles. So please be a little easy on my mistypes or misunderstandings. :-)

After a few months of study, I realize that I cannot afford the high end AR 10 market, and recently I have honed in on the M1A as my rifle of choice, as it could serve as a dual hunting and survival rifle. I know it uses 308 or 7.62 Nato, or so I understand. I want the higher caliber instead of the 5.56 for its ballistics and impact on target and range of fire with accuracy. I am wondering also if it can use (without modification) the various sizes of 7.62? 39 or 51 for example? To be able to use various sizes of ammunition would be valuable in certain circumstances as many of you already know.

Any comments or discussion that you can provide is appreciated, thanks.

[Caster]

The M1A is extremely accurate and a very good rifle, but they can likewise be VERY picky on what they like. Heavy for caliber bullets are a no no. GOOD magazines are not cheap at all.

For what you get a good M1A for you should be able to find a decent AR10. There were a couple for sale in the classified here recently.

Do you reload? If not, there are actually more options as there are good rifles that are not reloader friendly. The CETME for one is very reliable and accurate as long as you stay away from Century's rubbish. The RomakIII/PSL can be found in 308 as well as the VEPR & Saiga wich are both very good rifles. They chew up brass a bit, but can be tweaked to shoot very well for TN distances.

[jtmaze]

I was in Walmart acouple of weeks ago and they had an ar10 for $897. I remember dpms lower don't remember any other specs

JTM

Sent from my iPhone

[Guest Shep Stoner308]

Thanks Caster, I do not reload, or at least not yet anyway. I have looked at the AR 10s. The CETME stuff appears to have mixed reviews, some hate it others love it. Maybe its the Century stuff, I need to pay more attention to that, thanks for the tip. So the M1A is very particular then with ammo, that's ok too I suppose. You have given me much to compare with, thanks!

Edited July 12, 2012 by Shep Stoner308

[Guest Shep Stoner308]

I was in Walmart acouple of weeks ago and they had an ar10 for $897. I remember dpms lower don't remember any other specs

JTM

Sent from my iPhone

Thanks..... But I am looking for something to buy directly from a resident seller.

Edited July 12, 2012 by Shep Stoner308

[RED333]

I have a Saiga that is stapmed for both(.308 and 7.62 x 61) ammo.

It does put a case dent part way back, not to big a deal for me.

It is good out to 300 yrds(have not had a chance to shoot further).

I here the Veprs are good as well, dont know anything about it.

My son has a CETME that is nice, shoots out 300 yrds very well,

My S308 shoots brass better than steel ammo, my Sons CETME likes the steel

cases better. I picked up a bunch of ammo, both steel and brass a few months

back, so we are set for a bit.

[gjohnsoniv]

Or you could also start building up your own AR 10, and probably come out with a much better rifle than one buy. Might not be the best way for you, but it is an option to explore.

[atlas3025]

Welcome to the board!.

I am wondering also if it can use (without modification) the various sizes of 7.62? 39 or 51 for example? To be able to use various sizes of ammunition would be valuable in certain circumstances as many of you already know.

A BIG "NO". For the most part, in any semi-auto battle rifle chambered for 308 or 7.62 x 51/NATO (7.62 NATO is another name for 7.62 x 51), either is fine. BUT 7.62 x "anything else" cannot be used. They are totally different cartridges. There are MANY 7.62 x "Something elses" out there...so be aware that you will ONLY use "NATO" or "x 51"...or 308, of course.

I don't know what you are calling a "high-end" AR-10, but I see good ones all the time for $900-1200, and I would prefer one of them over an M1A for what you are talking about. I have had a full sized M1A and the Socom model, and LOVED them both. But you can get a good AR-10 AND Optic for the price of an M1A.

M1A's are much more limited as far as any customization you may want to do as well, and heavy...but they are excellent guns IMO and can serve you well.

I now have a FN SCAR 17...and HOLY CRAP...I am in love. The price is up there with the high end AR-10's...but this thing is in a different league.

Good luck with your purchase!

Edited for welcome!

Edited July 12, 2012 by atlas3025

[peejman]

You need to decide what level of accuracy you're willing to accept. If you want/need true 1 MOA accuracy, then the AR-10 or M1A are the only options I can think of. If 2-3 MOA accuracy is acceptable, that opens up the selections... CETME, FN FAL, .308 Saiga, ...

Be wary of using .308 WIN ammo in a gun stamped 7.62 NATO and vice versa. The two cartridges are slightly different.

[1gewehr]

If you are on a budget as you seem to be, you might look into the 6.5 Grendel on an AR-15 platform. Aside from the bolt, barrel, and magazine, it uses every other part in common with a normal AR-15. I have an AR-15 built up in this caliber and the accuracy and long-range energy are excellent. I recommend a 20" barrel to get the best performance from this cartridge. Out past 300 yards, the 6.5G has as much energy as the 7.62x51. The 6.5G has been used to hunt everything from bunnies to elk. There is nothing in Tennessee that is too large to hunt with it.

JT has some excellent quality kits and rifles at good prices. That's where I got mine and it's been reliable and accurate.

http://jtdistributing.net/store/kits_6_5_grendel.html

Ammo is pretty reasonable. You can get excellent quality target ammo from Hornady ($22/box), and very good reloadable ammo from Wolf Gold ($13/box). Wolf will also be bringing in steel-case plinking ammo next month for about $8/box.

Another advantage is that the AR-15 is the 'Swiss Army Knife' of firearms. You can get conversions to shoot a host of cartridges from cheap target practice with .22lr to the shoulder-bruising energy of the .50 Beowulf.

Here's a link to get you started on calibers other than 5.56/.223 for the AR-15.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_121/492215_AR15_Variants__Caliber_specific_FAQs.html

A confusing thing about calibers is that many have more than one name, or names that are easily confused with other cartridges. Just as an example, the .308 cartridge you are interested in shooting is known as .308 Winchester, 7.62x51mm, 7.62NATO, 7.62 T65, 7.62 M80 (USGI), 7.62 F4 (Aussie), 7.62 L1A1 (Brit), etc. There are minor differences between the commercial .308 and military-spec 7.62 cartridges. For your purposes, they are irrelevant. Any rifle you are interested in can handle the higher pressures allowed with .308 ammo.

[TMF]

I miss my M1A. It was the last rifle I sold and have regretted it ever since. It ate everything I fed it; I can't say that the cheap milsurp stuff performed well out to distance 'cause I didn't try, but it still went bang and hit stuff out to 100m. You should be able to find a quality AR-10 variant for around the same price, if not cheaper, as an M1A. I can promise you if you get an M1A you will not be disappointed, but then again if you pick up a DPMS in .308 from wally world you probably won't regret that either.

Edited July 12, 2012 by TMF 18B

[Caster]

This ain't pretty but it's a very accurate rifle.

http://www.fnhusa.com/le/products/firearms/model.asp?gid=fng022&fid=fnf049&mid=FNM0137

[Guest Scramasax]

I am finishing an upgrade on my last M1a this week. Archangel stock and utg rail. I also have a 10X Leupold scope for it. For an all environment all theatre battle rifle it is hard to beat. I also own a fal para, another proven rifle that is hard to beat. Got rid of the socom, good rifle but too heavy and loud for the usable velocity. Building an AR10 from scratch with JP matched upper and lower, just because. Owned HK 91in the past, good gun just didn't like the way it shot. Looked at a Vepr and impressed with what I saw but haven't had a chance to shoot one. If I could only afford on MBR it would be a standard M1a. The action will take more abuse and trash in it and still work. You don't have to break it open to get the crud out, just lock the bolt back and p in it. As far as magazine go you get what you pay for and there are plenty of reasonable priced ones out there.

Due to health problems I don't shoot or carry any of the MBRs much anyMore I've switched to the 15 size platform. Correct loads will give me a 300yd. Effective zone of fire with any of the current calibers. I do prefer the 300 Blackout, just an American thing about 30cal. Bullits.

Btw I carried a M14 in CA and an FAL in SA both worked well.

Cheers,

ts

[DaveTN]

I have a DPMS 308 Panther (AKA…AR10), I don’t think you could buy a used M1A for what they cost new. If you are on a budget you can get a real military M1 Garand (30-06) for $600; years down the road it will be worth more than a copy of an M14.

[Moped]

If it were me, I would go with a AR. The M1A is expensive and unless you are just lucky, you won't get one to shoot 1 MOA out of the box. You have to put some more money into it for that. Quality mags for the M1A tend to be a problem as well, but I bet the AR mags are just as expensive as good M1As. There should be more upgrade parts for the AR than the M1A too. If the AR breaks down, then repair parts will be cheaper than for the M1A as well. The AR is definitely not as heavy as the M1A if you are going to carry it to the field, as well.

I used to shoot the M1A in the military on a Rifle team and they are great rifles, but I don't think the base models are worth the money.

[Guest Shep Stoner308]

This ain't pretty but it's a very accurate rifle.

http://www.fnhusa.co...049&mid=FNM0137

That's pretty darn ugly, I have seen a few of those FNH's for sale here in the sellers section. Been curious about them, not too sure if I can get over the appearance if that makes sense.

[Guest Shep Stoner308]

If you are on a budget as you seem to be, you might look into the 6.5 Grendel on an AR-15 platform. Aside from the bolt, barrel, and magazine, it uses every other part in common with a normal AR-15. I have an AR-15 built up in this caliber and the accuracy and long-range energy are excellent. I recommend a 20" barrel to get the best performance from this cartridge. Out past 300 yards, the 6.5G has as much energy as the 7.62x51. The 6.5G has been used to hunt everything from bunnies to elk. There is nothing in Tennessee that is too large to hunt with it.

JT has some excellent quality kits and rifles at good prices. That's where I got mine and it's been reliable and accurate.

http://jtdistributin..._5_grendel.html

Ammo is pretty reasonable. You can get excellent quality target ammo from Hornady ($22/box), and very good reloadable ammo from Wolf Gold ($13/box). Wolf will also be bringing in steel-case plinking ammo next month for about $8/box.

Another advantage is that the AR-15 is the 'Swiss Army Knife' of firearms. You can get conversions to shoot a host of cartridges from cheap target practice with .22lr to the shoulder-bruising energy of the .50 Beowulf.

Here's a link to get you started on calibers other than 5.56/.223 for the AR-15.

http://www.ar15.com/...cific_FAQs.html

A confusing thing about calibers is that many have more than one name, or names that are easily confused with other cartridges. Just as an example, the .308 cartridge you are interested in shooting is known as .308 Winchester, 7.62x51mm, 7.62NATO, 7.62 T65, 7.62 M80 (USGI), 7.62 F4 (Aussie), 7.62 L1A1 (Brit), etc. There are minor differences between the commercial .308 and military-spec 7.62 cartridges. For your purposes, they are irrelevant. Any rifle you are interested in can handle the higher pressures allowed with .308 ammo.

This is alot of information to digest for a newbie, there are many many things to consider obviously, its somewhat overwhelming for a person that knows just enough right now to get in trouble with a poor choice on a first purchase, I will study those links and put to memory your comments, thank you so much 1gewehr.

[Guest Shep Stoner308]

Welcome to the board!.

A BIG "NO". For the most part, in any semi-auto battle rifle chambered for 308 or 7.62 x 51/NATO (7.62 NATO is another name for 7.62 x 51), either is fine. BUT 7.62 x "anything else" cannot be used. They are totally different cartridges. There are MANY 7.62 x "Something elses" out there...so be aware that you will ONLY use "NATO" or "x 51"...or 308, of course.

I don't know what you are calling a "high-end" AR-10, but I see good ones all the time for $900-1200, and I would prefer one of them over an M1A for what you are talking about. I have had a full sized M1A and the Socom model, and LOVED them both. But you can get a good AR-10 AND Optic for the price of an M1A.

M1A's are much more limited as far as any customization you may want to do as well, and heavy...but they are excellent guns IMO and can serve you well.

I now have a FN SCAR 17...and HOLY CRAP...I am in love. The price is up there with the high end AR-10's...but this thing is in a different league.

Good luck with your purchase!

Edited for welcome!

What would you consider to be a good AR10 with the price range of around $1000? Links would be welcome, thank you for the imput and information.

[Guest Shep Stoner308]

I have a DPMS 308 Panther (AKA…AR10), I don’t think you could buy a used M1A for what they cost new. If you are on a budget you can get a real military M1 Garand (30-06) for $600; years down the road it will be worth more than a copy of an M14.

I have been searching primarily one site for rifle prices, http://www.gunbroker.com/, what other sites would you recommend getting an idea of average prices from? Thanks for your comments!

[dlm37015]

from personal experances

m1 a great match rifle great choice

fnfal great rifle shoots everything very well

hk91 great rifle shoots everything as well but ruins brass

ar10 i have a very early one from fairchild ind. shoots great can control on full auto

ar 10 new one tack driver

remington 7400 belive it or not shoots like a house afite but pickey about ammo

for myself if i had to pick one it would be the m1a

[jcoosi]

Caster beat me to it.I had an armalite ar10 and traded it off.Ipicked up a fnar and couldn't be happier.

[midtennchip]

I picked up an FNAR in December and it is a great rifle. Very accurate (at least 1 MOA or better) and functions very well in rapid fire drills I've done. Only real downside for me is the cost of magazines. Luckily, I got 4 mags in the purchase of the rifle.

[atlas3025]

What would you consider to be a good AR10 with the price range of around $1000? Links would be welcome, thank you for the imput and information.

I have seen DPMS AR-10's and RRA AR-10's at the local shows for right around $1000. I believe both guns to be quality pieces from what I have read, but I have heard more good about teh DPMS. I was about to buy one when I got the SCAR bug.

http://www.impactguns.com/dpms-panther-lr-308-classic-rflr-c-884451000167.aspx --This is the full sized DPMS, but I have seen the carbine models for about the same price.

[jcoosi]

scar is nice but they are expensive

[Guest Shep Stoner308]

I appreciate all the help with this and words of wisdom, I have alot to think about that is obvious. It also would help me if I had a chance to range shoot a few of the ones that I have zeroed in on. Currently live about an hour north of Chattanooga, maybe I can talk with some local gun shops about making this happen. Thanks Again for all the help!

PS if anyone has a broken in DPMS AR10 for a person to person sale please don't hesitate do send me a personal message about it.